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Hubner

John Frederick Hubner was my great great grandfather and I have very little information about him. I first found a mention of him in the IGI and discovered that his wife's name was Sophia and that they had 9 daughters, one of whom was my mother's grandmother Emily. I also found Sophia's baptism details in the IGI and knew that her parents' names were William Paddon and Lydia Hasler. I received details of Sophia's parents' marriage from the Guildhall in London - William Paddon married Lydia Hasler 23rd September 1804 at London St.Alban Wood Street.

I did find John Frederick living at 3 Great Mitchell Street, St.Lukes with seven of his daughters in the 1851 census, his occupation was given as bootmaker. and it gave his birth year as 1801 and birthplace Belfast. I have investigated various Irish records but have found no mention of Hubners, so I am inclined to think that perhaps the family were en route when their son was born. I eventually found John Frederick and Sophia in the 1871 census (their surname was given as Waborn!) living at 23 Helmet Row, St.Lukes. John's birthplace is given as Liverpool. The Guildhall Library sent me details of John Frederick's marriage to Sophia Paddon in 1825 at London, St.Giles Cripplegate but unfortunately there was no additional information in the parish records - I was hoping to find a father's name.

John Frederick died on 1st November 1873, aged 72, at 23 Helmet Row, St.Luke. He had had paralysis for 2 years and vital exhaustion. His wife Sophia registered the death. In the 1881 census, Sophia is still living at 23 Helmet Row with her daughter Helena. She died in 1890 at the age of 86. Both John and Sophia are buried at Abney Park Cemetery in common graves.

Having discovered the names of John and Sophia's daughters, I then spent time going through the Births, Marriages and Deaths to find more details and also the census records. I have found the following information to date

Sophia Matilda Hubner was baptised on 24th September 1826 at Finsbury St.Luke Old Street. She married George Norton on 18th September 1854 at the Parish Church Islington. Witnesses were P.Newley and C.Edinburgh. George's occupation was bonnet blocker and his father's name was Joseph, occupation sawyer. The address of Sophia and George was 11 Grace Street. (Bonnet blocker - someone who made wooden blocks used in the hat trade)

In 1861 Sophia is widowed and living at 29 Rushton Street, Shoreditch with 3 children, George aged 10, James aged 7 and Sophia E aged 11 months. They were all born in Shoreditch. Her sister Ann is living there with her 4 children.

In the 1871 census Sophia aged 44 is still living at 29 Rushton Street, Shoreditch. Her occupation is ? flower maker. Her son George is aged 20 a hatters warehouseman, James is aged 17 a porter, Eugenie is aged 10 and Alfred is aged 7. In the 1901 census Sophia is living at 33 Shardeloes Road, St.Paul, Deptford. She is aged 74, living on her own means. Her son Alfred is aged 37, a foreman tie cutter and there is another daughter Alice aged 36 a tie maker. Her niece Honor S Day aged 10 and Laura Hammond aged 21 a servant are also there.

Elizabeth Ann Hubner was baptised on 14th August 1831 at Shoreditch. Elizabeth gave birth to an illegitimate son Frederick Edward William Hubner on 31st December 1847 at 3 Mitchell Street, City Road, St. Lukes. She married Edward Gwynne Williams on 20th April 1851 at the Parish Church St.Lukes. Witnesses were John Frederick Hubner and Eleanor Gwynne Williams. The address for bride and groom was 3 Mitchell St. Edward's occupation was musical instrument maker and his father's name was also Edward Gwynne and his occupation also musical instrument maker.

Ann Eliza Hubner was baptised on 14th August 1831 at Shoreditch. I found her marriage details on the IGI - she married David John Brand on 31st March 1850 at London St.Martin Outwich. In the 1861 census Ann and David are living at 4 Bridgewater Square with their 3 children Eliza aged 10, Frederick aged 7 and Arthur aged 3. David is a book binder and Ann is a book folder.

In 1871 Ann is widowed and living at 29 Rushton Street, Shoreditch with her sister Sophia. Ann's daughter Eliza is there, an envelope folder, son Frederick, a card box maker, Alfred aged 12 and Alice aged 3. In the 1881 census, Ann is living alone at 5 Clarks Buildings, St.Giles in Fields, London, Middlesex. Her occupation is given as tailoress.

