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Ancestors of Amy Russell Tolbert



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Rognwald of Jutland




Husband Rognwald of Jutland

           Born: Abt 790 - Jutland, Norway
     Christened: 
           Died: 850
         Buried: 


         Father: Oalf II "Geirstad-Alf: , King of Jutland, Vestfold & Ofse (Abt 0770-Abt 0840)
         Mother: 


       Marriage: 




Wife

           Born: 
     Christened: 
           Died: 
         Buried: 



Children
1 F Aseda of Jutland

           Born: Abt 812 - Maer, Nord-Trondelag, Norway
     Christened: 
           Died: 
         Buried: 
         Spouse: Eistan Glumra, Earl of More (Abt 0800-Abt 0830)




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Raoul III "The Great" Count Of Valois & Vexin and Anna (Agnesa) Yaroslavna of Kiev




Husband Raoul III "The Great" Count Of Valois & Vexin 1 2 3

            AKA: Raoul III "The Great" Count Of Valois & Vexin
           Born: Abt 1015 - Vexin, Seine Inferieure, Normandy, France 3
     Christened: 
           Died: 23 Feb 1074 - Peronne, Somme, Picardy, France 3
         Buried:  - Crepy, Artois/Pas-DE-Calais, France


         Father: Raoul II Comte D' Valois, & Crepy (Abt 0985-1060) 1 4 5
         Mother: Adele De Breteuil (0992-1051) 1 4 6


       Marriage: 1061 - 2ND Husband 3Rd Wife 7

   Other Spouse: Aelis (Adele) Comtesse De Bar-Sur-Aube (Abt 1019-1053) 1 8 - Bef 1041 - 4th Husband 1St Wife 7

   Other Spouse: Haquenez (Abt 1030-      ) 1 7 - After 1053 - 2ND Wife - Divorced 1060 7




Wife Anna (Agnesa) Yaroslavna of Kiev 1 9 10 11 12

           Born: Abt 1024 - Kiev, Ukraine 13
     Christened: 
           Died: After 1075 - France 12 14
         Buried:  - Villiers Abbey, La-Ferte-Alias, Essonne, Ile-DE-France, France


         Father: Jaroslaus I "The Wise" Polotsk, Grand Duke Of Kiev (Abt 0978-1054) 1 12 15 16
         Mother: Ingegard Olafsdottir (1001-1050) 1 12 16



   Other Spouse: Henry I Capet, King of France (1008-1060) 1 10 12 17 18 - 20 Jan 1051 - 3rd Wife 11 12



Children

General Notes: Husband - Raoul III "The Great" Count Of Valois & Vexin

Raoul, a descendent of Charlemagne, was Count of Valois, Vexin, and Crepy. To this he added Bar-sur-Aube by marrying the heiress, Aelis, Comtesse de Bar-sur-Aube, a widow. However, after sigining the marriage-contract but before the nuptials had taken place, the knights of the Chateau de Joigny passed her on to another nobleman. Raoul hurried back and captured the Chateau and his bride, locking her up in La Ferte-sur-Aube, long enough to assure himself she was not pregnant. Again in his absence, she was captured by a local squire but, after being rescued, the nuptials with Raoul took place and they became the parents of two sons and two, perhaps three, daughters.

After Aelis died, Raoul married a lady named Haquenez, but when the king died and his widow became available, Raoul dismissed Haquenez and married the queen-widow. At this, however, Haquenez complained to the pope of being "despoiled of everything by her husband; she had been dismissed on a false charge of fornication."

Raoul was excommunicated, not for adultery but for incest. 'Contrary to the law, he had lain with the wife of the dead king, who was his cousin." [Leo van de Pas]
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Ivo (Ives) De Taillebois, Earl Anjou/1St Baron Kend and Judith of Lens




Husband Ivo (Ives) De Taillebois, Earl Anjou/1St Baron Kend

           Born: Abt 1036 - Cristot, Calvados, Normandy, Fr
     Christened: 
           Died: 1094 - Kendal, Cambria, Eng
         Buried: 
            AFN: V9TX-XR
       Marriage: After 1076 - 2ND Husband




Wife Judith of Lens

           Born: 1054 - Lens, Normandy, France 19
     Christened: 
           Died: 1086 - Northumberland, Eng 20
         Buried: 


         Father: Lambert , Count of Lens (1022-1054) 21
         Mother: Adelaide (Adelis) of Normandy, Prss Normandy/Ctss Aumale (Abt 1025-Abt 1090) 21



   Other Spouse: Waltheof (Waldevus) II , Earl of Northumberland, Huntingdon & Northampton (1045-1076) - 1070 - Of Artois, France, France 20



Children
1 M Waldelf Tailboys

           Born:  - Hepple, Northumberland, Eng
     Christened: 
           Died: 1161
         Buried: 



2 M William De Taillebois

           Born: Abt 1077 - Lancaster, Lancashire, England
     Christened: 
           Died: 
         Buried: 




General Notes: Husband - Ivo (Ives) De Taillebois, Earl Anjou/1St Baron Kend

CONFLICT: Thomas Thomson Progenitor Circle by Rupert Farham Thompson, 1977, Sutro, CA (state s he is father of Lucy) Ancestral Roots of Sixty Colonists Who Came to New England betwee n 1623 and 1650, Frederick Lewis Weis, Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc., 1985 (states Lucy i s his widow) Ancestral File 4.10 (Edna Anderson show him as father of Lucy)Came with Willi am the Conqueror.Alternate name found in file: Ivo Tailboys

Came with William the Conqueror.

No source that I have gives parents for Ives/Ivo.
----------------------------------------------
The following concerns Ives origins in Normandy, prior to the conquest:

Taillebois.

Cristot: Calvados, arr. Caen, cant. Tily-sur-Seulles.

