|This account is a list of
stories and speculation about Thomas Vines b. about 1778 in Nth Carolina,
who in family legends has been associated with the name of Lipps or a variant.
It was assembled by Joe Vines of Arkansas, June 2003.
Here are the stories as they were told to me about how Thomas Vines b.1778 North Carolina (my 4th great-grandfather) was supposed to have been Thomas Lipsey, Lipseig, Lipzeig, Lipshitz, Lipps or some variation thereof.
Story #1... My grandmother Alice Vines widow of Josiah Vines from Russellville, AR told me many years ago before she died that our names should have been Lipsey. That a man named Lipsey had been killed in the Revolutionary War and that his wife remarried to a man named Vines and the kids she had by her first marriage took on the Vines name.
Story #2... Richard Vines of Nashville, TN, told a similar story except that the man was hung on the court house square by the Tories for being loyal to the Colonists cause and allowing them to meet in his home. That his wife and young Thomas actually saw the hanging at the town square. Then the wife remarried a man named Vines and that Thomas then took the Vines name.
Story #3... Told to me by Norma Vines of Birmingham, AL that her husband's family passed down a story that a Jewish family named Lipseig, Lipzeig, or some variant thereof, with 2 sons was traveling to America by boat and that both the mother and father took sick and died during the trip over. The two boys were adopted by a Vines family and the boys took the Vines name.
An interesting twist to story
Story #4... Ed Vines of California who is participating with us in this Vines DNA study tells that his father told them their names should have actually been Lipshitz (thank goodness we did not get hung with that tag to go through life with). I'm not sure if there was a story explaining how we were supposed to have gotten this name or not.
Story #5... Several years
back when I was heavy into genealogy and trying my hardest to determine
who Thomas Vines father was, I came across a lady in California also studying
the Vines of Alabama. I shared with her my grandmother's story about Thomas
Vines name having possibly been Lipsey. She started doing research and
found some things I had crossed previously and not thought much about and
then she found more things that started making her theory more credible.
First, there was a Sarah Vines marrying a Thomas Lipps in North Carolina
in 1780 (?). She shows up in the 1790 North Carolina census as Sarah Vines
with 3 boys who were right for Thomas Vines age. The lady from California
also found Sarah Vines living near a Lipps family. A Dawson Sewell was
bondman to her marriage to Thomas Lipps and was also married to Thomas
Lipps sister Mary.
I sure wish we could find
a male descendant of Johan Lipps and get him to take the DNA test to see
if his DNA matches those of us that descend from Thomas Vines. That might
explain why Ed's and my DNA do not match with those here in the DNA test
from UK and Australia. We also need a couple to test that come from the
line of Joe Vines b. 1790 who the book "TOADVINE IN IT'S HEYDAY" by Simon
Smith, says is a cousin to Thomas.
If anyone has other stories about Thomas Vines name that have been passed down through their families we would sure appreciate you sharing them with us as it might give us a clue that could lead us to the true facts about who Thomas Vines father really was.
In less conservative, hopefull and totally optimistic terms, "YIPPEE, another brickwall busted!" Congratulations to Joe Vines for his genealogical persistence and determination.
It would seem now that these
three tests have solved family origin problems for many of the Vines families
of Alabama and other southern states of US, who have documentary evidence
of descent from Thomas Vines, son of Sarah Lips, born about 1778 in North
Carolina. To trace their family further back in Europe they must now look
into the Lipps and similar family names in Germany and other countries.