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VINES RESEARCH HALF YEAR PROGRESS July 2004

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~vinesfamhist/index.html

1   Transcription of all easily accessible wills of Vines in the Wiltshire area was completed. There are now 38 shown on the website, all on one page in chronological order. They extend from the1639 will of Thomas Vines the weaver of Tockenham to many in the mid 1800s. Most were bought and downloaded on the web in a few minutes as digital copies of the originals. Much reliable information about names of family members was derived or confirmed. Wills.

Some puzzles were solved, involving forename repetition between family branches: for instance it is now thought most likely that Margaret Vines, who married James, the son of Edward1725, was the daughter of Charles1722 Vines rather than his brother Peter1724. Similarly the confusion about the Benjamins born in 1769 and 1783, their dates of death and their wives names has been resolved.

Repetition of the forenames between family branches, especially “Daniel”, “John”, and “Thomas” cloud the records of the 1600s.

2   The lineage of the West Australian branch founded by Dr Frederick Castell Vines, was proved through the wills, to come from Charles1722 through his son Joshua1761. Frederick married Emily Bussell for whose family the town of Bussellton is named. He died at sea 1868 while returning from a visit to England with his young family.

Dr Edward Prince Vines, his brother, practised medicine for many years in Tasmania. Soon after moving to Marble Bar as Government Medical Officer in 1899 he was speared by the aborigines at Braeside Station, near the edge of the Great Sandy Desert in north west of West Australia. Another brother Dr Henry Jeckell Kendrick Vines was Government Medical Officer at Broome, a pearling centre in the northwest 1898 to 1900 before returning to England. All three doctors were sons of Charles1810, a surgeon in Reading Berks.

3   A DNA test on Paul in Sydney matched with Fred (also in Oz who descended from Edward1725.) Paul is traced back to Dr Henry Jeckell Kendrick Vines and so to Joshua1761, a son of Charles1722 (Edwards brother) who succeeded his father Benjamin as the yeoman farmer of Vines Farm at Grittenham. This defines these branches as having a common ancestor in Benjamin1689.

Ron in Melbourne, also a match from a test last year, is documented to be descended from Daniel born about 1690, probably Benjamin’s brother (from wills), making John Vines of Grittenham (born about 1660) the common ancestor of them all.

No new information has been revealed on the two Vine cousins Arthur W. and Frank. Their documentation originated their relationship from Charles Vine in 1789; it now appears likely that they connect into the Grittenham lineage in the branches sired by John~1660 or his Vines grandsons born before 1770.

The present situation on DNA testing is summarised below.

4   It is possible that the Grittenham Vines family’s identical genetics, does extend back before John~1660 and perhaps there are earlier branches. The DNA signature is nominated in the Vines surname as Wilts1 and is grouped into the rather rare “O” category or haplogroup. This seems to be  commonest in East Asia, though too little is known yet about its occurrence to allow making migration theories.

5   We now have the first participant from a line of Vines from the East Midlands area of England: Tony whose forebears came from Leicestershire. From the 1881 census there is a cluster of Vines in Notts, Lincolnshire, Leicestershire, Northants and Norfolk. Tony does not match with the Wilts line and his DNA will define the first line of Vines in the East Midlands counties. There may be others but it is thought that all will be associated in some way.

Tony’s DNA falls into the R1b haplogroup, the commonest in England and western Europe. Much research work is underway to denominate the subgroups of R1b involved in the various migratory movements into England in historical time.

6   During this last 6 months the will of Katherine Adderley Vynes of Leicestershire, the widow of Reverend Richard Vines (~1600-1656) was read for evidence of his family. No sons were mentioned and a son-in-law was appointed executor to the will. This probably puts an end to any Vines claims of descent from the famed Richard, who was one of those involved in the Westminster Assembly of Divines 1643 to define the beliefs and governance of the reformed church in England.

7   As there were several Vines living in London in the 1660s (one an official of the exchequers department, or treasury), mentioned in Samuel Pepys Diary, it is hoped to find a descendant for a DNA test to define the London line.

8   A DNA test on Bill W of Georgia US started another genetic line of Vines, again in the R1b signature group.

9  Considerable work was done to find an acceptable way of graphically presenting the genealogy of the Wiltshire Vines. As an interim measure it was decided to manually show family trees with the MS EXCEL program. This will give separate trees for each branch, sequentially linked, with information on each person in hidden boxes which pop-up as the cursor is passed over the names. Click here.
 