A note in the cartulary of La Trinite de Vendome mentions a copy of the grant of the church a nd patronage of Cristot by Ives Taillebois to the abbey. An account of Cristot is given in B eziers, "Diocese de Bayeux, vol ii, p. 192. [Origins of Some Anglo-Norman Families]

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General Notes: Wife - Judith of Lens

CONFLICT: Ancestral Roots of Sixty Colonists Who Came to New England between 1623 and 1650 , Frederick Lewis Weis, Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc., 1992 (FATHER maybe her mothers fir st husband [Enguerrand II, Count of Ponthieu]After the execution of Waltheof, Earl of Hunting don, King William offered Judith, his niece, the deceased earl's widow, in marriage to Simo n St. Liz, a noble Norman, but the lady peremptorily rejected the alliance, owing, Dugdale sa ys, to St. Liz's halting in one leg, which refusal so displeased the Conqueror that he immedi ately seized upon the castle and honour of Huntingdon, which the countess held in dower, expo sing herself and her dau. to a state of privation and obscurity in the Isle of Ely and othe r places, while he bestowed upon the said Simon St. Liz the town of Northampton and the whol e hundred of Falkeley, then valued at 40 per annum, to provide shoes for his horses. St. Li z thus diappointed in obtaining the hand of the Countess of Huntingdon, made his addresses wi th greater success to her elder dau., the Lady Maud, who became his wife, when William confer red upon the said Simon de St. Liz, the Earldoms of Huntingdon and Northampton. [Sir Bernar d Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited, and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 18 83, p. 467-8, St. Liz, Earls of Huntingdon]

NOTE: The parentage of Judith of Lens has come under critical study since the early 1970's, w hen Enguerrand II was thought by some to be her father. The currently acceptable parentage am ong most scholars is as stated, i.e., Lambert of Boulogne. [Roderick W. Stuart, Royalty for C ommoners, 3rd ed., Genealogical Publishing Company, Baltimore MD, 1998]

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Richard Woodville, 1st Earl Rivers and Jacquetta of Luxembourg




Husband Richard Woodville, 1st Earl Rivers

           Born: 1405 - Maidstone, , Kent, England
     Christened: 
           Died: 12 Aug 1469 - Kenilworth, Warwick, England
         Buried: 
       Marriage: 




Wife Jacquetta of Luxembourg

           Born: 1415
     Christened: 
           Died: 30 May 1472
         Buried: 



Children
1 F Elizabeth Woodville




           Born: Abt 1437 - Grafton Regis, Northamptonshire, England
     Christened: 
           Died: 8 Jun 1492 - Bermondsey, London, Middlesex, England
         Buried:  - St. George's Chapel, Windsor, Windsor, England
         Spouse: Edward IV , King of England (1442-1483)
           Marr: Abt 1 May 1464 - , Northamptonshire, England
         Spouse: John Grey, of Groby (Abt 1432-1461)
           Marr: Abt 1452




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Shoshenk III of Ma, King of Egypt and Es ankh Djed Bast of Memphis




Husband Shoshenk III of Ma, King of Egypt

           Born: Abt 855 B.C.
     Christened: 
           Died: Abt 783 B.C.
         Buried: 


         Father: Takelot II of Egypt (Abt 0875 B.C.-Abt 0825 B.C.)
         Mother: Karoma Mertmout II of Thebes (      -      )


       Marriage: 




Wife Es ankh Djed Bast of Memphis

           Born: 
     Christened: 
           Died: 
         Buried: 


         Father: Takelot "B" , High Priest of Ptah at Memphis (      -      )
         Mother: Es.ankh Djed.Bast (      -      )





Children
1 M Pimay King Of Egypt Usermare Setepenre , Great Chief of Ma

           Born: Abt 830 B.C.
     Christened: 
           Died: Abt 773 B.C.
         Buried: 




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Bishop Arnoald of Metz




Husband Bishop Arnoald of Metz

            AKA: Arnoldus, Arnual
           Born: Abt 560
     Christened: 
           Died: Abt 611
         Buried: 


         Father: Senator Ansbertus , Duke of Moselle (0535-0570)
         Mother: Blithilde , Princess of Paris (Abt 0530-Abt 0580)


       Marriage: Abt 584




Wife

           Born: 
     Christened: 
           Died: 
         Buried: 



Children
1 F Saint Dode of Heristal 22

            AKA: Oda
           Born: Abt 586 - Herstal, , Liège, Belgium
     Christened: 
           Died: After 612
         Buried: 
         Spouse: Arnoul de Heristal, Bishop of Metz (0582-0640) 22 23




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Count Liudolf Von Brunswick and Countess Gertrud of Nordgau




Husband Count Liudolf Von Brunswick

           Born: Abt 1016 - Brunswick, , Niedersachsen, Germany
     Christened: 
           Died: 23 Apr 1038
         Buried: 
       Marriage: 




Wife Countess Gertrud of Nordgau

           Born: Abt 1006 - Nordgau Region, Medieval States
     Christened: 
           Died: 21 Jul 1077
         Buried: 



Children
1 F Living (details have been suppressed)

           Born: 
     Christened: 
           Died: 
         Buried: 



2 M Living (details have been suppressed)

           Born: 
     Christened: 
           Died: 
         Buried: 




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Princess Emma of Normandy, of Normandy




Husband (details have been suppressed)

           Born: 
     Christened: 
           Died: 
         Buried: 
       Marriage: 




Wife Princess Emma of Normandy, of Normandy 1 24 25 26

           Born: Abt 982 - Rouen, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France
     Christened: 
           Died: 6 Mar 1052 - Winchester, Hampshire, England 27
         Buried:  - St Martin's Church, Winchester, Hampshire, England


