"Carl/Charles" Schnake
Carl/Charles Schnake came to the US with sons Frederick and Casper Henry and settled in Cass County, Illinois. Family records indicate he came here from Halstern-Mennighufen, Prussia. I believe the following documentation will conclusively link Carl/Charles Schnake with Carl Friedrich Wilhelm Schnake, born 7 Jan 1809, at Schnathorst #4, near the city of Minden, which today is in the German state of Nordrhein-Westfalen (North Rhine-Westphalia) The table below shows my comparison of the records:
Table of Comparisons - American and German records
American Records--Carl/Charles Schnake |
German Records--Carl Friedrich Wilhelm Schnake |
| Birth: Carl/Charles died Apr 13 1857, 60 years old; (thus born 1796 aft Apr 13 or 1797 bef Apr 13.) Source: Records of St. Peters Lutheran Church near Arenzville I can no longer locate the source who sent me this record. | Carl Friedrich Wilhelm Schnake, b. Schnathorst, 7 Jan, 1809 Source: Schnathorst (Germany) Parish Records. (Click for listing in Schnathorst database for specifics) |
| Comment: The above dates do not match; however, if Carl Charles was 60 when he died in 1857, then he would have been 41 when his oldest child (Frederick) was born. It was unusual in Germany to wait that long for a first marriage. Also, probate records indicate a child was born after his second marriage which was in 1855, at which time he would be over 58 years old. This is not impossible but unusual. For reasons shown below, I suspect an error in the St. Peters records or in the copying of those records. | |
| Carl/Charles Schnake named his oldest son Frederick
(Friedrich) and his second son Casper Henry.
Note in the German records >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> |
Carl Friedrich Wilhelm Schnake, b. Schnathorst, 7 Jan, 1809, married Anna Catherine Marie Roesch in 1837 [precise date not given], parents of groom Friedrich Wilhelm Schnake [listed in another place as Johann Friedrich Wilhelm Schnake], parents of bride CASPER HENRICH ROESCH and Anne Marie Ilsebein Bergmann. From Schnathorst parish records.. Click for listing in Scnathorst database for specifice. |
| Comment: Naming sons after grandparents was a custom in Germany as here. The name Casper is rarely found in any other branch of the Schnake family in Germany or here. This is strong evidence for a connection. | |
| Frederick Schnake (Carl Charles' eldest son) was born on March 18, 1838, in Halstern Mennighoffen, Germany...(Source: Beardstown, IL, newspaper obituary, info from Mel Schnake, Valdosta, GA) Less than a mile from Halstern is the smaller village of Haever, basically a suburb. | German source on Emigrants who left without permission shows: Schnake, Carl Fr. Ferdinand, birth date 15 03 1838 (that's 15 March in the European fashion), parents Carl Fr. W. Schnake/A. Cath. M. Boesch, from Haever, Kirchlengern parish.[1] Parish records of Schnathorst (Click) show that A. Cath. M. Roesch was from Haever. Parish records of Kirchlengern[2] show Carl Friedrich Ferdinand Schnake b. 15 March 1838, son of Carl Friedrich Wilhelm, who was living at that time "bei Nr. 1" in Haever. "Bei" indicates it was a Heuerlinghaus (hireling house), not the main house. This was also the residence given for the Roesch family in other records, with the status listed as "Heuerling", so Carl Friedrich Wilhelm moved in with his wife's parents before coming to the U.S. . |
| Comment: The above would appear to be without question an exact match. The slight difference in the date is a completely understandable error on one or the other record. I believe this firmly cements Carl Charles and Carl Friedrich Wilhelm as the same person, and Frederick and Carl Fr. Ferdinand as the same person. Haever was only a mile from Halstern. Mennighufen is a still larger town a bit further south. Note that Catherine Roesch is here cited as Cathering Boesch; another German source that I have also has Boesch. This is a mistake in copying. The Kirchlengern parish records are spelled either Roesch or Roisch (two different ministers). | |
| In conclusion--the evidence is overwhelming that Carl/Charles and Carl Friedrich Wilhelm were the same, and that his son Frederick and Carl Friedrich Ferdinand were the same. | |
Added comments and corrections:
Melvin Schnake says his family records show Carl/Charles emigrated from Germany with his wife and two sons. Melvin gives Catherine Liekmann as the name of his wife. Mel is a descendent of Frederick. Elizabeth Schnake, a descendent of Casper Henry, sent records collected by her grandmother Helen E. Schnake of Winchester, IL, showing a second marriage to a Catherine Tinkmann in 1855. Neither of these match the German records. The following clears up this problem:
Cass County, Illinois, Marriage Records 1837-1879, Compiled by Mrs. Edna Gorsage Renner and Mrs. Mary Ann bell, Edited by Keith Sanders, published by Cass County Historical Society, 1980 -- two Schnake marriages are shown:
Carl/Charles Schnake - Catherine Liekmann, 5 Sept. 1855, Cass County, IL
Casper Henry Schnake - Elisabeth Thron, 19 Oct 1871
This record shows that the name was Liekmann, not Tinkmann, and that he married her here, as a second marriage. This clears away another apparent contradiction.