Emily Hubner was born about 11th November 1833 at 4 Bridgwater Square, Shoreditch St.Leonards. She married James William Maund Sidey on 24th July 1859.

Lydia Sarah Hubner was baptised on 4th April 1836 at Shoreditch St.Leonards. She married James Jackson at St.Pauls Islington on 30th September 1866. Witnesses were William Payne and Sarah Turner. James' occupation was given as publican. The address of bride and groom was 5 Devonshire Place, Green Lanes. James' father was Samuel Jackson, occupation silversmith.

In 1871 Lydia and James are living at 8 Canonbury Cottages(?) with James' parents Samuel and Ann, and his brother Alfred aged 23 and sister Ann aged 21. Samuel, James and Alfred are all silver watch case makers.

I found Lydia and James on the 1881 census living alone at 4a Witchampton Street, Shoreditch. James' occupation is given as silversmith. Lydia died in 1901, at the age of 65, and is buried in Abney Park Cemetery.

Martha Hubner was born in 1839 and baptised on 14th June 1840 at London St.Ann. I found her marriage details on the IGI. She married George Day on 8th April 1860 and had two children George (born 1861) and Martha (born 1864).

I found the family in 1861 living in Tower Hamlets. George was aged 22 and a wood ? cutter. He was born in Norfolk Brize (?) Norton.

I found Martha again in the 1871 census (presumably widowed) living with her son George as lodgers in her parents' home. Her daughter Martha aged 7 is visiting the house of her aunt Sarah. Martha senior later married Charles Newton on 31st December 1871 at St.Giles Cripplegate. I found the family in the 1881 census living at 64 Bevenden Street, Shoreditch. Charles was aged 45, a wood type cutter and Martha an artificial flower maker. George Day (aged 20) was also a wood type cutter and Martha Day (aged 17) an envelope maker, Charles Richard Newton (aged 18) a dairyman, Emily Mary Newton (aged 16) a neck tie maker, Beatrice Sophia Newton (aged 8), Christine Louisa Newton (aged 6), Harry Newton (aged 3), and Maud Alice Newton (aged 1). Presumably Charles and Emily are Martha's stepchildren.

Phoebe Jane Hubner, born 1841 and baptised 29th April 1849 at Finsbury St.Luke Old Street. I found her marriage details in the IGI. She married Thomas Westbury on 7th October 1866 at St.John the Baptist, Shoreditch.

I found the family in the 1881 census living at 295 Old Street, Shoreditch. Thomas is aged 35, a commercial clerk and Phoebe is aged 39. They have 5 children living with them Thomas H. (age 14) also a commercial clerk, Alexander (aged 9), Florence (aged 7), Alice (aged 4) and Horace (aged 2).

In 1891 Phoebe is widowed and living at 200 Fairbridge Road, Islington. Alexander is aged 19, a stores warehouseman, Florence and Alice are both tie makers and Horace is a scholar. There is now another son Herbert aged 10.

I found the family in the 1901 census living at 326 Acton Lane, Acton, Middlesex. Phoebe is aged 59, Alice is aged 24, Horace aged 21, an omnibus conductor, Herbert aged 19, an assistant Italian warehouse.

I found Horace in 1911 living at 12 Westbury Road, Harrow Road, Paddington. He is a handyman aged 31. His wife is Lilian Fuller aged 25 and they have 2 sons Norman aged 5 and Bernard aged, also a daughter Doris aged 1. Horace's sister Alice, aged 34 and a clerk, is also staying at the house.

Hector is also in the 1911 census a shop assistant living at 9 Upper Baker Street, Clerkenwell. His wife is Matilda Green aged 31 born in Colne, Essex. There are 3 children, Arthur H aged 7 born in Lambeth, Alice L aged 6 born in Marylebone and Winnie E aged 4 born in Leyton, Essex.

Sarah Ann Hubner, born 1844 and baptised 12th April 1857 at Finsbury St.Thomas. She married Thomas Parkins on 12th December 1864 at St.Lukes Church St.Lukes. His occupation was given as stationer. Witnesses were Frederick Hubner (possibly Elizabeth's illegitimate son) and Helena Alice Hubner (bride's sister).