         Father: Richard I "The Fearless" of Normandy, Duke of Normandy (0933-0996) 1 21 28 29 30 31
         Mother: Gunnor (Gundra\Gunnora) "Not" of Crepon (Abt 0942-1031) 1 21 32 33 34



   Other Spouse: King Ethelred II "The Unready" of England, King of England (Abt 0968-1016) 24

   Other Spouse: Canute II the Great , King of Denmark, Norway, and England (Abt 0994-1035) 21



Children

General Notes: Wife - Princess Emma of Normandy, of Normandy

Mother of Edward the Confessor.
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Princess Emma of Normandy, of Normandy




Husband

           Born: 
     Christened: 
           Died: 
         Buried: 
       Marriage: 




Wife Princess Emma of Normandy, of Normandy 1 24 25 26

           Born: Abt 982 - Rouen, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France
     Christened: 
           Died: 6 Mar 1052 - Winchester, Hampshire, England 27
         Buried:  - St Martin's Church, Winchester, Hampshire, England


         Father: Richard I "The Fearless" of Normandy, Duke of Normandy (0933-0996) 1 21 28 29 30 31
         Mother: Gunnor (Gundra\Gunnora) "Not" of Crepon (Abt 0942-1031) 1 21 32 33 34



   Other Spouse: King Ethelred II "The Unready" of England, King of England (Abt 0968-1016) 24

   Other Spouse: Canute II the Great , King of Denmark, Norway, and England (Abt 0994-1035) 21



Children

General Notes: Wife - Princess Emma of Normandy, of Normandy

Mother of Edward the Confessor.
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Rollo Rognvaldsson, the Viking, the Ganger, 1St Duke Of Normandy and Duchess Poppa of Normandy




Husband Rollo Rognvaldsson, the Viking, the Ganger, 1St Duke Of Normandy 1 21 24 28 35 36




            AKA: Rolf, Rolf "The Ganger" 1St Duke Of Normandy,37 Rollo Rognvaldsson 1st Duke Of Normandy
           Born: Abt 860 - Maer, Nord-Trondelag, Norway 35
     Christened: 
           Died: Abt 932 - Notre Dame, Rouen, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France 35
         Buried:  - Notre Dame, Rouen, Nornandie, Neustria


         Father: Rognvald "the Wise" Eysteinsson, Earl of More (Abt 0830-0890) 22
         Mother: Groa Ragnhild Hrolfsdotter (Abt 0848-      )


       Marriage: 891

   Other Spouse: Gisele (      -0919) 38 - 912




Wife Duchess Poppa of Normandy 1 21 36

            AKA: Papia
           Born: Abt 872 - Évreux, , Haute-Normandie, France
     Christened: 
           Died: Abt 938 - France
         Buried: 


         Father: Berengar , Count of Bayeux (Bef 0857-Bef 0930) 21 38
         Mother: de Rennes (Bef 0857-      ) 22




Noted events in their marriage were:
• Remarried, Abt 919


Children
1 F Adaele (Gerloc) of Normandy 1 22 36

            AKA: Geirlaug (Adele) de Normandie
           Born: 917 - Rouen, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France
     Christened: 
           Died: After 14 Oct 962 39 40
         Buried: 
         Spouse: Duke Guillaume III (William I) of Aquitaine, Count of Poitiers & Aquitaine (Abt 0929-0963) 1 22 39 41
           Marr: Abt 928 - France 36



2 M Duke William I "Longsword" of Normandy, Longsword 1 21 42 43

           Born: Abt 900 - Rouen, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France 44
     Christened: 
           Died: 17 Dec 942 - Killed At Picardy, France 42
         Buried: 
         Spouse: Sprota (Sporta) de Senlis (Abt 0911-Abt 0972) 1 21 44 45 46
           Marr: After 930 - 1st Wife (Danish Wife/Non Christian Marriage) 44
         Spouse: Luitgarda (      -      ) 21
         Spouse: Luitgarde De Vermandois (Abt 0920-0979) 1 47 48 49
           Marr: Bef 941 - 1st Husband 2ND Wife 43



3 M Duke Guillaume I "Longue Epbee" of Normandy

           Born: 
     Christened: 
           Died: 
         Buried: 



4 F Kadline

           Born: 
     Christened: 
           Died: 
         Buried: 



5 F Crispina de Normandy 1 50

           Born: Abt 920 - Rouen, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France
     Christened: 
           Died: 
         Buried: 
         Spouse: Grimaldus , Prince of Monaco (      -      )



6 F Gerletta

           Born: 
     Christened: 
           Died: 
         Buried: 
         Spouse: William II of Aquitaine (      -      )




General Notes: Husband - Rollo Rognvaldsson, the Viking, the Ganger, 1St Duke Of Normandy

Rollo, also called ROLF, or ROU, French ROLLON (b. c. 860--d. c. 932), Scandinavian rover who founded the duchy of Normandy.

911-Under treaty of St Claire received Normandy from Charles III King of France

Making himself independent of King Harald I of Norway, Rollo sailed off to raid Scotland, England, Flanders, and France on pirating expeditions and, about 911, established himself in an area along the Seine River. Charles III the Simple of France held off his siege of Paris, battled him near Chartres, and negotiated the treaty of Saint-Clair-sur-Epte, giving him the part of Neustria that came to be called Normandy; Rollo in return agreed to end his brigandage. He gave his son, William I Longsword, governance of the dukedom (927) before his death. Rollo was baptized in 912 but is said to have died a pagan. [Encyclopaedia Britannica CD, 1997, ROLLO]

Banished from Norway to the Hebrides ca. 876.

