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8044361928. William De BRIWERE,415,886 son of Brugo De BRIWERE and Unknown, was born about 1088 of Normandy, France.

William married about 1108 of Torre-Briwere, Devonshire, England.

The child from this marriage was:

4022180964       i.  Henry De BRIWERE Of Stoke (born about 1109 in Stoke, Devonshire, England)


8044361932. Robert De VAUX Lord Of Gillesland,415,505,1572 son of Hubert De Vallibus Seigneur De VAUX and Grace (Grecia), was born about 1102 in Gilsland, Irthington, Cumberland, England and died in 1195 1572 about age 93.

Robert married Isabel 1573 in 1st Wife.1573 Isabel was born about 1102 in England.

Robert next married Ada D' ENGAINE Heiress Of Burgh-By-Sands 1572 before 1141 in 2ND Husband 2ND Wife.1572 Ada was born about 1122 in Burgh-By-Sands, Cumberland, England.

Children from this marriage were:

4022180966       i.  Herbert De VAUX Sir (born about 1142 in Gilsland, Irthington, Cumberland, England - died in 1165)

               ii.  Ranulf De VAUX Lord Of Gillesland was born in 1145 in Gilsland, Irthington, Cumberland, England and died in 1198 in Gilsland, Irthington, Cumberland, England 1572 at age 53.


8044361933. Ada D' ENGAINE Heiress Of Burgh-By-Sands,415,505,1572 daughter of William De ENGAINE Of Burgh-By-Sands and Eustachia, was born about 1122 in Burgh-By-Sands, Cumberland, England.

General Notes: The following information was given by Curt Hofemann, curt_hofemann@yahoo.com, in a post-em:

Birth: ABT 1105 in Burgh-by-Sands, Cumberland, England

Father: Ranulf d' Engaine b: ABT 1070 in Idsell, Cumberland, England
Mother: Ibria d' Estrivers b: ABT 1086 in Cumberland, England

Jim, this appears to be one of those cases where someone listed this & tons of people copied it & posted it to WorldConnect - some even cite you as their source ;>). She was their gdau, not their dau. Her father was their s&h William. This would also affect your listing of her DOB . . .

"Lazonby was brought into relations with the priory of Lanercost by Ada Engayne and afterwards bestowed by her son Hugh de Morville, and that of Denton by Buethbarn, the lord of the place. Ada Engayne granted an annuity of three marks out of the revenues of the churches of Burgh-by-Sands and Lazonby for the souls of William Engayne her father and Eustachia her mother, and for the soul of Simon her late husband, to which Christian, Bishop of Withern and Robert, Archdeacon of Carlisle were parties." [Reg. of Lanercost, MS v. 4-6; ii 15-16; iii 1-2; xii 26] VCH Cumberland, v. 2 p. 153

Ada was the daughter of William, son and heir of Ranulph Engaine of Idsell, Cumberland and Ibria Trevers, daughter of Robert de Trevers, Lord of Burgh-by-Sands. Does anyone know who Eustachia, William's wife was? [Ref: Rosie Bevan 2 Jul 2001 message to soc.genealogy.medieval, subject: Ada Engayne]

Note that in the above it's "Trivers" not "Estrivers". Not sure but it's possible that the latter is Latin & the former English... Curt

See: Alan B. Wilson 23 Mar 1999 message to soc.genealogy.medieval, subject: Re: De Warenne/Alan of Galloway ancestries, wherein he cites: [Ref: CP IX:396-408, Sanders p23, Michael Call group sheets & Michael Call 393:21->463:09]

See: Doug Smith 20 Jan 2002 message to soc.genealogy.medieval, subject: Re: de Vaux family/families

See: Mardi Carter 17 Jan 1999 message to soc.genealogy.medieval, subject: Re: MULTON, DACRE

See: Hal Bradley 5 Jan 2003 message to soc.genealogy.medieval, subject: RE: Morville-Stuteville-Beauchamp

Regards,
Curt

Ada married Simon De MORVILLE Of Burgh-By-Sands, Sir,899,1572 son of Unknown and Unknown, in 1st Husband?.1572 Simon was born about 1118 in Kirkoswald, Cumberland, England and died before 1141 in Burgh-By-Sands, Cumberland, England. Another name for Simon was Simon De MOREVILLE.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Hugh De MORVILLE Of Burgh & Knaresborough was born about 1138 in Burgh-By-Sands, Cumberland, England and died in 1202 in Knaresborough Castle, West Riding Yorkshire, England 583 about age 64. Another name for Hugh was Hugh De MOREVILLE.

               ii.  Ada De MORVILLE was born about 1140 in Burgh-By-Sands, Cumberland, England. Another name for Ada was Ada De MOREVILLE.

Ada next married Robert De VAUX Lord Of Gillesland 1572 before 1141 in 2ND Husband 2ND Wife.1572 Robert was born about 1102 in Gilsland, Irthington, Cumberland, England and died in 1195 1572 about age 93.

8044361944. Fergus Lord Of GALLOWAY 415,899,1574 was born in 1096 in Carrick, Ayrshire, Scotland,1250 died on 12 May 1166 in Galloway, Dumfries And Galloway, Scotland 1251,1575 at age 70, and was buried in Abbey Of Holyrood, Edinburgh, Scotland.

General Notes: Fergus, Prince of Lord of Galloway, flourished in the reign of David I. He became a canon regular in the abbey of Holyroodhouse. Left two sons, 1. Gilbert, ancestor of the Earls of Carrick. 2. Uchtred. [Ref: Peerage of Scotland by John Philip Wood, Edinburgh, 1813, v1 p612-13] note: Prince of Lord of?... Curt

At some remote era the Lord of Galloway became dependant upon the king of Scotland, and Fergus, the first known prince of the province, was an attendant on certain state occasions at the royal court, whilst he acknowledged the superiority of his contemporary David by the payment of a certain tribute in time of peace, and by a contingent of turbulent soldiery in war; resembling, in other respects, an ally rather than a vassal, and enjoying a considerable degee of independence within his hereditary dominions. He married Elizabeth, a natural daughter of Henry the First, and Afreca, his daughter by this union, became the wife of Olave and the mother of Godfrey, kings of Man and the Isles. [note: "Chron. St. Crucis" 1160. The names of Fergus and his son, Uchtred, occur amongst the witnesses to the grant of Perdeyc on the 7th July 1136. "Reg. Glasg.", No. 3, 7." [Ref: Scotland under her Early Kings by E. William Robertson, Edinburgh, 1862, p356-357]

In Kirkcudbrightshire, Scotland; a Cistercian house founded in 1142 by King David I and Fergus Lord of Galloway for monks brought from Rievaulx in Yorkshire. The name (Dun-nan-droigheann) means "fort of the thorn-bushes", and the monastery commands a fine view of the Solway Firth. [Ref: Catholic Encyclopedia]

History of the Lands and Their Owners in Galloway, by P. H. M'Kerlie, New Edition, 1906 v1: p110: Beyond the statement that Fergus was forty-two years of age in 1138, nothing is known to indicate who he was. He was a courtier of David I, his name appearing in several charters granted by that monarch. He seems to have enjoyed considerable eminence, having for his wife Elizabeth, bastard daughter of Henry I of England.

p111-112: ...the contention that Fergus was the descendant or next of kin of Dovenald, son of Dunegal, is entirely erroneous. That he was a native of rank in Galloway, and succeeded by lineal descent to the position he held, is not supported by a single fact of any kind, and is opposed to a truthful history of the district. Neither could he have held supreme power over Galloway as a prince, but only as a governor, in the same way as Cumberland--then a portion of Scotland--was held by the Meschines family, or until deposed by the Norsemen. The Moemaer's position when they held the northern provinces of Scotland was not analagous, for they had great power with weak kings. Fergus was under David I, who was a powerful King. David was surrounded by unscrupulous adventurers from England, usually termed Anglo-Normans, but the progenitors of many were called the scum of Europe. Fergus appears to have been appointed Governor after the disasterous battle of the Standard, fought on Catton Moor, near Northallerton, North Yorkshire, in 1138, in which the Galwegians served under the king, with other levies from all parts of Scotland and Cumberland. The united army is called 26,000 men. It is mentioned that the Galwegians claimed as a right to lead the van as the principal fighting men; but their right to this honour has never been satisfactorily explained. One thing seems certain, that they were badly commanded, which no doubt caused their conduct not to be altogether to their credit, although at first brave in the extreme. From bad generalship they were exposed to, and suffered greatly from, the English archers, without being allowed to close with them. Thereby they had most of their fighting men slain--their lines got broken and they retreated. Weakened and dispirited, no more favorable opportunity could have been offered for the king to place a stranger over them, to check their turbulent disposition and wild habits. During the seventeen years he was Prince of Cumbria, David received the support of all the adventurers on the English border, and is said by all contemporary authorities to have been "terrible only to the men of Galloway." As king, after the battle, he had them fully in his power, and exercised it by placing a governor over them. Fergus, on appointment, at once commanded, as no native would have done, to build religious houses in connection with the English Church, alias Church of Rome, in opposition to the native Celtic Irish-Scottish Church of Iona. He was evidently of Norse descent, and one of King David's own school, or so appeared so as to ingratiate himself. The "Sankt King," as he is called, or, as elsewhere, "that Prince of Mink-feeders and Prime Scottish Saint of the Romish Calendar which procured him Canonisation from the Pope," was surrounded, as already stated, by adventurers from England, preferring them to his Scottish subjects. There can be no doubt on the mind of any close reader and searcher of history that Fergus was appointed governor about A.D. 1139, after peace was concluded between Kings David of Scotland and Stephen of England.

p112: It is necessary to repeat here that Fergus married Elizabeth, the bastard daughter of King Henry I of England. This King ruled from 1100 to 1135. Unless Fergus had been in England more or less time, he could not have become acquainted with her and married before he became Governor of Galloway, otherwise his descendants--three generations--would have had very short lives. Also, had he been a native, from the position apparently held from the first, he would have led the Galwegians at the Battle of the Standard, instead of Ulgric and Dovenald. That Fergus was married long before his connection with Galloway, supported by the facts that Olaf, King of Man, began to reign in 1102, and that he had married Affrica, the daughter of Fergus, but previously had three sons and several daughters by his concubines, one of the latter becoming the wife of Somerled, the ruler of Argyll.

p113: In summary, Fergus, first founded c1138 St. Mary's Priory at the Isle of Trahil or Trayl, Kirkcudbright, in token of his reconciliation with King David, whom he had sorely displeased, arising it is believed, from complicity in the rebellion of Angus, Earl of Moran, in 1130, when David was absent.

p114: After his settlement in Galloway he built abbeys and chapels in different areas and brought monks from England and abroad to occupy them. During the tenure of Fergus in the reign of David, nothing special occurred worthy of mention; but after the death of the King (24th March, 1153), and while his son and successor, Malcolm, was a minor, Fergus, in 1160, with much ingratitude, threw off his allegiance, joining Somerled the ruler of Argyll, who had been in open rebellion, and they ravaged the west coast. Somerled was slain at Renfrew in 1164. It is stated that they counted on the aid of the North or Norse-men to place William of Egremont, the great-grandson of Malcolm Caenmore, on the throne. In regard to Somerled, as it is a disputed point, we will not press it here, beyond stating that if he were not of Norse lineage on both sides (i.e. father and mother) he was certainly closely connected with them by blood. This union with Fergus and Somerled is another link in the evidence that Fergus was of Norse origin. They were defeated, and Fergus either resigned, or, as more probable, had taken from him the same year (1160) the governorship of Galloway. He took refuge in Holyrood Abbey as a canon regular, and died in 1161.

Regards,
Curt

Noted events in his life were:

• Alt. Death: Alt. Death, After 1136. 899

• Alt. Death: Alt. Death (as a monk at Holyrood Abbey), 1161. 1250,1575

Fergus married Elizabeth Of ENGLAND.1574 Elizabeth was born in 1095 in Talby, Yorkshire, England.1576

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Aufrica Of GALLOWAY was born about 1120 in Galloway, Dumfries And Galloway, Scotland.