                                                             
See also mismatch table  
       
NOTE 1       D Y S #   C  
      O  
      3 3 3 3 3 3 4 3 4 3 3 3 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 U  
      9 9 9 9 8 8 2 8 3 8 9 8 5 5 5 5 5 4 3 4 4 6 6 6 6 N  
      3 0 4 1 5 5 6 8 9 9 2 9 8 9 9 5 4 7 7 8 9 4 4 4 4 T  
    VINES Haplo-       R  
Kit No   Name group   19   a b   1   2   a b   a b c d Y  
Note2   Wilts1  
7356   Fred R O 14 23 14 11 11 13 11 12 10 14 14 30 17 9 9 11 12 25 14 19 29 14 14 14 14 OZ  
8190   Ron - 14 23 14 11 11 13 11 12 10 14 14 30 17 9 9 11 12 25 14 19 29 14 14 14 14 OZ  
20768   Paul B - 14 23 14 11 11 13 11 12 10 14 14 30 17 9 9 11 12 25 14 19 30 14 14 14 14 OZ  
8108   Arthur W Vine - 14 23 14 11 11 13 11 12 10 14 14 30 17 9 9 11 12 25 14 19 29 14 14 14 14 UK  
8109   Francis S Vine - 14 23 14 11 11 13 11 12 10 14 14 30 17 9 9 11 12 25 14 19 29 14 14 14 14 UK  
  Samuel L Mingia - 14 23 14 11 11 13 11 12 10 14 14 30 17 9 9 11 12 25 14 19 29 14 14 14 14 US  
     
Note3   Vines/ Lipps  
7808   Joe R1b 13 24 14 11 11 11 12 12 11 13 13 30 16 9 10 11 11 25 15 19 31 16 16 17 17 US  
9405   Edward L R1b 13 24 14 11 11 11 12 12 11 13 13 30 16 9 10 11 11 25 15 19 30 16 16 17 17 US  
11070   Roger Lipps R1b 13 24 14 11 11 11 12 12 11 13 13 30 16 9 10 11 11 25 14 19 30 16 16 17 17 US  
 
  Unmatched  
Note4   Leics1  
20818   Tony R R1b 13 25 14 11 11 13 12 12 12 13 14 29 16 9 10 11 11 25 15 18 31 15 16 16 17 UK  
  Ga1  
20811   Bill W R1b 14 24 14 11 10 14 12 12 12 13 13 29 17 9 10 11 11 25 15 19 29 15 15 16 17 US  
  La1  
7506   Tim W R1b 13 23 14 11 11 14 12 12 11 13 13 28  
   
 

Note 1
1  This chart shows DNA test values of number of base repeats at various markers.
2  The cell background colour is white if the respective values match the median values for the first two families. Coloured backgrounds indicate a mutation.
     White background for the median.
     Pale Green for difference of 1 from the median.
3  All surnames are "Vines" unless otherwise shown.
4  Tests which match at 23, 24 or all 25 markers are considered to prove relationship from a common ancestor. Matches at 11 and 12 of the first 12 markers are considered to warrant further testing to 25 markers, but otherwise the results are considered to indicate non-relationship within genealogical time, ie since surnames were commenced about AD1100.

Note 2
This family is well documented from John and Christian Vines of Grittenham near Brinkworth, Wiltshire. They left wills in 1713 and 1725; John was born about 1660.
Only one test shows a mutation: for Paul who is descended on a branch from Joshua1761. All are now proved to be descendants of John Vines and wife Christian of Vines Farm, Grittenham, near Swindon in northern Wiltshire

Note that to the present no evidence has been found to support the suspicion that Sam Mingia, of North Carolina, has a common ancestor in the Wilts1 Family, but the two family surnames were in adjacent counties of NC in the 1880 census. This needs to be investigated further by DNA tests on Vines with documentation from this region.

The Haplogroup estimated for Fred, based on the Y STR tests, was "N", commonest in Finland and northern Russia and Siberia, but this has since been revised by SNP test to "O", which can now be taken for all these participants without further testing.
The source of Haplogroup "O" is in Asia but little is known about its occurrence at present. Its appearance in Wiltshire since at least the mid 1600s is mysterious. It is not common in England.

Note3
Joe and Ed Vines of US proved a family legend that they descended from a German immigrant named Lipps, whose widow married a Vines in Nth Carolina about 1780, with name change for her children. Their DNA tests matched Roger Lipps who descended also from the same ancestor without a family name change.

The 3 tests for Vines/Lipps are compared to the median value at each marker and prove a  relationship through a common ancestor before 1780. Note the 2 mutations, the one at marker 449 having obviously occurred during or since the divergence of Joe's branch. The other, at marker 437, 14 for Roger Lipps could have been the original in the Lipps line with a divergence to 15 in the later Vines births, but this is not definite.

     Johannes Lips c1730
  __________|__________
  |                                        |
      John L c1754                       Thomas V c1778
                  |__                        ______|________
                  |                            |                            |
Y Chromosome Testee            Roger L                Joe V                       Ed V
 All markers matched except DYS437 =   14                                 =15                                 =15
                                        and DYS449 =   30                                 =31                                 =30
                                                                                              Toadvine1b               Toadvine1a

Note 4
Tim, Bill and Tony were compared to the median of their results, but do not match well enough  (or to the Lipps/Vines family) to be closely related to each other in genealogical time. All were in the R1b group which is common in England and Western Europe.