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The following information, arguing against Rollo's ancestry as I have it (certainly putting it to question), is contained in a post-em by Curt Hofemann, curt_hofemann AT yahoo.com. (Note: I am still sticking with my ancestry, which is based on information in CP, considered a very reliable source, though no source is perfect. I tend to want to stick up for the Norse "legends" contained in the sagas, believing that because they are easy targets, living in a time when there was no writing, many people deny their existence, holding them to the same standard as say "Charlemagne" or other historic figures who were written about by contemporaries.):

I apologize in advance for the length of this.

Rollo "the Ganger" 1st Duke of NORMANDY
911: Duke of Normandy [Ref: Paget p135]
properly Hrolf; known from his stature as Gongu-Hrolf, 'Rolf the walker' because no horse could carry him [Ref: Watney p740]
name: Rolf the Ganger [Ref: Tapsell p202]
911-932: Duke of Normandy [Ref: Tapsell p202]

born: 846 [Ref: Moriarty p10] abt 846 [Ref: ES II:79, Moriarty p11, Watney #740], parents: [Ref: Moriarty p10, Moriarty p11, Paget p135, Watney #740]

married Poppa 886: danish wife [Ref: Moriarty p10] first and third wives of Rollo, repudiated but afterward remarried after 919 [Ref: Paget p135], names: [Ref: Henry Project citing (Eric Christiansen, ed. & trans., Dudo of St. Quentin, History of the Normans (The Boydell Press, Woodbridge, Suffolk, 1998), Book ii Chapter 16 p38-9; Keats-Rohan, K. S. B., "Poppa of Bayeux and her Family", The American Genealogist 72 (1997), 187-204), Moriarty p11, p226, 39 Tompsett, Wurts p422]

married Gisele of France 912: [Ref: ES II:79, Paget p135]

died: 933 [Ref: ES II:75new] 927 [Ref: Watney 740] 931 [Ref: ES II:79, Moriarty p10, Moriarty p11] 932 [Ref: Paget p135, Tapsell p202] 931 [Ref: Wurts p422]

Rolf, known to his Frankish posterity as Rollo, was probably born of Norwegian stock, being the son of Rognvald, Earl of More, and before his formal establishment in Gaul he had a long career as a Viking, raiding not only in France but also, as it seems, in Scotland and Ireland. In 911, having entered Gaul afresh, perhaps by way of the Loire valley, he was defeated in a pitched battle outside the walls of of Chartres, and it was after this that he and his followers were given lands by the emperor in the valley of the lower Seine. Whether this famous grant of lands and recognition was made (as tradition later asserted) after a formal interview between Charles [King Charles III the Simple of France] and Rolf at Saint-Claire-sur Epte is questionable, and the application of the term 'treaty' to these arrangements is undoubtedly too precise. What, however, is certain is that before 918 Rolf and his followers already held considerable lands in this region, and that they had been formally confirmed in possession of them by the emperor. Equally certain is that in token of the new position he was henceforth to occupy in Gaul, Rolf accepted baptism at the hands of the archbishop of Rouen. [Ref: Wm Conqueror p17]

Rollo (later Robert) "of Normandy" Viking leader in France, d. 928×933. Although he is often referred to as the first duke of Normandy, that title is an anachronism. Probably about 911 [see Douglas 426-31], king Charles the Simple of France ceded a district around the city of Rouen to Rollo, which eventually evolved into the duchy of Normandy. He is said to have been baptized in 912, assuming the Christian name Robert [Dudo ii, 30 (p. 50)]. He was still living in 928, when he was holding Eudes, son of Heribert of Vermandois, as a captive [Flodoard's Annals, s.a. 928, see PL 135: 439, van Houts 45], and was probably dead by 933, when his son William was mentioned as leading the Normans [Flodoard's Annals, s.a. 933, see PL 135: 445, van Houts 45]. [Ref: Henry Project] note: the citations Douglas, Dudo, Flodoard, PL & van Houts are further identified in the Bibliography at the bottom of this page...Curt

Since the article by Duglas (sic) [Duglas (sic), David, English Historical review 1942, p417-36] seems to be one of the main secondary sources used by many who support the alleged Norwegian origin of Rollo, a brief discussion of Douglas's article is in order.

I agree with Duglas (sic) that the reference to Rollo as "filio Catilli" by Richer of Rheims can be dismissed. Richer used the generally reliable chronicle of Floodoard as a framework, which he then expanded with much legendary material of dubious value. This Catillus is a significant figure in Richer, but is apparently unknown from other sources, and his legendary nature is evident. The statement that Rollo was the son of Catillus is apparently an attempt by Richer to amplify the fame of Catillus (whose existence is doubful) by giving him a famous son.