4022180972      ii.  Uchtred Lord Of GALLOWAY (born before 1121 in Carrick, Ayrshire, Scotland - died on 22 September 1174 in Loch Fergus, Scotland (Murdered By Nephew Malcom))

              iii.  Gilbert Lord Of GALLOWAY was born about 1122 in Wigtown, Galloway, Scotland and died from 1 January 1184 to 1185 1577 about age 62.

               iv.  Bethoc MACFERGUS was born about 1124 in Row Castle, Galloway, Bedrule Parish, Scotland.

                v.  Margaret De GALLOWAY was born about 1130 in Carrick, Ayrshire, Scotland.1576


8044361945. Elizabeth Of ENGLAND,415,670,1574 daughter of Duke & Lion Of Justice Henry I "Beauclerc" King Of ENGLAND and Several MISTRESSES, was born in 1095 in Talby, Yorkshire, England.1576

General Notes: Turton (with a ?) has Elizabeth as daughter of William Rufus (William II King of England).

Curt Hofemann, curt_hofemann@yahoo.com, has one source indicating that Elizabeth is the same as Sybilla, wife of Alexander of Scotland. Possible (she probably would have married Fergus after 1124), though I think unlikley. Curt's other source has them as two different people.

Possily your ID I04761 Sybilla FitzHenry & this Elizabeth are one & the same. There are conflicting sources:

Same:
Sibyl, but called Elizabeth by Sandford [Ref: Sheppard Apr65 p96] unfortunately I did not note the identity of "Sanford" in my notes... Curt

Not same:
He married Elizabeth, natural daughter of Henry I, and sister of Sibilla, who married Alexander I, brother of David." [Ref: Sir Herbert Maxwell, "A History of Dumfries and Galloway" by Sir Herbert Maxwell, Edinburgh, 1896, pp. 47-48]

Regards,
Curt

Elizabeth married Fergus Lord Of GALLOWAY 899.,1574 Fergus was born in 1096 in Carrick, Ayrshire, Scotland,1250 died on 12 May 1166 in Galloway, Dumfries And Galloway, Scotland 1251,1575 at age 70, and was buried in Abbey Of Holyrood, Edinburgh, Scotland.

8044361946. Waltheof Lord Of ALLERDALE,415,1578 son of Gospatric I Earl Of Northumbria Mormaer DUNBAR and Aethelreda Of ENGLAND, was born before 1075 in Allerdale, Scotland and died after 1125 904.

Waltheof married Sigrid.1579 Sigrid was born about 1086 in Scotland and died after 1126 1579.

The child from this marriage was:

4022180973       i.  Gunnild Of DUNBAR (born in 1126 in Dunbar Castle, East Lothian, Scotland)


8044361947. Sigrid 415,1579 was born about 1086 in Scotland and died after 1126 1579.

Sigrid married Waltheof Lord Of ALLERDALE.1578 Waltheof was born before 1075 in Allerdale, Scotland and died after 1125 904.

8044361948. Hugh De MORVILLE Constable Of Scotland,415,901,1252,1580 son of Unknown and Unknown, was born about 1115 in Kirkoswald, Cumberland, England and died in 1162 in Dryburgh, Roxburghshire, Scotland 899,1252 about age 47. Another name for Hugh was Hugh De MOREVILLE.

General Notes: The people on soc.genealogy.medieval do not give parents for Hugh, but they do say that Hugh is connected with the family of Simon (I have Simon as brother). Turton states that Hugh (who m. Beatrice de Beauchamp) is son of Simon who is son of Hugh. I believe Turton is wrong in that it was the Hugh who m. Hawise de Stuteville and was one of the murderers of Thomas a Becket, who is son of Simon.

------------------

The following is excerpted from and e-mail from Dennis Theriot, with more sources for Hugh's ancestry:

From: Dennis Theriot [mailto:denther@gte.net]
Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2003 11:46 AM
To: Jim Weber

Dear Jim,

I do have another comment about your database. For Hugh de Morville of Kirkoswald, ID I03448, you said that you thought that Turton was incorrect in saying that he was the son of Simon who married Ada de Engaine. I agree. I will use my copy of Sanders, English Baronies, p 23-24, where he discusses the descent of Burgh by Sands, co Cumberland: "Ada, married firstly, Simon de Morville. Simon d 1167, his son Hugh d 1202, leaving Ada and Joan. Ada who inherited half of the barony married, firstly, Richard de Lucy, d 1213, Lord of Egremont, co Cumberland etc..."Since we know that Hugh de Morville of Kirkoswald left two sons and a daughter, he cannot be the son of Simon who left only female heirs. I looked up your reference on soc.genealogy.medieval and did a little exploring there. A statement made by <mckenzee@my-dejanews.com> on the subject: Hugh de Morville, dated 28 Mar 1999, says:" my understanding is that Simon de Morville was (1) the brother of Hugh the Constable, (2) father of Hugh of Burgh by Sands, and (3) uncle of the Hugh the Murderer." I think that he got it right. [Note: I think Hugh of Burgh-by-Sands is Hugh the Murderer.]

If you don't have access to a copy of Sanders, I suggest that you get one. I got mine on the Internet. The book is : English Baronies, A Study of their Origin and Descent 1086-1327, Oxford University Press, 1960. It is cited frequently in Ancestral Roots and is a good way to bridge the gap between the Domesday Survey and the Complete Peerage.

I am still exploring your database. Thanks again for such a good product. You are one of the few on the internet that gives references.

Dennis Theriot

Hugh married Beatrice De BEAUCHAMP 901,1252.,1581 Beatrice was born about 1118 in Bedford, Bedfordshire, England and died after 1153 1252.

Children from this marriage were:

4022180974       i.  Richard De MORVILLE Constable Of Scotland (born about 1142 in Kirkoswald, Cumberland, England - died in 1189 in Dryburgh, Roxburghshire, Scotland)

               ii.  Maud De MORVILLE was born about 1145 in Kirkoswald, Cumberland, England. Another name for Maud was Maude De MOREVILLE.


8044361949. Beatrice De BEAUCHAMP 415,901,1252,1581 was born about 1118 in Bedford, Bedfordshire, England and died after 1153 1252.

General Notes: Turton has Beatrice as daughter of Payn de Beauchamp, who was son of Hugh. But Mardi Carter has her as sister of Payn, and Kay Allen statest that Payn was son of Robert, who was son of Hugh. Therefore Beatrice is still granddaughter of Hugh, but now she is daughter of Robert and sister of Payn.

Beatrice married Hugh De MORVILLE Constable Of Scotland 901,1252.,1580 Hugh was born about 1115 in Kirkoswald, Cumberland, England and died in 1162 in Dryburgh, Roxburghshire, Scotland 899,1252 about age 47. Another name for Hugh was Hugh De MOREVILLE.

8044361950. William I De LANCASTER 5th Baron Of Kendal 415,901,1582,1583 was born about 1124 in Kendal, Westmorland, England and died in 1170 in Lancaster, Lancashire, England 1584 about age 46.

General Notes: Gundred de Warenne m. (2) William de Lancaster I, d. 1170, 5th Baron Kendal of Workington in Coupland, son of Gilbert, 4th Baron Kendal; he inherited an extensive fief held of the Honour of Coupland, served as castellan of William fitz Duncan's castle of Egremont in 1138, and was Governor of the Caslte of Lancaster. [Ancestral Roots, line 88-25]

Note: Their daughter Avice's birthdate is about 1145 according to some, but if Plantagenet Ancestry is right in attributing her mother to be Gundred (Ancestral Roots gives no mother), then an 1154 date would be much more likely. This also involves making subsequent descendant birthdates a bit later as well.

Note also: Ancestral Roots states that Gilbert de Stainton is probably son of William I de Lancaster. However I believe that chronologically he is more likely to be a brother.

William married Gundred De WARENNE 531,1583,1585 after 1153 in 2ND Husband 2ND Wife 1583.,1584 Gundred was born about 1124 in Lewes, Sussex, England and died after 1166 in Warwick Castle, Warwickshire, England 1583.

Children from this marriage were:

4022180975       i.  Avice De LANCASTER (born about 1154 in Kendal, Westmorland, England - died on 1 January 1190-1191)

               ii.  William II De LANCASTER 6th Baron Of Kendal was born about 1154 in Kendal, Westmorland, England and died in 1184 in Lancaster, Lancashire, England 583,1586 about age 30.


8044361951. Gundred De WARENNE,415,505,531,670,1583,1585 daughter of William De WARENNE 2nd Earl Of Surrey and Isabel (Elizabeth) De VERMANDOIS, was born about 1124 in Lewes, Sussex, England and died after 1166 in Warwick Castle, Warwickshire, England 1583.

General Notes: Gundred, elder daughter of William de Warenne, 2nd Earl of Surrey, by Elizabeth/Isabel widow of his (Roger's) uncle, Robert I de Beaumont, 1st Earl of Leicester. [Burke's Peerage]

-------------------

Gundred de Warenne, Countess of Warwick [dau. of William de Warenne & Isabel de Vermandois], widow of Roger de Newburgh; m. (2) William de Lancaster I, d. 1170, 5th Baron Kendal of Workington in Coupland, son of Gilbert, 4th Baron Kendal; he inherited an extensive fief held of the Honour of Coupland, served as castellan of William fitz Duncan's castle of Egremont in 1138, and was Governor of the Caslte of Lancaster. [Ancestral Roots, line 88-25]

------------------

He [Roger Earl of Warwick] married Gundred, elder daughter of William (DE WARENNE), 2nd EARL OF SURREY, by Isabel (or Elizabeth), widow of Robert (DE BEAUMONT), COUNT OF MEULAN and 1st EARL OF LEICESTER, daughter of Hugh (DE CRÉPY), COUNT OF VERMANDOIS. He died in 1153. His widow married, as his 2nd wife, William DE LANCASTER, Lord of Kendal. She was living in 1166. [Complete Peerage XII/2:361-2, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Gundred married Roger De BEAUMONT 2nd Earl Of Warwick 531,1583,1585,1587 before 1130 in 1st Husband 1583.,1587 Roger was born before 15 April 1102 in Warwick Castle, Warwickshire, England 531,1583 and died on 12 June 1153 in Warwick Castle, Warwickshire, England 531,1587,1588. Other names for Roger were Roger De NEWBURGH 2nd Earl Of Warwick, and 02nd Earl Of WARWICK Roger De Beaumont.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Gundred De BEAUMONT was born about 1143 in Warwick Castle, Warwickshire, England and died between 1200 and 1208 1585 about age 57. Another name for Gundred was Gundred De NEWBURGH.

               ii.  William De BEAUMONT 3rd Earl Of Warwick was born before 1145 in Warwick Castle, Warwickshire, England 1589 and died on 15 November 1184 in (Dsp) 1589. Other names for William were William De NEWBURGH 3rd Earl Of Warwick, and 03rd Earl Of WARWICK William De Beaumont.

4022182054     iii.  Waleran De BEAUMONT 4th Earl Of Warwick (born before 1153 in Warwick Castle, Warwickshire, England - died before 13 October 1204)

Gundred next married William I De LANCASTER 5th Baron Of Kendal 901,1582,1583 after 1153 in 2ND Husband 2ND Wife 1583.,1584 William was born about 1124 in Kendal, Westmorland, England and died in 1170 in Lancaster, Lancashire, England 1584 about age 46.

8044362304. Robert Le BOTELER Of Oversley 415 was born about 1145 in Oversley, Alcester, Warwickshire, England.

General Notes: Robert Boteler was s. by his son, Ralph Boteler. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, England, 1883, p. 63, Boteler, Barons Boteler, of Oversley and Wemme]

Robert married.

Children from this marriage were:

4022181152       i.  Ralph Le BOTELER Of Oversley (born about 1162 in Oversley, Alcester, Warwickshire, England - died after 1207)

               ii.  Margaret Le BOTELER was born about 1170 in Oversley, Alcester, Warwickshire, England and died after 1242.


8044362312. Ivo PANTULF Of Wemme 415 was born in 1114 in Wem, Shropshire, England and died in 1175 at age 61.

Ivo married.

Children from this marriage were:

4022181156       i.  Hugh PANTULF Lord Of Wemme (born in 1145 in Wem, Shropshire, England - died in 1224)

               ii.  William PANTULF Of Breedon was born about 1151 in Wem, Shropshire, England and died in 1194 in Breedon-On-The-Hill, Leicestershire, England 1590 about age 43.


8044362314. William FITZALAN Lord Of Oswestry 415,980,1255,1337,1338 was born about 1105 in Oswestry Castle, Shropshire, England and died in 1160 in Oswestry Castle, Shropshire, England 1255,1337,1338 about age 55.