Tinkmann is not a German surname as far as I can find by an Internet search. Tinkman (one "n") appears to be English.
Also note the way it is printed: Carl/Charles This is evidence that "Carl Charles" probably did not use both names at the same time but used them alternately. (Carl and Charles are the same name, in German and English respectively)
Other records:
Also, I came up with a Schnake, Chs, in New Orleans passenger lists for 1848, close enough to the date for Carl/Charles (1850) to be a probable. 1850 could be the date he came to Cass County, IL. This was on a commercial site which was touted in a genealogy newsletter that I get. It allows you to search for your family member before you buy their disks of info. You could go to that site and purchase the CD ROM of ship records if you are interested. It also gives us something else to put down for future research. the URL: http://www.familyinfo.com
Here are the records sent to me by Mel Schnake, a professor at Valdosta University, Valdosta, Georgia, and a descendent of Caspar Henry Schnake:
Roy, I have a few minutes tonight, so I thought I would email you some of the information I have. It is gleaned from family records, word of mouth, a few documents of various types and newspapers. It is not organized, so there is no particular order to the info. below...
From the Beardstown, Illinois Newspaper (I think it's called the Star)... Frederick Schnake, one of Beardstown's oldest residents, died here last night following an illness of a little over two months. Frederick Schnake was born on March 18th, 1838 in Halstern Minnighoffen, Germany and died Wednesday, June 3, 1931 after several weeks lingering illness at the age of 93 years, 2 months, and 16 days. He emigrated to this country in the year 1849 with his parents at the age of 11 years. They settled on a farm near Arenzville. He was united in Holy Matrimony to Miss Louis Raker in the year of 1858. She died in 1909. There were nine children. John, who died in infancy; H.W., who died on June 13, 1927; Minnie, who also died in infancy; Mrs. F.K. dufelmeier, who died in 1921; Charles of Meredosia, IL; Elizabeth, who died on July 29, 1907; William of Lodi, California; Louis, of Arenzville, IL; and C.F. of Woodbridge, California.
************************************** From my family records (family Bibles, word of mouth, History of Cass County, IL...
Carl Charles Schnake. Born in Halstern, Minnighoffen, Prussia. Married Catherina (she adopted Catherine in the U.S.) Liekmann (died 1857). Came to America in 1849 with wife and sons Frederick and Casper; landed in New Orleans. Moved to St. Louis, MO. Then moved to Beardstown, IL. One son, Frederick Schnake, born in Prussia (3/18/1838), married Louisa Raker in 1858. Another son, Casper Henry Schnake (went by Henry) (no birth date available), married Elizabeth Thron (10/19/1871), she died 2/2/1895. Carl Charles Schnake died 4/13/1857.
Children of Frederick Schnake... Henry W. Schnake, born 7/11/1855, married Maria Pelker 3/20/1890, she died 5/1/1940 of cancer, he died 6/13/1927 of intestinal flu. John Frederick Schnake, born 3/11/1859, died 5/5/1864. Wilhelmina Sophia Schnake ("Minnie"), born 7/29/1862, died 10/21/1863. Frederick Wilhelm Schnake, born 7.3.1860. Carl Henry Schnake, born 10/10/1866. [Graves are located at the very top of the hill at Arenzville, IL Old German Cemetary]
Children of Henry William Schnake (and Maria Anna Elizabeth Pelker)... Frederick William Schnake, born 9/1/1891 (had 2 children Elma and Rudolf) Edwin John Schnake, born 5/19/1894 (my Grandfather). Married Nina Meier and had 4 children: Hazel Carrie (died in childbirth 8/14/1922), Earl (my Dad), Marvin, and Leland (Pete). Albert Henry Schnake Paul Herman Schnake Fred Schnake
Conclusion:
This anchors Carl/Charles firmly to the German Schnake line no. 4, the "Schnathorst No. 4" Schnakes. I can provide family group sheets and descendency charts showing the German Schnakes in this line. It also connects Carl/Charles as the uncle of Carl Friedrich Ferdinand Schnake, the Lutheran minister in eastern Missouri, whose record you can find elsewhere on SchnakeNet.
[1] Bertrage für Wesfaelischen Familienforschung (Contributions to the Westphalian Family History) Band (Volume) 47/48, "Heimliche Auswanderung" (secret emigrations).
Carl Fr. Ferdinand Schnake from Haever, Kirchlengern parish, * (born) 15
Mar 1838
Parents: Carl Fr. W. Schnake/A. Cath M. Boesch [note: Parish records
show Roesch]
Emigrated 1850 to America with the parents
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[2] Evangelixche Kirche Kirchlengern (KIr. Herford), Kirchenbuch, 1723-1940, FHL film# 0473684, Taufen (Baptisms) 1836-1887, entry # 22. Click here to go back to chart.
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