In 1871 Sarah is living with her in-laws at14 Coleman Street. She is aged 26 and a housekeeper. Her father-in-law James Parkins is aged 54 born in Bedfordshire and an ostler. His son James aged 24 is a brewer and his daughter Ann is aged 17 a ? stationer. A grandson John aged 5 is living with them, probably Sarah and Thomas' son. Martha Day aged 7 (niece to Sarah) is visiting the house.

I found the family on the 1881 census living with their son Thomas J.J. (age 15) at 10 Jasmine Villas, Edmonton, Middlesex. Thomas' occupation is manufacturing stationer and his son is a stationer's assistant.

I made contact with a gentleman who is descended from this line of the family. The Thomas James John Parkins above was his grandfather, and there was one other child Sarah Ann who only lived for 10 minutes. In his family there was a question mark for Cork as the birthplace of John Frederick Hubner. Unfortunately he didn't have any more information, but it was good to make contact nonetheless.

Helena Alice Hubner, born 1847 and baptised 29th April 1849 at Finsbury St.Luke Old Street. She didn't marry and I found her on the 1881 census living with her mother. She died in 1899, at the age of 52, and is buried in Abney Park Cemetery along with her parents.

I have discovered another Hubner family living in the same area at the same time, John Christian Hubner, wife Elizabeth Ann and children John Christian (born 1827), Henry (born 1828), Emily (born 1831) and William (born 1835). I have a marriage certificate for Emily who married Charles Ansell on 13th February 1853. Her father John Christian's occupation is vellum binder. The groom's occupation was bootmaker and his father Norman's occupation was also bootmaker - (my John Frederick Hubner was also a bootmaker). The address of bride and groom was 2 White Rose Court, witnesses were Henry Hubner and Ann Hubner. I haven't found the connection yet between the two families, but I'm sure there is one.

My sister remembers my aunt talking about a German baron in the family and also a Kitty Hubner who had twin brothers. According to my Aunt Amy, the brothers argued over the inheritance and the deeds were thrown on the fire. This sounded very far-fetched but when I checked the 1881 census, I found a Kate Hubner living at 19 Back of Doe Street, Birmingham with her parents and her 4 brothers. Two of the brothers happened to be twins - quite a coincidence!

Frederick Hubner (aged 50), was born in Huntingdon, occupation general labourer. His wife Ann (nee Maguire) was aged 51 and born in Manchester. In the 1861 census the family is living at 133 Novascotia Street, Birmingham. Frederick' is a farm labourer and Ann's birthplace is given as Ireland.

In 1861 there are 6 children, Elizabeth born 1849 in Brighton, Fred aged 10 born in Bury, Lancashire, Alfred aged 8 born in Bewdley, Worcestershire, James aged 5 and twins John and Charles aged 2 months all born in Birmingham.

In the 1871 census Ann's birthplace is given as Ireland. They had 7 children at this time and are living in Bartholomew Street, Birmingham. Frederick's occupation is labourer. His sons Frederick and Alfred are both chandelier burnishers. Next door Richard Brown a brass caster born in St.Helens and aged 24 is living with his wife Elizabeth, who is Frederick and Ann's married daughter.

In 1881 some of the family are living at 19 Back of Doe Street, Birmingham.

Father Frederick was a general labourer and Ann's birthplace was given as Manchester. Their son Frederick was aged 29, birthplace Burnley. His occupation was chandelier burnisher (lamp mks). Charles is aged 36 and a bicycle filer. James, occupation general labourer, was aged 24 born in Birmingham. John, occupation cock fitter brass, was aged 21 also born in Birmingham (he died in 1893). Charles, occupation lamp maker, was John's twin brother. Kate was aged 15, born Birmingham. She married Albert Yerrington in 1890.

There were 3 other people living in the house at the time, William Stiff, aged 2 a visitor. Also their married daughter Elizabeth A.Brown a lodger aged 31, occupation thimble maker and her daughter Ann Celina Brown aged 7.