General Notes: William FitzAlan; feudal Baron of Oswestry, Sheriff Salop and Castellan of Shrewsbury 1138; besieged there as an adherent of the Empress Maud by King Stephen; restored to his lands by Henry II 1155 and set about recovering the Barony of Oswestry, by now in Welsh hands; founder of Haughmond Abbey; m. 1st Christian, possibly a niece of Robert FitzRoy, 1st Earl of Goucester of the 1122 cr., illegitimate son of Henry I, and had a daughter (Christian, m Hugh Pantulf); m 2nd Isabel....daughter and heir of Ingram de Say, feudal Lord of Clun, Salop and d. 1160. [Burke's Peerage]

--------------------------------------

The Lordship of Clun in Shropshire belonged, temp. Stephen, to Ellis de Say, whose daughter and heir, Isabel, brought it to her husband, William FitzAlan, feudal Lord of Oswaldestre (ie. Oswestry) in that co., who d. abt 1210. Their son and heir, William FitzAlan, Lord of Clun and Oswestry, dsp 1216, and was succeeded by his brother and heir, John FitzAlan, Lord of Cluny and Oswestry, who m. Isabel, sister (whose issue became coheirs) of Hugh d'Aubigny, Earl of Arundel. This John FitzAlan d. 1240, and was succeeded by his son and heir, John FitzAlan, feudal Lord of Clun and Oswestry, to whom (jure maris) the Castle and Honour of Arundel were awarded, 27 Nov 1243, whereby, according to the admission of 1433, he became Earl of Arundel. . . [Complete Peerage, III:335 as corrected by XIV:194]

NOTE: The above account by CP is wrong in its handling of the FitzAlan descendancy:

Isabel de Say's husband was William FitzAlan (d. 1160). Their son William FitzAlan died in 1210 and was succeeded by his son William, who died at Easter 1215, and whose brother and heir was John, as given above. [Some Corrections & Additions to the Complete Peerage]

---------------------------------------

William FitzAlan, in the contest between King Stephen and the Empress Maud, being then governor of Shrewsbury and sheriff of the county of Salop, held the castle of Shrewsbury for the latter until it was taken by assault. He was also with the empress at the siege of Winchester Castle in the 6th Stephen [1141], when she and her whole army were put to flight; and afterwards, continuing to adhere stoutly to the same cause, he was reconstituted sheriff of Salop so soon as King Henry attained the crown. This William m. Isabel, dau. and heir of Helias de Say, Lady of Clun, niece of Robert, Earl of Gloucester, and dying some time before 1160, was s. by his son, William FitzAlan. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited, and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 200, Fitz-Alan, Earls of Arundel, Barons Maltravers]

William married Christian Of GLOUCESTER 1255,1338 about 1135 in 1st Wife.1255 Christian was born about 1118 in Bristol, Gloucestershire, England.

The child from this marriage was:

4022181157       i.  Christian FITZALAN (born in 1145 in Oswestry Castle, Shropshire, England)

William next married Isabel De SAY 980,1255,1338 before 1146 in 1st Husband 2ND Wife 1255.,1338 Isabel was born in 1135 in Clun, Shropshire, England and died about 1199 1255,1338 about age 64.

The child from this marriage was:

4022182320       i.  William FITZALAN Lord Of Oswestry & Clun, Sir (born before 1154 in Oswestry Castle, Shropshire, England - died in 1210 in Clun, Shropshire, England)


8044362315. Christian Of GLOUCESTER,415,1255,1338 daughter of Robert De CAEN 1st Earl Of Gloucester and Mabel FITZHAMON, was born about 1118 in Bristol, Gloucestershire, England.

General Notes: Christian, according to all of my sources, is not a daughter, but a niece of Robert Earl of Gloucester. However, since I am not sure if she is daughter of one of Robert's brothers/sisters, or of Robert's wife's brothers/sisters, I am attaching Christian to Robert himself, as the safest place to "park her" until such time as her actual parents are determined. @@check ancestry

Christian married William FITZALAN Lord Of Oswestry 980,1255,1337,1338 about 1135 in 1st Wife.1255 William was born about 1105 in Oswestry Castle, Shropshire, England and died in 1160 in Oswestry Castle, Shropshire, England 1255,1337,1338 about age 55.

8044362316. Fulk II FITZWARIN Of Whittington & Alveston 415,682,1257 was born about 1138 in Whittington, Oswestry, Shropshire, England and died after 6 November 1194 in Alveston, Thornbury, Gloucestershire, England 682,1257.

General Notes: (c) . . . Fulk fitz Warin (living in Nov 1194), married Hawise, daughter and coheir of Josce de Dinan. The last named Fulk was son and heir of Fulk fitz Warin of Whittington and Alveston, who d. in 1170 or 1171, son of the shadowy or mythical Warin, of Metz in Lorraine. [Complete Peerage V:495 note (c)]

----------------------

The following is excerpted from a post to SGM, 3 Jan 2004, by John Ravilious:

1.1 Fulk fitz Warin

Death: aft 6 Nov 1194,

of Whittington, co. Salop and Alveston, co. Gloucester.

'Fulko, son of Fulko fitz Warin', held the manor of Alveston at Michaelmas 1171 [Delafield p. 608, cites Eyton[5]; 1171 Pipe Roll]

'Fulcho, son of Fulcho fitz Warin', gave a virgate and a half in Tadlow, Cambs. to Shrewsbury Abbey, 'to set at rest a controversy concerningthe patronage of the Church of Alberburi ' (witnesses: Ralph, Richard and Warin, sons of Fulcho) [Delafield p. 608[6], cites Eyton VI:103]

'In 1194 Fulk II, Hawise [de Dinan, his wife], Sibil, and Alan de Plugenay brought a suit of mort d'ancestor against Herbert Fitz Herbert for the manor of Stanton (now Stanton Fitzwarren), and a more detailed record of this suit indicates that Herbert was also being sued for the manor Calstone..... Apparently Fitz Herbert won the first round of the suit, for in a new round of lawsuits beginning in 1228, Fulk III is listedas the plaintiff and Peter Fitz Herbert (Herbert Fitz Herbert's son) is referred to as the tenant of Stanton.' (Meisel, p. 94)

named in gift of son Fulk fitz Warin of land for his foundation at
Alberbury ca. 1220-1230, made
' pro anime mee &.... Fulconis patris mee ...'
(Nichols III/1, p. 332 charter 2)[4]
[dated by Meisel as '1221-26' - p. 91]

~ usually called 'Fulk II'

Spouse: Hawise de Dinan
Death: 1218
Father: Josce de Dinan (-1167)
Marr: bef 1178

Children: Sir Fulk (<1178->1250)
Philip
William (->1228)
John
Richard
Alan

Fulk married Hawise De DINAN 682,1257 before 1178.682 Hawise was born about 1146 in Dinan, Ille-Et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France and died in 1218 682 about age 72.

The child from this marriage was:

4022181158       i.  Fulk III FITZWARIN Of Whittington & Lambourn (born before 1178 in Lambourn, Hungerford, Berkshire, England - died after 8 October 1250 in Whittington, Oswestry, Shropshire, England)


8044362317. Hawise De DINAN 415,682,1257 was born about 1146 in Dinan, Ille-Et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France and died in 1218 682 about age 72.

Hawise married Fulk II FITZWARIN Of Whittington & Alveston 682,1257 before 1178.682 Fulk was born about 1138 in Whittington, Oswestry, Shropshire, England and died after 6 November 1194 in Alveston, Thornbury, Gloucestershire, England 682,1257.

8044362318. Sir Robert Le VAVASOUR 2nd Lord Of Haselwood,235,309,399,415,425,505,662,803,804,805,806,807,808 son of Sir William Le VAVASOUR Of Hazlewood, Sir Knight and Matilda PERRY, was born about 1160 in Hazlewood And Storiths, Skipton, Yorkshire, England and died in 1231 in Hazlewood And Storiths, Skipton, Yorkshire, England 425,803 about age 71.

General Notes:
Robert; Deputy for Sheriff of Lancs 1197; allowed York Minster a right of way to transport quarried stone across his land at Hazlewood, Yorks, c1225; married 1st ? and had [Maud]. Robert le Vavasour married 2nd 1208 Juliane, daughter of Thomas de Multon and widow of Thomas de Rie, and died by 1227, having by her had [John], with perhaps another son Henry. [Burke's Peerage]

--------------------

ROBERT LE VAVASOUR son and heir, was deputy for Theobald Walter, Sheriff of Lancashire in 1197. In March 1204 the King granted him free warren in all his land in Wharfedale; in 1223 he was involved in a case of darrein presentment for the church of Edlington; and circa 1225 he granted to York Minster a right of way to carry stone from Thevesdale quarry, on his land at Hazlewood.

He married, 1stly, (name and parentage unknown) (i). He married, 2ndly, in 1208, Juliane, widow of Thomas DE RIE, daughter of Thomas DE MULTON, by his 1st wife, Sarah, daughter and heir of Richard DE FLETE. He was dead in 1227, when arrangements were made for the wardship and marriage of his son. His widow married, before 30 September 1233, Robert MUSARD. [Complete Peerage XII/2:231-2, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

(i) By this lady he had a daughter Maud, who m. 1stly, Theobald Walter, ancestor of the Butlers, later Earls of Ormund, and 2ndly, in 1207, Fulk FitzWarin.

Robert married Julian De ROS in 1st Wife.425 Julian was born about 1155 in Edlington, Doncaster, Yorkshire, England.

Robert next married Juliane De MULTON,425,803,806,809,810 daughter of Thomas II De MULTON Sir and Sarah De FLETE, in 1208 in 2ND Husband 2ND Wife 425.,803 Juliane was born after 1195 of Sutton, Yorkshire, England, was christened of Steeton, and died after 30 September 1233 in Edlington, Yorkshire, England 803.

Noted events in her life were:

• AKA: Julian De Ros.

8044362319. Julian De ROS,415,505 daughter of Gilbert De ROS Of Edlington and Julian, was born about 1155 in Edlington, Doncaster, Yorkshire, England.

Julian married Sir Robert Le VAVASOUR 2nd Lord Of Haselwood 425,662,803,804,805,806,807,808 in 1st Wife.425 Robert was born about 1160 in Hazlewood And Storiths, Skipton, Yorkshire, England and died in 1231 in Hazlewood And Storiths, Skipton, Yorkshire, England 425,803 about age 71.

8044362320. Madog Ap MAREDUDD King Of Powys,415,505,631,1388,1392 son of Maredudd Ap BLEDDYN and Hunydd Verch EINUDD, was born about 1097 in Powys, Wales and died in 1160 in Winchester, Herefordshire, England 1388,1591 about age 63.

Madog married Susanna VERCH GRUFFYDD AP CYNAN 1392 in 1st Wife. Susanna was born about 1098 in Caernarvonshire, Wales.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Marared Verch MADOG was born about 1129 in Powys-Vadoc, Wales.

4022181160      ii.  Gruffudd "Maelor" Ap MADOG Lord Of Maelor (born about 1133 in Maelor, Wales - died in 1191)

              iii.  Gwenllian Verch MADOG was born about 1135 in Overton-Madoc, Flintshire, Wales.

Madog next married Eva Verch MADOG before 1135 in 2ND Wife. Eva was born about 1110 in Marshbrook, Shropshire, England.

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  Einion Eifell Ap MADOG Lord Of Cynllaith was born about 1136 in Cynllaith, Denbighshire, Wales and died in 1196 about age 60.


8044362321. Susanna VERCH GRUFFYDD AP CYNAN,415,505,631,1392 daughter of Gruffudd Ap CYNAN King Of Gwynedd and Angharat Verch OWAIN, was born about 1098 in Caernarvonshire, Wales.

General Notes:
She was possibly Susanna verch Gruffydd ap Cynan, sister of Owain ap Gruffydd ap Cynan, king of Gwynedd, but Madog had children by other women also. 1591

Susanna married Madog Ap MAREDUDD King Of Powys 1388,1392 in 1st Wife. Madog was born about 1097 in Powys, Wales and died in 1160 in Winchester, Herefordshire, England 1388,1591 about age 63.

Susanna next married in 1st Wife.


8044362322. Owain Gwynedd Ap GRUFFUDD King Of Gwynedd,415,505,631,1034,1387,1388,1389,1390 son of Gruffudd Ap CYNAN King Of Gwynedd and Angharat Verch OWAIN, was born in 1137 in Aberffraw Castle, Angelesey, Wales,389,390,1034,1391 died in 1170 in Bangor Cathedral, Is Gwyrfai, Caernarvonshire, Wales 389,390,1034,1279,1388,1389,1390 at age 33, and was buried in Bangor Cathedral, Is Gwyrfai, Caernarvonshire, Wales.389,390,1034 Another name for Owain was Owain GWYNEDD King Of North Wales.