Duglas (sic) then outlines the well known saga statements regarding Rollo's supposed identification with Ganger-Rolf, son of Rognvald. To support his claim that "Rollo" is an acceptable Latin form for "Hrolfr", Duglas (sic) brings forward a single charter [a charter of Richard II for St. Quen, which predated Dudo and the other later sources, mentions the _atavus Ralphus_ of the Duke] which reads "atavus Rolphus" (not Ralphus) which appears to be referring to Rollo (p.421). However, as Duglas (sic) admits, the charter itself is not above suspicion. Another example mentioned in a footnote is a certain Turstinus fillius Rolv who was apparently the same person as a Turstinus filius Rollonis. This is a very small sample to make the claim that Rollo was a Latin form for Rolf. Just as likely is the possibility that the names Rollo and Ralph were confused in a couple of manuscripts. Since Ralph was such a common name in Normandy and England, we should see a large number of examples of "Rollo" and "Ralph" being used as the same name, if they were in fact the same. Since the number of examples which Douglas was able to produce is so small, it is more likely that some sort of copying mistake was made on the above examples, in which the uncommon name Rollo was accidently replaced by the extremely common (and similar) Ralph. Important negative evidence is not given, for Douglas never mentions that there is a Norse name "Hrollaug" for which "Rollo" is an obvious Latinized form. Since the sagas give Rognvald of More two clearly different sons named Hrollaug and Hrolf, it would be difficult to argue that Hrollaug and Hrolf are supposed to be the same name. The main other piece of evidence Douglas gives for accepting the saga account is the supposed confirmation of a saga statement about Granger-Rolf in the contemporary records. The following statement by Ari is quoted: "Another son of Othere (he says) was Helge. He harried in Scotland and won there as his booty Nithbeorg, daughter of King Beolan and of Kathleen, daughter of Ganger-Rolf." Duglas (sic) then reads between the lines, and states that since Kathleen is a Celtin name, her mother would almost certainly be a Christian. He then turns to the nearly contemporary "Lament for the Death of William Longsword", which states that William was born outside France of a Christian mother at a time when his father was still pagan. He then states: "The suggestion of the Landnamabok is thus confirmed by an epic poem composed in Gaul in the tenth century. The fact would seem to be a powerful, if not a conclusive, argument in favor of the identity of Rollo with Ganger-Rolf." The first sentence in the above quote is completely false. There is not a single detail in the quote from Ari which is confirmed by the statement in "Lament for the death ..." This argument used by Duglas (sic), in which he deduces an additional statement not in the original, so that there is something which can be "confirmed" is unacceptable. The fact that Douglas would refer to such an argument as "powerful" only serves to emphasize how weak his argument really is. [Ref: Stewart Baldwin 7 Dec 1996] (Note: "Duglas" referred to above is actually spelled Douglas. David C. Douglas, Fellow of the British Academy, Emeritus Professor of History, University of Bristol, Ford's Lecturer to the University of Oxford & editor of a series of studies of the English monarchs...Curt)

According to the Orkneying Saga (late twelfth century), Rognvald, jarl of More in Norway, was the father (among others) of a certain Hrolf, who became the first duke of Normandy, and is therefore intended to be identified with the historical Viking Rollo, who appears in the contemporary Frankish annals of the tenth century. Those who accept this view base their argument on these late Icelandic sources. In my opinion, the Icelandic sources are worthless for early Norman history, and should be rejected as a source for Rollo's parentage. Some of the basic reasons for this opinion are as follows:

1. The Icelandic sources are both late and foreign when it comes to Norman history. Other than the very well known fact that William the Conqueror was descended from the dukes of Normandy, the Icelandic sources do not offer a single fact about early Norman history which can be corroborated in the contemporary continental sources. In fact, the Icelandic sources say remarkably little about early Norman history, which is suspicious for a source which supposedly knows the origin of Rollo.

2. The Norman sources, which are both native and considerably earlier than the Icelandic sources, tell a completely different story about the origin of Rollo, who is said to be of Danish origin. Even though some of the early Norman sources (such as Dudo) have been criticized for their innacuracy (and for deliberate embellishment), it is still reasonable to suppose that early native sources would be more reliable on the matter of Rollo's origin than late foreign sources.

3. Unfortunately, the early tenth century is not well covered by the Frankish sources. However, even though the Norman sources have clearly embellished and romanticized the material on Rollo, the story of a Danish origin for Rollo fits quite well with what the Frankish sources for the late ninth century (a better covered period) say about the Danish invasions during that earlier period.

4. Contrary to what has been frequently claimed, the names Hrolf and Rollo do not appear to be the same. The Norse name Hrollaug, which is a different name (see #5), is the name which would have "Rollo" as a reasonable Latinization. The claim that "Hrolf" was Latinized as "Rollo" by mistake is unlikely, because the Franks were quite familiar with the name, and a different Viking raider named Hrolf from the ninth century has his name correctly Latinized as "Rodulf" in the contemporary ninth century sources.

5. Fifth, and most important, the Icelandic sources give Rognvald of More several sons two of whom are Hrolf, allegedly the same as the founder of Normandy, and Hrollaug, an early Icelandic settler. First, this shows that Hrolf and Hrollaug were regarded as different names. However, it also causes a big problem in the Icelandic story. If we are to believe the Icelandic account, Hrolf went to Normandy, where he was then known as Rollo/Hrollaug, i.e., the name of Hrolf's brother. If the Icelandic story were true, why would both the Frankish and Norman sources both refer to "Hrolf" by the name of his brother Hrollaug? (Claiming that the Icelandic sources were almost right, and that Rollo of Normandy was the same as Hrollaug son of Rognvald, is not feasible, because Hrollaug's role as an early settler of Iceland clearly marks him as a different person from Rollo of Normandy.) I would like to see this problem explained away by someone supporting position that Rollo was Rognvald's son. By the way, this last point (#5) has, to my knowledge, not been mentioned before (except by me in previous postings on the same subject), and I therefore have an obvious personal interest in knowing if this particular point has been mentioned by others. If point #5 has already been made somewhere else in the literature, I would be interested in having the reference.

Thus, in my opinion, for the reasons given above, Rollo of Normandy was was probably not the son of Rognvald of More, and his parentage should be
regarded as unknown. [Ref: Stewart Baldwin 16 Mar 1998]

also known as Hrolf or Rollon, 1st Duke of Normandy from 911 to 927, called also Rolf the Walker, because, being so tall, he preferred to go afoot rather than ride the little Norwegian horses. Also shown as Rollon, Row, or Robert Originally a Norse Viking, he was noted for strength and martial prowess.

It is more likely that the title "Duke" is a tenth or eleventh century construct, as even the title count was not introduced until later documents, usually refered as count of Rouen. Neither Rollo or his son William Longsword issued many written instruments - certainly none that survive in the original.