I found another daughter Jane Hubner (actually Mary Jane) in the 1871 census living in a caravan in Ashton under Lyme with her aunt Elizabeth and her husband Henry Francis. There is a son Henry aged 4 months. Henry is a showman. In 1881 they are living at Caravan Canterbury (?) in Blackburn, Lancashire. Jane is aged 17, occupation show traveller performer. Elizabeth and Henry Francis are there, both show travelller performers, but no son. Elizabeth was aged 44 and born in Huntingdon, presumably a sister to Frederick Hubner. On her marriage certificate in 1854, Elizabeth is aged 19 living in Hanley. Her father is Frederick Hubner a servant. Henry was aged 22, a labourer also living in Hanley. His father George was a gardener. Witnesses at the wedding were Jane Simpson and John ?.

In 1881 Alfred is living at No.8 and 9 Westley Street, Aston, Warwick with his wife Selina and their 2 children Florence, aged 6 and William aged 2. aged 26, occupation chandelier maker born in Kidderminster, Worcester. Alfred and Selina married on 9th August 1874 in the parish of Christ Church, Warwick. At the time of his marriage Alfred was aged 21, occupation as before and Selina was 17, both previously unmarried. Place of residence was Broad Street. Alfred's father, Frederick was also a chandelier maker and Selina's father William Auden was a butcher.

In 1891 Alfred is aged 36 and living at Back Sherlock Street with his wife Selina aged 33. Alfred was a brass dresser born in Kidderminster and Selina was a tin plate solderer born in Birmingham. Their daughter Florence aged 16 was also a tin plate solderer born in Birmingham. Their son William (Alfred William) died in 1889 aged 10.

Alfred died in 1894 and Selina married again on 26th December 1895 at the same church as before - her husband was Samuel Parker, aged 22, a plate worker. Selina was described as a widow, aged 33. Both were resident at Broad Street. Samuel's father was Henry, an engine driver. Witnesses were Henry and Alice Parker.

I found Frederick and Ann in the 1891 census still at Back Doe Street. Fred aged 60 a bricklayer born in Huntingdon and his wife Ann aged 65 also born in Huntingdon. Also in the household Fred aged 39, a metal burnisher, John and Charles aged 30 both brass filers, Kate aged 25 - all born in Birmingham. Another child Amy aged 10, not sure who she belongs to. Albert Yerrington aged 8 months a boarder is also in the house.

Also in 1891 James is aged 32 a safe maker born in Birmingham. His wife Elizabeth aged 35, a thimble maker, also born in Birmingham. There are two children both born in Birmingham - Kate aged 6 and Elizabeth aged 4.

In the 1901 census, Frederick junior is living at 4 Court 8 Ho (?) Doe Street, Birmingham with his brother Charles. Both are unmarried and Frederick is aged 52 same occupation as previously. James is living at 7 London Terrace Willis Street, Aston. He is aged 41 a cycle maker. His wife Elizabeth is aged 44. They have three daughters, Kate aged 16 a French polisher, Lizzie, aged 14 and Annie aged 8.

This is some additional information I have on Hubners living in the Huntingdon area

Ernest Hubner was born about 1761 and married Elizabeth Ford on 29th December 1789 in London. He is mentioned in a list of someone else's debts and was an inn holder in Huntingdon. He was buried at All Saints, Hunts on 17th February 1823, aged 62.

Elizabeth Catherine Hubner their daughter was born in 1789. There is a marriage entry for Elizabeth who married George Revenscroft of Swinfenhall, Staffs in the parish of Huntingdon All Saints and St.Johns in 1806.

There is also a Frederick Hubner who married Susan Fowler in 1820 at All Saints, Hunts. Susan Fowler came from Biggleswade, Beds, witnesses to the marriage were Isabella Ravencroft and Joseph Ward. He could be a brother to Elizabeth Catherine and the son of Ernest and Elizabeth.

I have found a Frederick Hubner in the 1871 census, who is a widower aged 68 living as a lodger at the Ship and Chequers Inn in Huntingdon. He is described as a traveller and his birthplace was Ghent in Belgium. He died in September quarter 1874 in Cambridge. He could be the same Frederick who married Susan Fowler and could be the father of Frederick and Elizabeth. He could also be a brother to my John Frederick - lots of unknowns here.