General Notes:
King of Gwynedd, or North Wales, 1137-1170. From 1157 he was styled prince of Gwynedd. His death was followed by five years of fighting among his many sons. In 1175 East Gwynedd went to David and West Gwynedd to Rhodri. While England was engaged in civil war, Owain used his skill as statesman and soldier to extend his frontiers. In 1157 Henry II led his first campaign against Owain, but it ended in a truce. He was required to do homage to Henry but it was not long before Owain was acting with complete independence. When Madog ap Maredudd died in 1160, he attacked Powys and extended his influence to the east. Six years later, the Council of Woodstock attempted to reduce the Welsh princes from client status to that of dependent vassalage, and the subsequent uprising was led by Owain and Rhys ap Gruffydd of south Wales. Henry's second attempt at subduing Wales failed ignominiously and left Owain free to capture Basingwerk and Rhuddlan castles in 1166-67. In 1168 he began negotiations with Louis VII of France to build an alliance between Gwynedd and France against their common enemy, England. It was a course which required great finesse and firm judgement. In one direction it pointed to a policy which would be used to good effect by later rulers of Gwynedd, the search for recognition and an alliance in Europe. Having openly defied Henry in 1168 by offering to help Louis, Owain maintained his independent position until his death. He left behind him a reputation of wisdom and magnanimity.

The reign of Owain Gwynedd marks the most peaceful period of Welsh independence, when the native princes absorbed many of the current European reforming ideas and adapted the more effective structures of both church and state to their own society. Monastic foundations were encouraged, diocesan boundaries defined, and many stone churches built. Motte-and-bailey earthwork castles identical to those built earlier by the Norman invaders were now erected by the princes as the centers of many of their personal estates. Two of Owain's sons are credited with building the first stone castles in Gwynedd towards the end of the 12th century. The tragedy, recurrent in Welsh history, was that Owain was not followed immediately by a strong ruler. Upon his death in 1170, open warfare broke out between his sons. Dafydd and Rhodri killed their elder half-brother, Hywel, and for the next 20 years Gwynedd was divided between them and their kinsmen. Gwynedd and Wales would not see another strong leader until Llywelyn the Great extended his control over most of Wales in the later part of the century. 1346,1389

Noted events in his life were:

• Title: Prince of North Wales, , , , North Wales. 390,417,1387

Owain married Gwladus Verch LLYWARCH 1034,1389,1390 about 1124 in 1st Wife 389,390,1387.,1391 Gwladus was born about 1098 in Pembroke, Montgomershire, Wales 389,390,1034 and died before 1155.

Owain next married Christina Verch GRONW 1390 before 1155 in 2ND Wife.1391 Christina was born about 1125 in Wales.

Owain next married in 1st Wife.1391

Owain next married Gwenllian Verch EDNYWAIN about 1105 in <, , Caernarvonshire, Wales> 389,390.,1387 Gwenllian was born about 1089 in <Llandwrog, Uwch Gwyrfai, Caernarvon, Wales>.389,390

Owain next married Morfudd Verch MERWYDD about 1110 389,390.,1387 Morfudd was born about 1087 in <, , Caernarvonshire, Wales>.389,390

Owain next married Cristin Verch GRONWY about 1126 in <, , Caernarvonshire, Wales> 389,390.,1387 Cristin was born about 1105 in <, Tegeingl, Flint, Wales>.389,390

Owain next married Angharad Verch PEREDUR about 1114 389,390.,1387 Angharad was born about 1091.389,390

Owain next married Ffynnod WYDDELES about 1114 389,390.,1387 Ffynnod was born about 1090.389,390

Owain next married Anedd Verch GWRGI about 1114 389,390.,1387 Anedd was born about 1090.389,390

Owain next married Afandreg Verch GWRGI about 1114 389,390.,1387 Afandreg was born about 1091.389,390

Owain next married Morfudd Verch ELFAN about 1114 389,390.,1387 Morfudd was born about 1090.389,390

8044362323. Christina Verch GRONW,415,505,1390 daughter of Gronw Ap OWAIN and Unknown, was born about 1125 in Wales.

Christina married Owain Gwynedd Ap GRUFFUDD King Of Gwynedd 1034,1388,1389,1390 before 1155 in 2ND Wife.1391 Owain was born in 1137 in Aberffraw Castle, Angelesey, Wales,389,390,1034,1391 died in 1170 in Bangor Cathedral, Is Gwyrfai, Caernarvonshire, Wales 389,390,1034,1279,1388,1389,1390 at age 33, and was buried in Bangor Cathedral, Is Gwyrfai, Caernarvonshire, Wales.389,390,1034 Another name for Owain was Owain GWYNEDD King Of North Wales.

8044362324. Rhys Ab IFOR 415 was born about 1125 in Cantrefselyf, Wales.

Rhys married.

The child from this marriage was:

4022181162       i.  Ithel Ap RHYS (born about 1155 in Powys, Montgomeryshire, Wales)


8044362326. Hywel "Fychan" Ap HYWEL 415 was born about 1125 in Wales.

Hywel married.

The child from this marriage was:

4022181163       i.  Gwenllian Verch HYWEL (born about 1155 in Wales)


8044362328. Liulf De AUDLEY Sheriff Of Chester,415,1265 son of Adam De AUDLEY and Unknown, was born about 1120 in Audley, Staffordshire, England and died after 1154 1265. Another name for Liulf was Lidulf (Liluph) De ALDITHELEY.

General Notes: Liulf de Audley (father of Adam de Audley, brother of William I de Stanley), living temp. Stephen I and Henry II. [Burke's Peerage]

-----------------------------------------------------------

Lidulf, son and heir [of Adam de Aldithley], sheriff of Cheshire temp. King Stephen [reigned 1135-1154]. [John Burke, History of the Commoners of Great Britain and Ireland, Vol. IV, R. Bentley, London, 1834, p. 757, Stansfeld, of Burley Park]

Liulf married about 1142 in Heligh, Audley, Staffordshire, England.

The child from this marriage was:

4022181164       i.  Adam De AUDLEY (born about 1147 in Audley, Staffordshire, England - died after 1203)


8044362330. Ralph FITZORM Of Darlaston & Okeover,415,592,1592 son of Orm A Staffordshire THANE and Unknown, was born about 1120 in Darlaston, Walsall, Staffordshire, England and died in Okeover, Ashbourne, Staffordshire, England. Another name for Ralph was Ralph De OKEOVER.

Ralph married Lettice De MONTGOMERY Heiress Of Snelston.592 Lettice was born about 1130 in Snelston, Ashbourne, Derbyshire, England.

The child from this marriage was:

4022181165       i.  Emma FITZORM (born about 1150 in Darlaston, Walsall, Staffordshire, England)


8044362331. Lettice De MONTGOMERY Heiress Of Snelston,415,592 daughter of William MONTGOMERY Of Ecton and Unknown, was born about 1130 in Snelston, Ashbourne, Derbyshire, England.

Lettice married Ralph FITZORM Of Darlaston & Okeover 592.,1592 Ralph was born about 1120 in Darlaston, Walsall, Staffordshire, England and died in Okeover, Ashbourne, Staffordshire, England. Another name for Ralph was Ralph De OKEOVER.

8044362332. Roger De MAINWARING Of Warmincham,415,505 son of Mr MAINWARING Of Warmincham and Unknown, was born about 1130 in Warmingham, Cheshire, England.

Roger married Ellen. Ellen was born about 1133 in Warmingham, Cheshire, England.

Children from this marriage were:

4022181166       i.  Ralph De MAINWARING Of Warmincham, Justice (born in 1155 in Warmingham, Cheshire, England - died after 1210)

               ii.  Miss MAINWARING was born about 1163 in Warmingham, Cheshire, England.

              iii.  Robert MAINWARING Of Rosthorn was born about 1168 in Warmingham, Cheshire, England and died in Rosthorn, Cheshire, England.


8044362333. Ellen 415,505 was born about 1133 in Warmingham, Cheshire, England.

Ellen married Roger De MAINWARING Of Warmincham. Roger was born about 1130 in Warmingham, Cheshire, England.

8044362334. Hugh De KEVELIOC 3rd Earl Of Chester,415,505,922,1022,1023,1024,1025,1026 son of Ranulph De GERNON 2nd Earl Of Chester and Maud Fitzrobert De CAEN Countess Of Chester, was born in 1147 in Kevelioc (Cyfeiliog), Monmouthshire, Wales,389,390,1024,1026 died on 30 June 1181 in Leeke, Staffordshire, England 389,390,1022,1024,1026 at age 34, and was buried in , Chester, Cheshire, England.389,390 Another name for Hugh was 06th\3Rd Earl Of CHESTER Hugh De Kevelioc.

General Notes:
EARLDOM OF CHESTER (VI, 3)
Hugh, styled "OF KEVELIOC," EARL OF CHESTER, also VICOMTE D'AVRANCHES, &c., in Normandy, son and heir born at Kevelioc [?Machynlleth], co. Merioneth. He joined in the rebellion against King Henry II, set on foot by Henry, the son of that King, and was taken prisoner at Alnwick, 13 July 1174. He was deprived of his Earldom, and was again in rebellion both in England and Normandy, but, in January 1177, was restored. He married, in 1169, Bertrade, then aged 14 (the King giving her away in marriage "because she was his own cousin "), daughter of Simon de Montfort, Count D'EVREUX by his 1st wife, Maud. He died at Leek, co. Stafford, 30 June 1181, aged about 34 and was buried at St. Werburg's, Chester. His widow died 1227, aged about 7I. [Complete Peerage III:167, XIV:170, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

-------------------------------------------------------------------------- -----------

This nobleman, Hugh (Keveliok), 3rd Earl of Chester, joined in the rebellion of the Earl of Lancaster and the King of Scots against King Henry II, and in support of that monarch's son, Prince Henry's pretensions to the crown. In which proceeding he was taken prisoner with the Earl of Leicester at Alnwick, but obtained his freedom soon afterwards upon the king's reconciliation with the young prince. Again, however, hoisting the standard of revolt both in England and Normandy, with as little success, he was again seized and then detained a prisoner for some years. He eventually, however, obtained his liberty and restoration of his lands when public tranquility became completely reestablished some time about the 23rd year of the king's reign. His lordship m. Bertred, dau. of Simon, Earl of Evereux, in Normandy, and had issue, I. Ranulph, his successor; I. Maud, m. to David, Earl of Huntingdon, brother of William, King of Scotland, and had one son and four daus., viz., 1. John, surnamed le Scot, who s. to the Earldom of Chester, d. s. p. 7 June, 1237; 1. Margaret, m. to Alan de Galloway, and had a dau., Devorguilla, m. to John de Baliol, and was mother of John de Baliol, declared King of Scotland in the reign of Edward I; 2. Isabel, m. to Robert de Brus, and was mother of Robert de Brus, who contended for the crown of Scotland, temp. Edward I; 3. Maud, d. unm.; Ada, m. to Henry de Hastings, one of the competitors for the Scottish crown, temp. Edward I; II. Mabill, m. to William de Albini, Earl of Arundel; III. Agnes, m. to William de Ferrers, Earl of Derby; IV. Hawise, m. to Robert, son of Sayer de Quincy, Earl of Winchester.

The earl had another dau., whose legitimacy is questionable, namely, Amicia,* m. to Ralph de Mesnilwarin, justice of Chester, "a person," says Dugdale, "of very ancient family," from which union the Mainwarings, of Over Peover, in the co. Chester, derive. Dugdale considers Amicia to be a dau. of the earl by a former wife. But Sir Peter Leicester, in his Antiquities of Chester, totally denies her legitimacy. "I cannot but mislike," says he, "the boldness and ignorance of that herald who gave to Mainwaring (late of Peover), the elder, the quartering of the Earl of Chester's arms; for if he ought of right to quarter that coat, then must he be descended from a co-heir to the Earl of Chester; but he was not; for the co-heirs of Earl Hugh married four of the greatest peers in the kingdom."

The earl d. at Leeke, in Staffordshire, in 1181, and was s. by his only son, Ranulph, surnamed Blundevil (or rather Blandevil) from the place of his birth, the town of Album Monasterium, modern Oswestry, in Powys), as 4th Earl of Chester.