Rollo the Dane, also known as Hrolf or Rollon, 1st Duke of Normandy from 911 to 927, called also Rolf the Walker, because, being so tall, he preferred to go afoot rather than ride the little Norwegian horses. Also shown as Rollon, Row, or Robert. Originally a Norse Viking, he was noted for strength and martial prowess. In the reign of Charles II, the Bald, he sailed up the Seine River and took Rouen, which he kept as a base of operations. He gained a number of victories over the Franks, and extorted the cession of the province since called Normandy. By the famous treaty which Charles the Bald and Rollo signed the latter agreed to adopt Christianity. He was born in 846 and died in 932, and was buried in the Cathedral at Rouen. He married (1) Gisla, daughter of Charles the Simple, King of France, no issue; (2) Lady Poppa de Valois, (means puppet or little doll), daughter of Pepin de Senlis de Valois, Count Berenger (Berenarius) of Bretagne, Count of Bayeux, and sister of Bernard of St. Liz (Senlis), also recorded as Berenger, Count of Bayeux. Rollo lived with her for some time before the marriage. [Ref: McBride2]

Dudo (contemporary with Rollo's grandson Richard I and informed by Richard's half-brother) states that Rollo was a Dane and had a brother whose name (I forget the form Dudo used) can be interpreted as Gorm or Guthorm. He portrays him as an extremely active individual rampaging, sacking, looting, and then being bought off by the French king to stop other vikings from doing the same, being baptized as Robert.

The Orkneyinga saga, which dates from a good bit after the time of William the Conqueror (great-grandson of Richard I and great-great-great-grandson of Rollo) says that the Jarl of Orkney had a brother Hrolf the Walker, who conquered Normandy and was ancestor of the Norman kings of England. It explains the nickname as indicating that he was so fat he could not ride a horse. He is a Norwegian, and had numerous brothers (including, oddly enough, one named Rollo), but none named Gorm or Guthorm.

Now there are no absolute answers here, but one thing is clear. The accounts of Dudo and of the Orkneyinga saga are completely incompatable. Every single detail, other than that the man conquered Normandy, - name, ethnicity, physical characteristics, siblings, are all different. Obviously one of these sources is in error. Both contain material which is demonstrably false, and which has been used in the past to discredit them. However, Dudo probably actually knew people who knew Rollo, and it is difficult to come up with a motive for falsification of these details (why bother substituting danish for norwegian, for example) while the Orkneyinga saga author had no such direct connection, and furthermore had motive to invent such an ancient connection, to further glorify the family are the center of his tale. Still, nothing of this sort is certain, but given what each of the sources have to say, you have to give the nod to Dudo, which would mean that Rollo would not be identical to the Hrolf of the saga, and the claim that he was the founder of Normandy must rest on some sort of mistaken identity or intentional forgery. [Ref: TAF 27 Feb 2002]

Hrólfr (son of Rognvaldr) is, often (but dubiously) identified with Rollo of Normandy [Ref: Henry Project]
Below is from the Henry Project, compiled by Stewart Baldwin at http://sbaldw.home.mindspring.com/hproject/prov/rollo000.htm
Commentary
Supposed father: Rognvaldr, jarl of Møre.
Supposed mother: Ragnhildr or Hildr.

The origin of Rollo is contraversial. There are several medieval sources which claim to give information about the origin of Rollo, the most widely repeated of which would make him a son of Rognvaldr, jarl of Møre by Ragnhildr or Hildr. As can be seen from the following brief notices, the various primary sources offer very contradictory information about Rollo's origin.

The earliest author to attribute an explicit origin to Rollo was Richer of Rheims, writing between 996 and 998, who called Rollo the son of another Viking invader of France named Catillus (presumably representing the Norse name Ketil) [Richer i, 28 (see PL 138: 35)]. Since Catillus appears to be a legendary individual, this account has generally been discredited, probably correctly [see Douglas 420-1].

According to Dudo of St. Quentin (writing early 11th century), author of the earliest history of the Normans, Rollo had a younger brother named Gurim, presumed to be the familiar name Gorm. Dudo states that Rollo and Gurim were sons of a man who held many lands in "Dacia" (Dudo's word for Denmark, following other authors), and that after the death of the (unnamed) father of Rollo and Gurim, the king of Dacia fought against the sons, killing Gurim and driving Rollo out [Dudo ii, 2-4 (pp. 26-7)]. Dudo later refers to duke Richard I as being related to a "king of Dacia" named Haigrold [Dudo iv, 84-88 (pp. 114-20 passim)], who must have been the Viking raider of France of that name [Flodoard's Annals, s.a. 945, see PL 135: 463-4, van Houts 51], and not king Harald "Bluetooth" of Denmark. Note that Gurim cannot be the famous Gorm "the Old" of Denmark, who survived Rollo by many years.
William of Malmesbury (early 12th century) appears to be the earliest author to attribute a Norwegian origin to Rollo [WM ii, 5 (p. 125)].

As is well known, the Orkneyinga Saga (late twelfth century) [OrkS 4 (pp. 29-30)], followed by other Icelandic sources (such as the well known Heimskringla and Landnámabók), gives Rollo the name Hrólfr, and make him a son of Rognvaldr, jarl of Møre, and brother of (among others) jarl Torf-Einarr of the Orkneys [OI 1: 187]. Earlier sources, such as Ari's Íslendingabók (early to middle 12th century), mention Rognvald of Møre and his son Hrollaugr who settled in Iceland, but not the supposed connection to the dukes of Normandy [Ari 49, 61]. A poem allegedly written by Einar mentions his brothers, including a Hrólfr, but does not connect Hrólfr to Normandy, and does not name a Gorm among the brothers. (See ...Rognvaldr for more on this poem.)

Historia Gruffud vab Kenan (ca. 1250), apparently a Welsh translation and/or revision of an earlier Latin life of Gruffudd ap Cynan, gives Haraldr Hárfagri of Norway ("Harald Harfagyr") a brother named Rodulf (i.e., the Latin form of Hrólfr) who is called the founder of Normandy [HGK, 3-4]. However, this is evidently a corrupt version of the Scandinavian version, and the suggestion that Rollo was a brother of Haraldr Hárfagri need not be given any credence.