There is a baptism of Elizabeth Hubner on 21st March 1831 at St.Marys and St.Benedicts. She is the daughter of Frederick and Susan. This Elizabeth is possibly the same person who married Henry Francis mentioned above. This would make the Frederick Hubner who married Ann Maguire the son of Frederick and Susan.

A few more Hubner entries were found in the parish records

Augustus Hubner aged 5 days was buried on 9th December 1828 at All Saints Hunts. Augustus Frederick Hubner aged 4 years was buried on 18th April 1827, also Emma Hubner no age given buried on 11th February 1834, both at St.Marys Hunts.

The only other reference I have to the Huntingdon Hubners is from Hunts County Records Office who sent me the following information on a Frederick Hubner, who was a witness to a robbery in 1835

It seems that Fredrick Hubner was working in the liquor shop owned by the George Hotel, Huntingdon. His examination states that he was living in the parish of Huntingdon All Saints, his age was not recorded. Frederick describes how Daniel White and the victim William Hopkins were present in the liquor shop where he worked. It appears that on leaving this shop, Daniel White snatched a purse from William Hopkins.

I still need to find a definite link between the Birmingham/Huntingdon Hubners and my London family.

A Sidey relative told Rosemary Fincher in a letter "I remember my husband (my Uncle Charlie) speaking of two boys - one a fancy dresser - staying at Pyrmont Road - she thought the name was Huberon (possibly Hubner?). There were grand parties, people dressing up and they used to play concertinas." Could these boys have been from this Birmingham family?

As John Frederick Hubner's birthplace was given as Liverpool in the 1871 census, I have looked for more Liverpool Hubners and found the following

Frederick Hubner born about 1816 in Germany married to Augusta born about 1820. They had two children Arthur Manard born 1859 and Marguerete (Margaret, Marguerite) born 1861. A grandson Leon also lived with the family, born 1880 in Southport, Leeds. In 1881 they were living at 24 Bailey Street, Liverpool and in 1891 they are living in Leeds. In 1886 Marguerite married Sam Baistow in Birkenhead and in 1901 they are living in Kirkdale, Lancashire. Sam was born in 1859 in Bradford, Yorkshire and is a butcher. They have 2 children May aged 8 and Frederick aged 6 both born in Liverpool. Leon Hubner is now aged 21 and living with his aunt, his occupation is given as stage carpenter.

There is a Friedrich Hubner (born DEU American subject naturalised) married to Agnes Gordon (born in Scotland) in 1889 Toxteth Park. In 1891 they are living in Poulton with Seacombe, Cheshire. In 1901 they have one daughter aged 9 months and they are living in Holy Rood, Southampton.

I have found some details of a Graf von Hübner which came from the Cambridge University Library

Josef Alexander, Graf von Hübner (1811-1892), Austrian statesman and diplomat, was born and died in Vienna, but held various overseas postings. Brought up as the pet and pupil of Metternich he had been behind the scenes of European diplomacy and politics for 50 years and had spent his leisure in travelling through all the ordinary countries and going round the world. He wrote a number of books about his life and travels, one of which was "Spaziergang um der Welt" 1874. This was translated into English by Lady Herbert as

"A ramble round the world", published in London in 2 volumes in 1874.

One or two of his other books were translated into French.

The dates fit as the twins John and Charles Hubner were both alive when Graf von Hubner died in 1892. However I had some research done by an Austrian researcher recently and she discovered that the Graf married Maria von Pilat (1810-1844) in Vienna in April 1834. They had 5 children - Raphael Ernst Ignaz, born 23rd October 1838, Alexander Karl Joseph, born 14th December 1839 - died 1906, Melanie Elisabeth, born 10th December 1834. Elisabeth Marie Frazisca, born 29th March 1837 and Eleonore Alfonsine Hermine, born 13th December 1840. She also found out that the Graf was given his title in 1888 and that the title would have been passed on to his children - both girls and boys. The girls would have lost the title if they married a commoner.

So it seems very unlikely that the humble Birmingham Hubners would have stood any chance of inheriting the title.

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