* Upon the question of this lady's legitimacy there was a long paper war between Sir Peter Leicester and Sir Thomas Mainwaring---and eventually the matter was referred to the judges, of whose decision Wood says, "at an assize held at Chester, 1675, the controversy was decided by the justices itinerant, who, as I have heard, adjudged the right of the matter to Mainwaring." [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, pp. 365-6, Meschines, Earls of Chester]

Noted events in his life were:

• Title: Viscount of Avranches, , Avranches, Manche, France. 390,417

Hugh married Bertrade De MONTFORT Countess Of Chester 1022,1024,1026 in 1169 in Montfort-Sur-Risle, Eure, Normandy, France 389,390,1022,1024.,1026 Bertrade was born about 1155 in Montfort-L'amaury, Yvelines, Ile-DE-France, France 389,390,1022,1026 and died on 12 July 1227 in Evreux, Eure, Normandy, France 389,390,1022,1026 about age 72.

8044362335. Bertrade De MONTFORT Countess Of Chester,415,505,1022,1024,1026 daughter of Simon III Chauve De MONTFORT Count D'evreux and Maud D'ÉVREUX, was born about 1155 in Montfort-L'amaury, Yvelines, Ile-DE-France, France 389,390,1022,1026 and died on 12 July 1227 in Evreux, Eure, Normandy, France 389,390,1022,1026 about age 72.

General Notes:
He [Hugh of Kevelioc" married, in 1169, Bertrade, then aged 14 (the King giving her away in marriage "because she was his own cousin "), daughter of Simon de Montfort, Count D'EVREUX by his 1st wife, Maud. He died at Leek, co. Stafford, 30 June 1181, aged about 34 and was buried at St. Werburg's, Chester. His widow died 1227, aged about 7I. [Complete Peerage III:167, XIV:170, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Note: CP VII Appendix D:716 states that Simon de Montfort only had one wife. His son, a previously unknown Simon, was married to the supposed 2nd wife, Amice de Beaumont as his only wife. See notes under Bertrade's father and brother (both named Simon).

Bertrade married Hugh De KEVELIOC 3rd Earl Of Chester 922,1022,1023,1024,1025,1026 in 1169 in Montfort-Sur-Risle, Eure, Normandy, France 389,390,1022,1024.,1026 Hugh was born in 1147 in Kevelioc (Cyfeiliog), Monmouthshire, Wales,389,390,1024,1026 died on 30 June 1181 in Leeke, Staffordshire, England 389,390,1022,1024,1026 at age 34, and was buried in , Chester, Cheshire, England.389,390 Another name for Hugh was 06th\3Rd Earl Of CHESTER Hugh De Kevelioc.

8044362342. William De TURVILLE 415 was born about 1148 in Weston, Turville, Buckinghamshire, England and died before 1222.

William married Isabella. Isabella was born about 1148 in England.

The child from this marriage was:

4022181171       i.  Cecily De TURVILLE (born about 1172 in Weston, Turville, Buckinghamshire, England)


8044362343. Isabella 415 was born about 1148 in England.

Isabella married William De TURVILLE. William was born about 1148 in Weston, Turville, Buckinghamshire, England and died before 1222.


8044363792. Thomas "The Pilgrim" CORBET Viscount Of Pontesbury,415 son of Simon CORBET Lord Of Caus & Wattlesboro and Unknown, was born about 1149 in Pontesbury, , Shropshire, England.389,390

Thomas married about 1169 in <Watlesborough, Cardeston, Shropshire, England> 389.,390

The child from this marriage was:

4022181896       i.  Sir Richard CORBET Lord Of Wattlesboro (born about 1170 in <Watlesborough, Cardeston, Shropshire, England> - died before 1225)


8044363796. Peter FITZTORET Of Moreton Toret,415,505,631,633,910 son of Thoredi FITZTORET Of Moreton Toret and Unknown, was born about 1135 in Moreton Corbet, Wem, Shropshire, England 633 and died about 1194 633 about age 59.

General Notes:
He first appears in 1160. He was one of the larger tenants in Shropshire. He was probably dead by 1194. He was probably the grandson or great grandson of Toret, a Shropshire tenant during the time of Edward the Confessor who later, during the reign of William I, and surviving into the reign of Henry I, held his estates under Robert FitzTurold. Toret was the Saxon lord of Wroxeter and Eaton at Domesday, living about 1060-1110. 633

Peter married Lucia HAGET 633.,910 Lucia was born about 1138 in Healaugh, Wetherby, West Riding Yorkshire, England and died before 1205 633.

The child from this marriage was:

4022181898       i.  Bartholomew DE MORETON Of Morton Toret (born about 1169 of Moreton Toret, Shropshire, England - died by 1235)


8044363797. Lucia HAGET,415,505,631,633,910 daughter of Bertram HAGET Of Helagh and Unknown, was born about 1138 in Healaugh, Wetherby, West Riding Yorkshire, England and died before 1205 633.

Lucia married Peter FITZTORET Of Moreton Toret 633.,910 Peter was born about 1135 in Moreton Corbet, Wem, Shropshire, England 633 and died about 1194 633 about age 59.

8044363864. William "Strong Hand" D' AUBIGNY Earl Arundel 1593,1594,1595 was born about 1103 in Buckenham, Wayland, Norfolk, England,1595 died on 12 October 1176 in Waverly Abbey, Surrey, England 1595,1596 about age 73, and was buried in Wymondham Priory, Norfolk, England. Other names for William were 04th\1St Earl Of ARUNDEL William D'aubigny, 01st Earl Of LINCOLN William D'aubigny, and1597 01st Earl Of SUSSEX William D'aubigny.923

General Notes: On the Earldom of Lincoln, previous creations: [Burke's Peerage, p. 1711]:

Henry I's widow Adeliz married in 1138 William d'Aubigny, who the next year, probably as a result, was created Earl of Lincoln. William's father was a Norman immigrant to England in Henry I's reign. His son, who by this advantageous marriage came into the former Queen's dowry of Arundel Castle, together with its Honour (feudal administrative unit embodying several knight's fees), has been held thereby to have become Earl of Arundel. By 1142 he had been deprived of his Earldom of Lincoln, indeed even before, was spoken sometimes as Earl of Arundel and sometimes as Earl of Chichester or Earl of Sussex.

-----------------------------------------------

EARLDOM OF SUSSEX (I) 1141

EARLDOM OF LINCOLN (I) circa 1139 to 1141

EARLDOM OF ARUNDEL (IV, 1) 1138 or 1139 to 1176

WILLIAM D'AUBIGNY) de Albiniaco or in the Anglo-Latin of Dugdale and other writers, DE ALBINI, surnamed "the strong hand," Lord of the manor of Buckenham, Norfolk, son and heir of William D'Aubigny (died 1139) Pincerna Regis, by Maud, daughter of Roger LE BIGOD, probably by his 2nd wife, Alice, sister and coheir of William de Tosny, Lord of Belvoir, daughter of Robert de Tosny of the same, was born early in the reign of Henry I. On his marriage with the Queen Dowager, he acquired with her , in 1138 or 1139, the Castle and Honour of Arundel, which had been settled on her in dower, whereby it may be considered that, according to the admission of 1433, he became EARL OF ARUNDEL. There is conclusive evidence from various charters, that at, or about the time of, and probably soon after, his said marriage, he was recognised as EARL OF LINCOLN, and he may be assumed to have been so created in the summer of 1139. In this year he gave shelter to the Empress Maud, at Arundel Castle, but ever after adhered to Stephen. He can be shown to have very soon lost the Earldom of Lincoln, and in 1141 he attested a charter of Stephen as EARL OF SUSSEX, (being from time to time thereafter so described, as, e.g. where he witnesses a charter to the Abbey of Barking under that name) and may be assumed to have been so created by Stephen in 1141, after that King had regained his freedom. Early in 114,2, the Earldom of Lincoln had already passed to another, viz. William de Roumare. In his own later charters he is styled, and in a charter, before 1150, of the Queen Dowager to the Abbey of Reading, she styles him EARL OF CHICHESTER. He was influential in arranging the treaty of 1153, whereby the Crown continued with King Stephen for life, though the inheritance thereof was secured to Henry II. To this instrument he subscribed as "Comes Cicestrie." Henry II, by a grant undated, but supposed to have been in 1155 (the year after his accession), confirms to him as "William, EARL OF ARUNDEL, the Castle of Arundel, with the whole honour of Arundel and all its appurtenances," and, by the same instrument, bestows on him the third penny of the pleas of the county of SUSSEX unde Comes est. No doubt, however, he was more generally known as "EARL OF ARUNDEL," and as such (only) he is spoken of by his son and heir (who styles himself Earl of Sussex) in a charter to the Priory of Wymondham; and as Earl of Arundel (only) he is described in the record of his death in the Annals of Waverley. He was justly held in great esteem by Henry II, and was one of the embassy to Rome in 1163/4, and to Saxony (on the espousal of the Princess to the Duke of Saxony) in 1168. He was also in command of the Royal army in August 1173, in Normandy, against the King's rebellious sons, where he distinguished himself for his "swiftness and velocity," and, on 29 September following he assisted at the defeat, near Bury St. Edmunds, of the Earl of Leicester, who, with his Flemings, had invaded Suffolk.

He married, in 1138 (the 3rd year of her widowhood) Adeliz, QUEEN DOWAGER OF ENGLAND (widow of Henry I), 1st daughter of Godefroy à la Barbe, DUKE OF LOTHIER (i.e. Lorraine Inférieure), COUNT OF BRABANT AND LOUVAIN, by his 1st wife, Ide, daughter of Albert III, COUNT OF NAMUR. His wife, the Queen Dowager, retired in 1150 to a nunnery at Afflighem, in South Brabant, where she died, and was buried 23 April 1151, aged about 48. He survived her 25 years, and died 12 October 1176, at Waverley Abbey, Surrey, and was buried, with his father, at Wymondham Priory, Norfolk. [Complete Peerage I:233-35, XIV:37, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

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William de Albini, surnamed "William with the strong hand," from the following circumstance, as related by Dugdale:---

"It happened that the Queen of France, being then a widow, and a very beautify woman, became much in love with a knight of that country, who was a comely person, and in the flower of his youth: and because she thought that no man excelled him in valour, she caused a tournament to be proclaimed throughout her dominions, promising to reward those who should exercise themselves therein, according to their respective demerits; and concluding that if the person whom she so well affected could act his part better than the others in those military exercises, she might marry him without any dishonour to herself. Hereupon divers gallant men, from forrain parts hastening to Paris, amongst others came this our William de Albini, bravely accoutered, and in the tournament excelled all others, overcoming many, and wounding one mortally with his lance, which being observed by the queen, she became exceedingly enamoured of him, and forthwith invited him to a costly banquet, and afterwards bestowing certain jewels upon him, offered him marriage; but, having plighted his troth to the Queen of England, then a widow, he refused her, whereat she grew so much discontented that she consulted with her maids how she might take away his life; and in pursuance of that design, inticed him into a garden, where there was a secret cave, and in it a fierce lion, unto which she descended by divers steps, under colour of shewing him the beast; and when she told him of its fierceness, he answered, that it was a womanish and not a manly quality to be afraid thereof. But having him there, by the advantage of a folding door, thrust him in to the lion; being therefore in this danger, he rolled his mantle about his arm and, putting his hand into the mouth of the beast, pulled out his tongue by the root; which done, he followed the queen to her palace and gave it to one of her maids to present her. Returning thereupon to England, with the fame of this glorious exploit, he was forthwith advanced to the Earldom of Arundel, and for his arms the lion given him."