The most prominent argument of the case for accepting the Scandinavian account that Rollo was the same person as Hrólfr, son of Rognvaldr of Møre, was given by D. C. Douglas [Douglas 419-23], and those who accept this identification have generally followed the same arguments. On the other side, arguments against the identification were given by Viggo Starcke in his book Denmark in World History [Starcke 222-7].

Most of the argument of Douglas consists of accepting the tale of the sagas and rejecting evidence from the Norman sources which contradict the saga version, while explaining away the problems (on which more below). The evidence which Douglas puts forward as "a powerful, if not a conclusive, argument in favor of the identity of Rollo with Ganger-Rolf" concerns a passage in Landnáamabók that refers to a daughter of Gongu-Hrólfr:
"... Annarr son Óttars vas Helge; hann herjaðe á Skottland, ok feck þar at herfange Niðbiorgo, dóttor Beolans konungs ok Caðlínar, dóttor Gongo-Hrólfs" (Another son of Óttarr was Helge. He harried in Scotland, and won there as his booty Niðbjorg, daughter of king Beolan and Caðlín, daughter of Gongu-Hrólfr.) [OI 1: 66-7]
This passage, which Douglas attributed to "Ari the Learned" (who may or may not have been the author), is then compared with a passage from the nearly contemporary Plaintsong of Rollo's son William "Longsword" which was written soon after William's death:

"Hic in orbe transmarino natus patre
in errore paganorum permanente
matre quoque consignata alma fide
sacra fuit lotus unda"

(Born overseas from a father who stuck to the pagan error and from a mother who was devoted to the sweet religion, he was blessed with the holy chrism.)
[Douglas 422 (Latin); van Houts 41 (English translation)]

After explaining that the two stories are consistent with one another, Douglas then state that "[t]he suggestion of the Landnámabók is thus confirmed by an epic poem composed in Gaul in the tenth century." While it is true that the two accounts as they stand are consistent with each other and with the claim that Rollo and Gongu-Hrólfr were the same man (ignoring all other evidence), it is surely a gross overstatement to claim that the Plaintsong "confirms" the other account, for there is not a single statement in the passage from Landnámabók that is confirmed by the Plaintsong. This is a clear case of circular reasoning, for without first assuming that Rollo and Gongu-Hrólfr were the same man, there is no evidence that the two passages have any relation whatsoever. Douglas's case is further undermined by the fact that another source [Laxdœla Saga chapter 32, see OI 1: 246] makes Niðbjorg's mother Caðlín a daughter of Gongu-Hrólfr, son of Oxna-Þórir, directly contradicting the thesis that Caðlín was supposedly a granddaughter of Rognvaldr of Møre. Yet, Douglas apparently regarded this as the strongest part of his argument.

There are three main strands of evidence (somewhat related to each other) against the identification of Rollo with Hrólfr son of Rognvaldr:

1. The discrepancies between the Norman and Icelandic sources.
Among other contradictions, the Norman sources give Rollo a brother named Gurim, while the Icelandic sources give Hrólfr several brothers, none of them named Gormr (the presumed Old-Norse form for Gurim). Although both of the sources have their problems, earlier native sources would seem to have a higher priority than later foreign sources. While many elements of the Dudo's account are clearly legendary, there appears to be no clear motive on the part of Dudo (writing less than a century after Rollo's death) to invent a younger brother for Rollo who is then immediately killed off.

2. The general unreliability of Norse source for the early tenth century.
For the period under consideration, i.e., the early ninth century, the sagas have a poor record for reliability, even for Scandinavian history. For example, consider the following words of Peter Sawyer (written with regard to a different matter, but true in general), a well known expert on early Viking history: "... These sagas cannot, however, be accepted as reliable sources for the tenth century. The only trustworthy evidence for the tenth century in those sagas are the contemporary verses around which the saga writers wove their tales." [Sawyer 42] None of these verses confirm the identity of Rollo and Hrólfr. The suspicion is made even larger by the fact that the Icelandic sources show no knowledge of Norman history other than the fact (well known throughout Europe at the time) that William the Conqueror was a descendant of the dukes of Normandy.

3. Rollo and Hrólfr appear to be different names.
The natural Latinization of the name Hrólfr would be Radulfus or Rodulfus. Yet, the Frankish and Norman sources consistently refer to the founder of Normandy as Rollo. Since these sources also include numerous individuals named Rodulfus, and consistently separate the two names, it appears that the names were regarded as different. Douglas explained this by suggesting a hypothetical hypochoristic form "Hrolle" of the name "Hroðwulf" as the basis for the name Rollo, and provides a single charter in which Rollo is referred to as "Rolphus" as evidence that the names were the same, acknowledging, however, that the charter itself was "not above suspicion." If the names were really regarded as the same, it would be expected that more convincing evidence to this effect could be offered.

Personally, I am inclined to believe that the identification of Hrólfr and Rollo has no basis in fact, that it was likely to have been invented by a saga writer who wanted to give the jarls of Orkney some famous relatives (i.e., the kings of England), and that whatever the confusing Norman sources say are probably about the closest we are going to get to Rollo's origin. However, based on the surviving evidence, it is not possible to come to any definitive conclusion one way or the other, and Rollo's parentage should be listed as "unknown" unless further evidence becomes available.

Supposed additional child:
Caðlin (Kathleen), said by Norse sources to have married a certain king Beolan, who is otherwise unidentified. As discussed above, the evidence for her is less than satisfactory.]