He subsequently obtained the hand of the Queen Adeliza, relict of King Henry I, and daughter of Godfrey, Duke of Lorraine, which Adeliza had the castle of Arundel in dowry from the deceased monarch, and thus her new lord became its feudal earl. The earl was one of those who solicited the Empress Maud to come to England, and received her and her brother, Robert, Earl of Gloucester, at the port of Arundel, in August, 1139, and in three years afterwards (1142), in the report made of King Stephen's taking William de Mandevil at St. Albans, it is stated -- "that before he could be laid hold on, he underwent a sharp skirmish with the king's party, wherein the Earl of Arundel, though a stout and expert soldier, was unhorsed in the midst of the water by Walkeline de Oxeai, and almost drowned." In 1150, his lordship wrote himself Earl of Chichester, but we find him styled again Earl of Arundel, upon a very memorable occasion -- namely, the reconciliation of Henry Duke of Normandy (afterwards Henry II) and King Stephen at the siege of Wallingford Castle in 1152. "It was scarce possible," says Rapin, "for the armies to part without fighting. Accordingly the two leaders were preparing for battle with equal ardour, when, by the prudent advice of the Earl of Arundel, who was on the king's side, they were prevented from coming to blows." A truce and peace followed this interference of the earl's, which led to the subsequent accession of Henry after Stephen's decease, in whose favour the Earl stood so high that he not only obtained for himself and his heirs the castle and honour of Arundel, but a confirmation of the Earldom of Sussex, of which county he was really earl, by a grant of the Tertium Denarium of the pleas of that shire. In 1164, we find the Earl of Arundel deputed with Gilbert Foliot, bishop of London, to remonstrate with Lewis, King of France, upon affording an asylum to Thomas à Becket within his dominion, and on the failure of that mission, despatched with the archbishop of York, the bishops of Winchester, London, Chichester, and Exeter, -- Wido Rufus, Richard de Invecestre, John de Oxford (priests) -- Hugh de Gundevile, Bernard de St. Valery, and Henry Fitzgerald, to lay the whole affair of Becket at the foot of the pontifical throne. Upon levying the aid for the marriage of the king's daughter, 12th of Henry II [1165-66], the knights' fees of the honour of Arundel were certified to be ninety-seven, and those in Norfolk belonging to the earl, forty-two. In 1173, we find the Earl of Arundel commanding, in conjunction with William, Earl of Essex, the king's army in Normandy, and compelling the French monarch to abandon Verneuil after a long siege, and in the next year, with Richard de Lucy, justice of England, defeating Robert Earl of Leicester, then in rebellion at St. Edmundsbury. This potent nobleman, after founding and endowing several religious houses, departed this life at Waverley, in Surrey, on the 3 October, 1176, and was buried in the abbey of Wymondham. His lordship left by Adeliza, his wife, widow of King Henry I, four sons and three daughters, the eldest of whom, Alice, m. John, Earl of Ewe. The eldest son, William de Albini, 2nd earl, had a grant from the crow, 23rd Henry II [1177-8] of the Earldom of Sussex, and in the 1st of Richard I [1189-90], had a confirmation from that prince of the castle and honour of Arundel, as also of the Tertium Denarium of the county of Sussex. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited, and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, pp. 2-3, Albini, Earls of Arundel]

William married Adeliza (Adela) Of LOUVAIN 1595,1598,1599 in 1138 in 2ND Husband 1595.,1596 Adeliza was born about 1103 in Brabant, Netherlands,1599 died on 23 April 1151 in Affligem Nunnery, Brabant, Belgium (As A Nun) 1595,1599 about age 48, and was buried in Affligem Abbey, Brabant, Belgium. Another name for Adeliza was Adelicia Of LORRAINE.

Children from this marriage were:

4022181932       i.  William D' AUBIGNY 2nd Earl Of Arundel (born after 1138 in Arundel, Sussex, England - died on 24 December 1193 in Buckenham, Wayland, Norfolk, England)

               ii.  Alice D' AUBIGNY was born about 1139 in Casti Arundel, Sussex, England and died on 11 September 1188 1594 about age 49.

              iii.  Cecily De ARUNDEL was born about 1140 in Arundel, Sussex, England.

               iv.  Matilda D' AUBIGNY was born about 1142 in Arundel, Sussex, England.

                v.  Simon D' AUBIGNY was born in 1144 in Arundel, Sussex, England and died in 1206 at age 62.


8044363865. Adeliza (Adela) Of LOUVAIN,415,670,1595,1598,1599 daughter of Godfrey Count Of LOUVAIN Duke Of Brabant and Ida De Chiny & NAMUR, was born about 1103 in Brabant, Netherlands,1599 died on 23 April 1151 in Affligem Nunnery, Brabant, Belgium (As A Nun) 1595,1599 about age 48, and was buried in Affligem Abbey, Brabant, Belgium. Another name for Adeliza was Adelicia Of LORRAINE.

General Notes: He [William d'Aubigny] married, in 1138 (the 3rd year of her widowhood) Adeliz, QUEEN DOWAGER OF ENGLAND (widow of Henry I), 1st daughter of Godefroy à la Barbe, DUKE OF LOTHIER (i.e. Lorraine Inférieure), COUNT OF BRABANT AND LOUVAIN, by his 1st wife, Ide, daughter of Albert III, COUNT OF NAMUR. His wife, the Queen Dowager, retired in 1150 to a nunnery at Afflighem, in South Brabant, where she died, and was buried 23 April 1151, aged about 48. He survived her 25 years, and died 12 October 1176, at Waverley Abbey, Surrey, and was buried, with his father, at Wymondham Priory, Norfolk. [Complete Peerage I:233-35, XIV:37, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Note: I have Ide, with multiple sources, as daughter of Otto II Count of Chiny, not "Albert III Count of Namur". I have her as granddaughter of Albert III. AR, plus at least two (there are more) postings to soc.genealogy.medieval, agree with my pedigree. AR points to a "Brandenberg 52-56" as the source for inserting Otto II & Adelaide de Namur between Ida of Saxony & Albert III de Namur.

Adeliza married Duke & Lion Of Justice Henry I "Beauclerc" King Of ENGLAND 1598,1600,1601,1602 from 29 January 1120 to 1121 in Windsor Castle, Berkshire, England 1598,1599.,1600 Henry was born in 1068 in Selby, West Riding Yorkshire, England,389,390,1598,1599 was christened on 5 August 1070 in , Selby, Yorkshire, England,389,390 died on 1 December 1135 in , St Denis, Seine-St Denis, France 389,390,1598 at age 67, and was buried from 4 January 1135 to 1136 in Reading Abbey, Reading, Berkshire, England.389,390

Adeliza next married William "Strong Hand" D' AUBIGNY Earl Arundel 1593,1594,1595 in 1138 in 2ND Husband 1595.,1596 William was born about 1103 in Buckenham, Wayland, Norfolk, England,1595 died on 12 October 1176 in Waverly Abbey, Surrey, England 1595,1596 about age 73, and was buried in Wymondham Priory, Norfolk, England. Other names for William were 04th\1St Earl Of ARUNDEL William D'aubigny, 01st Earl Of LINCOLN William D'aubigny, and1597 01st Earl Of SUSSEX William D'aubigny.923

8044363866. James De ST. HILARY Of Dalling, Sir,415,945,1273,1603,1604,1605 son of Unknown and Unknown, was born about 1107 in St-Hilaire-Du-Harcouet, Manche, Normandy, France 389,390,1606 and died about 1154 in Field Dalling, Walsingham, Norfolk, England 390,1273,1606 about age 47.

General Notes:
SAINT-HILAIRE, DE SANCTO HILARIO.

Saint-Hilaire-du-Harcouet: Manche, arr. Mortain.

Documentary proof that James de Sancto Hilario took his name from this place has been given in 'Early Yorkshire Charters', vol. v, pp. 86-7. James was the son of Harculf de St. James, taking his name from St. James-de-Beuvron (arr. Avranches) nearby. Gerville described the remains of the castle at St-Hilaire in 1827. [Origins of Some Anglo-Norman Families]

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The following is copied from a post to SGM, 8 Jan 2003, by Todd Farmerie, in response to a suggestion by Adrian Channing on the parentage of James:

ADRIANCHANNING@aol.com wrote:
> Perhaps the James is the same as the following from DP:

DD, right?

> Petrus de Sancto Hilario
> Son of Harscoit de Saint-James or Saint-Hilaire and Matilda, whom he
> succeeded in Normandy. By his wife Assailitte he had issue James, Harscoit,
> Henry and Philip, although it Harscoit who succeede him by 1168.

According to most reconstructions, the James de St. Hillary in question, father of Maud, is not this son of Peter, but rather Peter's brother James, another son of Harscoit de Saint-James.

James married Aveline De SAINT HILARY 1273 about 1130 in <, , , France> 389.,390 Aveline was born about 1109 in <, Harcourt, Eure, France>.389,390,1606

The child from this marriage was:

4022181933       i.  Maud De ST. HILARY (born about 1137 in Field Dalling, Walsingham, Norfolk, England - died on 24 December 1193 in Buckenham, Wayland, Norfolk, England)


8044363867. Aveline De SAINT HILARY 415,1273 was born about 1109 in <, Harcourt, Eure, France>.389,390,1606

Aveline married James De ST. HILARY Of Dalling, Sir 945,1273,1603,1604,1605 about 1130 in <, , , France> 389.,390 James was born about 1107 in St-Hilaire-Du-Harcouet, Manche, Normandy, France 389,390,1606 and died about 1154 in Field Dalling, Walsingham, Norfolk, England 390,1273,1606 about age 47.

8044364100. Hugh De MORTIMER Lord Of Wigmore,415,505,1607,1608 son of Hugh De MORTIMER Lord Of Wigmore and Unknown First WIFE, was born about 1125 in Chelmarsh, Bridgnorth, Shropshire, England and died before 29 September 1181 in Cleobury Mortimer, Shropshire, England 1607,1608.

General Notes: HUGH DE MORTIMER, brother and heir [of Roger]. When Henry, Duke of Normandy (Henry II), made promises of great grants to Ranulph, Earl of Chester, in 1153, the fees of Hugh de Mortimer (and those of others) in Staffordshire were excepted. On succeeding to the throne in December 1154 Henry required from Mortimer Bridgnorth Castle, which had been in his hands for many years; he refused to surrender it, whereupon the King proceeded in person first to Cleobury, which he took and destrioyed, 17 June 1155, and then to Bridgnorth, which was taken after several days' vigorous assault on 7 July. Some time before 1161 he or his father conceded to Foucarmont gifts made by Hugh and William de St. Germain. In 1167 he was fined £100 in Hants because he refused at the King's command to give up to one of his own knights certain animals taken in distraint when security was offered. He figures in the returns of knights' fees in Normandy of 1172 as owing service of 5 knights and holding himself 13 1/2 knights' fees. The foundation of Wigmore Abbey was completed before Hugh's death. He was also a benefactor to the Templars in Lincolnshire.

He married Maud, widow of Philip DE BELMEIS, daughter and coh. of William MESCHIN, of Skipton-in-Craven (brother of Ranulph I, Earl of Chester), by Cecily, daughter and heir of Robert DE ROMILLY. He died between Michaelmas 1180 and Michaelmas 1181. His widow was living in Richard I's reign. [Complete Peerage IX:270-2, XIV:488, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

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Hugh de Mortimer, being a person of a proud and turbulent spirit, opposed strenuously the accession of King Henry II upon the demise of Stephen, and induced Roger, Earl of Hereford, to fortify his castles of Gloucester and Hereford against the new monarch, himself doing the same with his castles of Cleobury, Wigmore, and Brugges (commonly called Bridgenorth). Whereupon Gilbert Foliot, at that time Bishop of Hereford, addressing himself to the Earl of Hereford, his kinsman, by fair persuasions soon brought him to peaceable submission. But Mortimer continuing obstinate, the king was forced to raise an army and, at the point of the sword, to being him to obedience. Between this rude baron and Joceas de Dynant, at that time Lord of Ludlow, existed a feud, carried to so fierce a pitch that Dynant could not pass safely out of his castle for fear of being taken by Mortimer's men, but it so happened that Mortimer, setting his spies to take all advantages of Dynant, was surprised himself and carried prisoner to Ludlow where he was detained until he paid a ransom of 3,000 marks of silver. He was oftentimes engaged against the Welsh and he erected some strong castles in Wales. He likewise finished the foundation of the abbey of Wigmore, begun by his father, and in his old age became a canon of that house. He m. and had issue, Roger, his successor; Hugh, who m. Felicia de Sancto Sydonio, and had, by her, by gift of his father, the manors of Sudbury and Chelmers; Ralph; and William. He d. in 1188 and was s. by his eldest son, Roger de Mortimer, Lord of Wigmore. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage Ltd, London, England, 1883, p. 383, Mortimer, Barons Mortimer, of Wigmore, Earls of March]

Hugh married Maud Le MESCHIN 1608,1610,1611 before 1156 in 2ND Husband 1608.,1609 Maud was born about 1131 in Skipton-In-Craven, Yorkshire, England and died after 1189 1608.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Hugh De MORTIMER Of Wigmore was born about 1156 in Wigmore, Ludlow, Herefordshire, England and died after 1176 in (Dvp & Sp) 1612.

4022182050      ii.  Roger De MORTIMER Lord Of Wigmore, Sir (born in 1158 in Wigmore, Ludlow, Herefordshire, England - died before 19 August 1214 in Wigmore Abbey, Herefordshire, England)


8044364101. Maud Le MESCHIN,415,505,1608,1610,1611 daughter of William Le MESCHIN Lord Of Copeland and Cecily De RUMILLY Heiress Skipton & Harewood, was born about 1131 in Skipton-In-Craven, Yorkshire, England and died after 1189 1608.

General Notes:
He [Hugh de Mortimer] married Maud, widow of Philip DE BELMEIS, daughter and coh. of William MESCHIN, of Skipton-in-Craven (brother of Ranulph I, Earl of Chester), by Cecily, daughter and heir of Robert DE ROMILLY. He died between Michaelmas 1180 and Michaelmas 1181. His widow was living in Richard I's reign. [Complete Peerage IX:291-2, XIV:488, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Maud married Phillip De BELMEIS Lord Of Tong & Ashby,1610,1611,1614 son of Walter De BELMEIS Of Harringworth & Tong and Unknown, before 1139 in 1st Husband.1613 Phillip was born before 1106 of Ashby, Leicestershire & Tong, Shropshire, England 1613 and died before 1155.

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  Alice De BELMEIS Heiress Of Ashby & Tong was born about 1150 of Ashby, Leicestershire & Tong, Shropshire, England.

Maud next married Hugh De MORTIMER Lord Of Wigmore 1607,1608 before 1156 in 2ND Husband 1608.,1609 Hugh was born about 1125 in Chelmarsh, Bridgnorth, Shropshire, England and died before 29 September 1181 in Cleobury Mortimer, Shropshire, England 1607,1608.

8044364102. William De FERRERS 3rd Earl Of Derby,415,505,1615 son of Robert De FERRERS 2nd Earl Of Derby and Margaret PEVEREL, was born in 1140 in Tutbury, Burton-On-Trent, Staffordshire, England and died before 21 October 1190 in Siege Of Acre, Jerusalem, Palestine 1615,1616. Other names for William were 03rd Earl Of DERBY William De Ferrieres, and William De FERRIERES 3rd Earl Of Derby.1616

General Notes: EARLDOM OF DERBY (III) 115?

WILLIAM [DE FERRIERES], EARL OF DERBY, or EARL OF FERRIERES, son and heir. He was one of the adherents of the younger Henry on his rebellion in April 1173, and sacked and burnt Nottingham in May or June 1174. He made his submission to the King at Northampton, 31 July 1174, surrendering his castles of Tutbury and Duffield (c). The King took him, with other prisoners, to France in August following, and imprisoned them at Caen.

He married Sibyl, daughter of William de Braiose, Lord of Bramber, by Bertha (heiress of Brecon and Over Gwent), sister and coheir of William DE HEREFORD, and 2nd daughter of Miles (DE GLOUCESTER), EARL OF HEREFORD (e). He died on Crusade, at the siege of Acre, in palestine, in 1190, before 21 October. His wife survived him, and married 2ndly Adam de Port, Lord of Basing, who died 1213, and was, perhaps, living as late as 5 February 1227/8. [Complete Peerage IV:192-4, XIV:250, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

(c) Tutbury Castle was one of those which the King caused to be demolished in Dec 1175.

(e) "Robertus (sic) Comes de Ferrieres. . . . The mistake of writing 'Robertus'--instead of 'Willelmus'--in this transcript has been the principal source of error in the various pedigrees of the Earls of Derby that have been put forward. For mistake it must be. In what may be called the official account 'de farsifacte Willelmi de Boasa (son of the William mentioned in the text) in 1208, it is twice mentioned that 'W. Comes de Ferariis was nepos suus.' And the Earl is one of the witnesses to the truth of the document. Now it is perfectly certain that the Earl of Ferrieres living in 1208 was son of a William, and not of a Robert. It appears, however, that this whole charter is a fabication by Vincent. Apart from giving the wrong name to the Earl, the charter is nearly identical to one of Robert de Stafford for Bordersley Abbey. This charter being the sole evidence for the marriage of Earl William, it now does not appear whom he did marry. [last 3 sentences added by XIV:250)

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William de Ferrers, 3rd Earl of Derby, rebelled against Henry II and marching at the head of the Leicestershire men (19th Henry II) upon Nottingham, then kept for the king by Reginald de Luci, got possession of the town which he sacked, putting the greater part of the inhabitants to the sword and taking the rest prisoners. He was soon afterwards, however, reduced to submission and obliged to surrender to the crown his castles in Tutbury and Duffield, which were demolished by order of the king. His lordship m. Sibilla, dau. of William de Braose, Lord of Abergavenny and Brecknock, by whom he had issue. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited, and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 196, Ferrers, Earls of Derby]

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There is substantial confusion over his name. See The Complete Peerage Vol. 4, p 193 for an account. Personally, I feel there could have been two brothers, William and Robert, Robert being the Earl and when he died at Acre his nephew William [son of his brother William] succeeded, but no documents support this theory! In The Complete Peerage vol. XIV, p. 250 it is suggested that Robert is a fabrication by Vincent, Earl of Ferrieres. [Brian Tompsett, Directory of Royal Genealogical Data, http://www.dcs.hull.ac.uk/cgi-bin/gedlkup/n=royal?royal04492]

William married Sybil De BRAOSE 1615,1616,1617 about 1167 in 1st Husband.1616 Sybil was born in 1150 in Bramber, Sussex, England and died from after 5 February 1227 to 1228 1615,1616.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  William De FERRERS 4th Earl Of Derby was born before 1170 in Tutbury, Burton-On-Trent, Staffordshire, England 1029 and died on 22 September 1247 in Duffield, Belper, Derbyshire, England 1028,1029. Other names for William were 04th Earl Of DERBY William De Ferrieres, and William De FERRIERES 4th Earl Of Derby.1029

4022182051      ii.  Millicent De FERRERS (born about 1171 in Derby, Derbyshire, England - died about 1190)

              iii.  Agatha De FERRERS was born about 1175 in Tutbury, Burton-On-Trent, Staffordshire, England.

               iv.  Pernell (Petronella) De FERRERS was born before 1191 in Tutbury, Burton-On-Trent, Staffordshire, England and died after 1237 in Stone Priory, Staffordshire, England 1618.


8044364103. Sybil De BRAOSE,415,505,1615,1616,1617 daughter of William II De BRAOSE 10th Lord Of Abergavenny and Bertha De GLOUCESTER Heiress Of Brecon, was born in 1150 in Bramber, Sussex, England and died from after 5 February 1227 to 1228 1615,1616.

General Notes: He [William de Ferrieres] married Sibyl, daughter of William de Braiose, Lord of Bramber, by Bertha (heiress of Brecon and Over Gwent), sister and coheir of William DE HEREFORD, and 2nd daughter of Miles (DE GLOUCESTER), EARL OF HEREFORD. He died on Crusade, at the siege of Acre, in palestine, in 1190, before 21 October. His wife survived him, and married 2ndly Adam de Port, Lord of Basing, who died 1213, and was, perhaps, living as late as 5 February 1227/8. [Complete Peerage IV:192-4, XIV:250, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Sybil married William De FERRERS 3rd Earl Of Derby 1615 about 1167 in 1st Husband.1616 William was born in 1140 in Tutbury, Burton-On-Trent, Staffordshire, England and died before 21 October 1190 in Siege Of Acre, Jerusalem, Palestine 1615,1616. Other names for William were 03rd Earl Of DERBY William De Ferrieres, and William De FERRIERES 3rd Earl Of Derby.1616

Sybil next married Adam De PORT Lord Of Basing, Sir 1605,1619,1620 after 1190 in 2ND Husband 2ND Wife.1617 Adam was born before September 1151 in Basing, Hampshire, England 1621 and died after 25 June 1213 1622.


8044364108. Roger De BEAUMONT 2nd Earl Of Warwick,415,531,1583,1585,1587 son of Henry De BEAUMONT 1st Earl Of Warwick and Unknown, was born before 15 April 1102 in Warwick Castle, Warwickshire, England 531,1583 and died on 12 June 1153 in Warwick Castle, Warwickshire, England 531,1587,1588. Other names for Roger were Roger De NEWBURGH 2nd Earl Of Warwick, and 02nd Earl Of WARWICK Roger De Beaumont.

General Notes: Roger de Beaumont, 2nd Earl of Warwick; born c 1102; married Gundred, elder daughter of William de Warenne, 2nd Earl of Surrey, by Elizabeth/Isabel, widow of his (Roger's) uncle, 1st Earl of Leicester, and died 1153. [Burke's Peerage]

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EARLDOM OF WARWICK (II) 1119

ROGER, EARL OF WARWICK, 1st son and heir, was probably under age at his father's death and obtained the Earldom in 1123, before Easter [15 April), when his name first appears as a witness to a royal charter. He attested charters of Henry I, the two latest in 1131. After the accession of Stephen he was at the Easter Court [22 March 1135/6) at Westminster; in April he witnessed the King's charter of liberties at Oxford, and in the same year he was with Stephen at Winchester. After the battle of Lincoln, 2 February 1140/1, he joined the Empress Maud of his own free will. He served with her at the siege of Winchester in 1141; but early in 1142 he was with Stephen at Stamford. He does not seem to have taken any active part in the Civil War; but at an unknown date he allowed Warwick Castle to be garrisoned by Stephen's troops, and in 1153 he was with the King when he heard that the garrison had been tricked by Henry's knights and the Castle surrendered. Although he was not to blame, it is said that he was so overcome with shame and grief that he died suddenly. He founded the Templars' House and St. Michael's Hospital, both in Warwick, completed the foundation of Warwick Priory and was a benefactor to a large number of religious foundations.

He married Gundred, elder daughter of William (DE WARENNE), 2nd EARL OF SURREY, by Isabel (or Elizabeth), widow of Robert (DE BEAUMONT), COUNT OF MEULAN and 1st EARL OF LEICESTER, daughter of Hugh (DE CRÉPY), COUNT OF VERMANDOIS. He died in 1153. His widow married, as his 2nd wife, William DE LANCASTER, Lord of Kendal. She was living in 1166. [Complete Peerage XII/2:361-2, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

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Roger de Newburgh, 2nd Earl of Warwick. This nobleman, in the contest between the Empress Maud and King Stephen, espoused the cause of the former, but his lordship is much more known by his munificent grants to the church than his martial deeds. He married Gundred, daughter of William, Earl of Warren, and had issue, William and Waleran, successive earls, Henry, and Agnes. The earl died 12 June, 1153, and was succeeded by his eldest son, William de Newburgh, 3rd Earl of Warwick. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 399, Newburgh, Earls of Warwick]

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Roger, the eldest son of Robert de Beaumont, Earl of Warwick, held the earldom from 1123 until his death in 1153. As a member of the powerful Beaumont group, Roger was deeply involved in the struggle between Stephen and the empress Matilda (Maud). The next earls were two of his sons. [Encyclopaedia Britannica, 1961 ed., Vol. 23, p. 375, EARLS OF WARWICK]

Roger married Gundred De WARENNE 531,1583,1585 before 1130 in 1st Husband 1583.,1587 Gundred was born about 1124 in Lewes, Sussex, England and died after 1166 in Warwick Castle, Warwickshire, England 1583.

8044364109. Gundred De WARENNE,415,505,531,670,1583,1585 daughter of William De WARENNE 2nd Earl Of Surrey and Isabel (Elizabeth) De VERMANDOIS, was born about 1124 in Lewes, Sussex, England and died after 1166 in Warwick Castle, Warwickshire, England 1583.

General Notes: Gundred, elder daughter of William de Warenne, 2nd Earl of Surrey, by Elizabeth/Isabel widow of his (Roger's) uncle, Robert I de Beaumont, 1st Earl of Leicester. [Burke's Peerage]

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Gundred de Warenne, Countess of Warwick [dau. of William de Warenne & Isabel de Vermandois], widow of Roger de Newburgh; m. (2) William de Lancaster I, d. 1170, 5th Baron Kendal of Workington in Coupland, son of Gilbert, 4th Baron Kendal; he inherited an extensive fief held of the Honour of Coupland, served as castellan of William fitz Duncan's castle of Egremont in 1138, and was Governor of the Caslte of Lancaster. [Ancestral Roots, line 88-25]

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He [Roger Earl of Warwick] married Gundred, elder daughter of William (DE WARENNE), 2nd EARL OF SURREY, by Isabel (or Elizabeth), widow of Robert (DE BEAUMONT), COUNT OF MEULAN and 1st EARL OF LEICESTER, daughter of Hugh (DE CRÉPY), COUNT OF VERMANDOIS. He died in 1153. His widow married, as his 2nd wife, William DE LANCASTER, Lord of Kendal. She was living in 1166. [Complete Peerage XII/2:361-2, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Gundred married Roger De BEAUMONT 2nd Earl Of Warwick 531,1583,1585,1587 before 1130 in 1st Husband 1583.,1587 Roger was born before 15 April 1102 in Warwick Castle, Warwickshire, England 531,1583 and died on 12 June 1153 in Warwick Castle, Warwickshire, England 531,1587,1588. Other names for Roger were Roger De NEWBURGH 2nd Earl Of Warwick, and 02nd Earl Of WARWICK Roger De Beaumont.