Bibliography
Ari = Halldór Hermannsson, ed. & trans., The Book of Icelanders (Íslendingabók) by Ari Thorgilsson (Islandica, vol. 20, Ithaca, 1930).
Dudo = Eric Christiansen, ed. & trans., Dudo of St. Quentin, History of the Normans (The Boydell Press, Woodbridge, Suffolk, 1998). Citation is by book and chapter of Dudo's work, with the page number in parentheses.
Douglas = D. C. Douglas, "Rollo of Normandy", English Historical Review 57 (1942), 417-36.
Flodoard's Annals = See PL 135 (Latin), and van Houts (2000), 42-51 (English translation of excerpts relating to the Normans).
GJ = Guillaume de Jumièges, Gesta Normannorum Ducum, as edited in Elisabeth van Houts, ed. & trans., The Gesta Normannorum Ducum of William of Jumièges, Orderic Vitalis and Robert of Torigni, 2 vols., (Oxford, 1992). Citation is by book and chapter of Guillaume's work, with the volume and page number of the edition by van Houts in parentheses.
HGK = D. Simon Evans, ed., Historia Gruffudd vab Kenan (Caerdydd, 1977).
Keats-Rohan = Keats-Rohan, K. S. B., "Poppa of Bayeux and her Family", The American Genealogist 72 (1997), 187-204.
OI = Gudbrand Vigfusson and F. York Powell, ed. & trans., Origines Islandicae, 2 vols. (Oxford, 1905).
OrkS = Herman Pálsson & Paul Edwards, ed. & trans., Orkneyinga Saga (London, 1978). Citation is by chapter, with the page number in parentheses.
PL = Migne's Patrologiæ (Latin)
Richer = Richer of Rheims (see PL 138 for the text, in Latin). Citation is by book and chapter of Richer's work, with the page number in parentheses.
Sawyer = Peter Sawyer, 'The Last Scandinavian Kings of York', Northern History 31 (1995), 39-44.
Starcke = Viggo Starcke, Denmark in World History (Philadelphia, 1962, a translation of the Danish edition of 1946 by Frank Noel Stagg, Ingeborg Nixon, and Mrs. Elmer Harp).
van Houts = Elisabeth van Houts, ed. & trans., The Normans in Europe (Manchester & New York, 2000) [gives English translations of many of the primary sources relevant to early Norman history]
WM = J. A. Giles, ed. & trans., William of Malmesbury's Chronicle of the Kings of England (London, 1889). Citation is by book and chapter of William's work, with the page number in parentheses.

Regards,
Curt
Rollo the Viking was granted land in Northwestern France in 911 AD by
Charles the Simple, King of France. Charles hoped that Rollo would defend
his new land, barring the length of the Seine River to other Viking
groups. Rollo remained faithful to Charles and he and his son quickly
expanded the original land grant at the expense of neighboring French
lords and guarded it well against Viking rivals. Even before Rollo's
grandson Richard took over the domain in 942, the descendants of the
Vikings had accepted Christianity, intermarried with the local population
and adopted the French language. Already they were being called Normans,
a contraction of Northmen, and there territory became known as Normandy.
Richard's great-grandson was King William I, conqueror of England. Rollo
was also known as "Rolf."


General Notes: Wife - Duchess Poppa of Normandy

The following information is contained in a post-em by Curt Hofemann, curt_hofemann AT yahoo.com:

Poppa means puppet or little doll [Ref: McBride2]
The name Poppa comes from Dudo, who calls her daughter of Count Berenger. [Ref: TAF 24 Dec 1999]

What I have in mind is her (Katherine Keats-Rohan) article on Poppa, mother of William Longsword of Normandy, which appeared in The American Genealogist a few years back. Basically, she suggested that Juhel/Judicael Berenger was son of a Count Berenger, named by Dudo and William of Juminges, and that both this Count Berenger and William Longsword were maternal grandchildren of an Earlier Frankish Count Berenger. I have seen it speculated (i.e. by Guillotel) that Judicael Berenger's paternal grandfather might have been a son or grandson of King Erispoe, but there was little evidence with which to place him. [Ref: TAF 21 Nov 2000]

parents: [Ref: ES II:75new], father: Berengar Count of Bayeux [Ref: Paget p135] called a dau of Count Berenger of Boyeux [Ref: Moriarty p11] said to be a daughter of count Berengar [Ref: Henry Project citing (Eric Christiansen, ed. & trans., Dudo of St. Quentin, History of the Normans (The Boydell Press, Woodbridge, Suffolk, 1998), Book ii Chapter 16 p38-9; Keats-Rohan, K. S. B., "Poppa of Bayeux and her Family", The American Genealogist 72 (1997), 187-204)

Research note 1: parents: Gui Count of Senlis & dau Pepin de Parmus [Ref: Moriarty p226]

Research note 2: father: Berenger Marquis of Newstria (d.896) [Ref: KeatsRohan Poppa p196]

Research note 3: father: Pepin Count of Senlis [Ref: Wurts p182]

Research note 4: Pepin de Senlis de Valois, Count Berengarius of Bretagne, who was living in 893. Pepin de Senlis de Valois was the father of Lady Poppa, the first wife of Rollo the Dane, 1st Duke of Normandy. [Ref: McBride2]

married Rollo 886: date: danish wife [Ref: Moriarty p10] first and third wives of Rollo, repudiated but afterward remarried after 919 [Ref: Paget p135], names: [Ref: Henry Project citing (Eric Christiansen, ed. & trans., Dudo of St. Quentin, History of the Normans (The Boydell Press, Woodbridge, Suffolk, 1998), Book ii Chapter 16 p38-9; Keats-Rohan, K. S. B., "Poppa of Bayeux and her Family", The American Genealogist 72 (1997), 187-204), Moriarty p11, p226, 39 Tompsett, Wurts p422]

Regards,
Curt

picture

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