Gundred next married William I De LANCASTER 5th Baron Of Kendal 901,1582,1583 after 1153 in 2ND Husband 2ND Wife 1583.,1584 William was born about 1124 in Kendal, Westmorland, England and died in 1170 in Lancaster, Lancashire, England 1584 about age 46.

8044364116. Richard Fitzgilbert De CLARE & Tonbridge, Sir,415,505,631,1279,1368,1623 son of Gilbert Fitzrichard De CLARE & Tonbridge, Sir and Adeliza (Adelaide) De CLERMONT, was born about 1090 in Clare, Risbridge, Suffolk, England,1624 died on 15 April 1136 in Slain By Welsh Near Abergavenny, Monmouthshire, Wales 1279,1368,1623 about age 46, and was buried in Gloucester, Gloucestershire, England. Another name for Richard was 03rd Lord Of CLARE Richard De Clare.

General Notes:
Richard Fitz Gilbert (de Clare), son & heir, Lord of Clare, Suffolk, slain by Welsh near Abergavenny 15 Apr 1136, buried Gloucester; m. Adeliz (or Alice), daughter of Ranulph le Meschin, Earl of Chester, by Lucy, widow (1) of Ivo Taillebois and (2) Roger Fitz Gerold. She m. (2) Robert de Condet (or Cundy), d. c 1141, lord of Thorngate Castle, Lincoln, etc., son of Osbert de Condet. [Ancestral Roots, Line 246b-25]

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HOLDERS OF THE HONOUR OF CLARE (III) 1117 ?

RICHARD FITZGILBERT, styled also DE CLARE, Lord of Clare, &c., son and heir. He is often supposed to have been created EARL OF HERTFORD by King Stephen, if not by Henry I. There appears, however, to be no ground for this belief. In 1130, he is styled on the Pipe Roll (not "Earl," either as Earl of Hertford or Earl Richard, but simply) Ric.' fil.' Gisl as is he also when his death is recorded.

He married Adeliz, sister of Ranulph "des Gernons," EARL OF CHESTER. He was founder of the priory of Tonbridge. He died, being surprised and slain by the Welsh, near Abergavenny 15 April 1136, and was buried at Gloucester. His widow was rescued from the Welsh by Miles of Gloucester. [Complete Peerage III:243, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

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Richard de Clare first bore the title of Earl of Hertford and, being one of those who, by power of the sword, entered Wales, there planted himself and became lord of vast territories as also of divers castles in those parts, but requiring other matters of moment from the king, in which he was unsuccessful, he reared the standard of revolt and soon after fell in an engagement with the Welsh. His lordship in 1124 removed the monks out of his castle at Clare into the church of St. Augustine at Stoke, and bestowed upon them a little wood, called Stoke-Ho, with a doe every year out of his part at Hunedene. He m. Alice, sister of Ranulph, 2nd Earl of Chester, and had issue, Gilbert, his successor, with two other sons, and a dau. Alice who m. Cadwalader-ap-Griffith, Prince of North Wales. His lordship d. 1139 and was s. by his eldest son, Gilbert de Clare, 2nd Earl of Hertford. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, London, 1883, p. 119, Clare, Lords of Clare, Earls of Hertford, Earls of Gloucester]

Richard married Adeliz (Alice) Le MESCHIN 1368,1623,1626 before 1115 in 1st Husband.1625 Adeliz was born about 1100 in Chester, Cheshire, England and died after 1142.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Gilbert Fitzrichard CLARE 1st Earl Of Hertford was born before 1115 in Tonbridge, Tunbridge Wells, Kent, England,1282 died between 1151 and 1153 in Clare, Risbridge, Suffolk, England (Dsp) 1389,1627, and was buried in Clare Priory, Suffolk, England. Other names for Gilbert were 04th Lord Of CLARE Gilbert De Clare, and1282 1st Earl Of HERTFORD Gilbert De Clare.

4022182058      ii.  Roger Fitzrichard CLARE 2nd Earl Of Hertford (born in 1116 in Tonbridge, Tunbridge Wells, Kent, England - died in 1173 in Clare, Risbridge, Suffolk, England)

              iii.  Adeliza De CLARE was born about 1117 in Tonbridge, Tunbridge Wells, Kent, England and died between 1148 and 1166 880 about age 31. Another name for Adeliza was Alice (Adelaide) De TONBRIDGE.

               iv.  Rohese De CLARE was born about 1123 in Tonbridge, Tunbridge Wells, Kent, England and died after 1175.

                v.  Adles CLARE was born about 1125 in Tonbridge, Tunbridge Wells, Kent, England.

               vi.  Alice DE CLARE died between 1148 and 1166 760.


8044364117. Adeliz (Alice) Le MESCHIN,415,505,631,1368,1623,1626 daughter of Ranulph Le MESCHIN 1st Earl Of Chester and Lucy (Lucia) Of MERCIA, was born about 1100 in Chester, Cheshire, England and died after 1142.

General Notes:
Adeliz (or Alice) [daughter of Ranulph III le Meschin, Earl of Chester by Lucy], m. (1) Richard Fitz Gilbert (also styled de Clare), lord of Clare, Suffolk, d. 1136; m. (2) Robert de Condet (or Cundy), d. c 1141, lord of Thorngate Castle in the city of Lincoln, and of Wickhambreux, Kent, Grimston, co. Notthingham, and South Carlton, Thurlby, Eagle and Skellingthorpe, co. Lincoln, son of Osbert de Condet (or Cundy), d. by 1130, lord of Wickhambreux, Kent, Grimston, co. Nottingham, and South Carlton, Eagle and Skellingthorpe, co. Lincoln, by Adelaide, daughter and heir of William de Chesney, lord of Caenby and Glentham, co. Lincoln. [Ancestral Roots, Line 132d-27]

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Adeliz (or Alice), daughter of Ranulph le Meschin, Earl of Chester, by Lucy, widow (1) of Ivo Taillebois and (2) Roger Fitz Gerold. She m. (2) Robert de Condet (or Cundy), d. c 1141, lord of Thorngate Castle, Lincoln, etc., son of Osbert de Condet. [Ancestral Roots, Line 246b-25]

Note: The previous generation of this line (AR Line 246b-24) has Adeliza (or Adelaide) de Clermont m. (1) Gilbert Fitz Richard, (2) Robert de Condet (or Cundy), d. c 1141, lord of Thorngate Castle, co. Lincoln, etc., son of Osbert de Condet. This is practically word for word what 246b-25 describes as Adeliz le Meschin's 2nd husband was. Since 132d-27 agrees with 246b-25, I think 246b-24 is a wierd mistake. According to CP & SGM, Bouchard IV de Montmorency was the 2nd husband of Adeliza de Clermont.

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He [Richard FitzGilbert de Clare] married Adeliz, sister of Ranulph "des Gernons," EARL OF CHESTER. He was founder of the priory of Tonbridge. He died, being surprised and slain by the Welsh, near Abergavenny 15 April 1136, and was buried at Gloucester. His widow was rescued from the Welsh by Miles of Gloucester. [Complete Peerage III:243, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Adeliz married Richard Fitzgilbert De CLARE & Tonbridge, Sir 1279,1368,1623 before 1115 in 1st Husband.1625 Richard was born about 1090 in Clare, Risbridge, Suffolk, England,1624 died on 15 April 1136 in Slain By Welsh Near Abergavenny, Monmouthshire, Wales 1279,1368,1623 about age 46, and was buried in Gloucester, Gloucestershire, England. Another name for Richard was 03rd Lord Of CLARE Richard De Clare.

Adeliz next married Robert De CONDET Lord Of Thorngate,1389,1628,1629 son of Unknown and Unknown, after 15 April 1136.1628 Robert was born about 1102 in Skellingthorpe, Lincoln, Lincolnshire, England and died about 10 October 1141 in Thorngate Castle, Lincoln, Lincolnshire, England 1389,1628,1630 about age 39. Another name for Robert was Robert De CUNDY Of Thorngate Castle.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Roger De CONDET Of Caenby & Glentham was born about 1138 in Eagle, Lincoln, Lincolnshire, England and died in 1201 of Caenby & Glentham, Lincolnshire, England 1389,1630 about age 63. Other names for Roger were Roger De CUNDET,1630 Roger De CUNDI, and Roger De CUNI.1631

               ii.  Isabel De CONDET Heir Of South Carlton was born about 1140 in Skellingthorpe, Lincoln, Lincolnshire, England 1629 and died after 1166 in South Carlton, Lincoln, Lincolnshire, England 1629,1632. Another name for Isabel was Isabel De CUNDY.


8044364120. Hugh BIGOD 1st Earl Of Norfolk,415,505,954,1585 son of Roger BIGOD Earl Of East Anglia and Adeliza (Alice) De TOENI Heiress Of Belvoir, was born about 1095 in Belvoir Castle, Leicestershire, England,1585 died about 1177 in Thetford Church, Norfolk, England 954 about age 82, and was buried in Thetford Church, Norfolk, England.

General Notes: Hugh Bigod, 1st Earl of Norfolk, b. c. 1095, Lord of Framlingham, 1120, Royal Steward, 1123 (son of Roger Bigod, d. Sep 1107, and his wife Alice, living 1130, daughter of Robert de Toeni, Lord of Belvoir). [Magna Charta Sureties]

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Hugh Bigod, brother of William, steward of the household of King Henry I, was also steward to King Henry I, who being mainly instrumental in raising Stephen, Earl of Bologne, to the throne upon the decease of his royal master, was rewarded by this new king with the Earldom of the East Angles, commonly called Norfolk, and by that designation we find him styled in 1140 (6th Stephen). His lordship remained faithful in his allegiance to King Stephen through the difficulties which afterwards beset that monarch, and gallantly defended the castle of Ipswich against the Empress Maud and her son until obligated at length to surrender for want of timely relief. In the 12th Henry II, this powerful noble certified his knight's fee to be one hundred and twenty-five "de vetri feoffamento," and thirty-five "de novo," upon the occasion of the assessment in aid of the marriage of the king's daughter; and he appears to have acquired at this period a considerable degree of royal favour, for we find him not only re-created Earl of Norfolk,by charter, dated at Northampton, but by the same instrument obtaining a grant of the office of steward, to hold in as ample a manner as his father had done in the time of Henry I. Notwithstanding, however, these and other equally substantial marks of the kings liberality, the Earl of Norfolk sided with Robert, Earl of Leicester, in the insurrection incited by that nobleman in favor of the king's son (whom Henry himself had crowned,) in the 19th of the monarch's reign; but his treason upon this occasion cost him the surrender of his strongest castles, and a find of 1,000 marks. After which he went into the Holy Land with the Earl of Flanders, and died in 1177. His lordship had married twice; by his 1st wife, Julian, dau. of Alberic de Vere, he had a son, Rogers; and by his 2nd, Gundred, he had two sons, Hugh and William. He was s. by his eldest son, Roger Bigod, 2nd earl. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited, and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 53, Bigod, Earls of Norfolk]

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The Bigods held the hereditary office of steward (dapifer) of the royal household, and their chief castle was at Framlingham in Suffolk. (Encyclopædia Britannica, 1961 ed, Vol. 3, pages 556/557, Hugh Bigod, Earl of Norfolk.)

Hugh married Juliana De VERE 1585,1633 about 1133 in 1st Husband - Marriage Was Annulled.1585 Juliana was born in 1116 in Hedingham, Essex, England and died after 1185 1585.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Isabel BIGOD was born about 1134 in Framingham Castle, Henstead, Norfolk, England.

4022182060      ii.  Roger BIGOD 2nd Earl Of Norfolk, Mcs (born about 1150 in Framlingham Castle, Suffolk, England - died before 2 August 1221 in Thetford, Norfolk, England)

Hugh next married Gundred De BEAUMONT,1585 daughter of Roger De BEAUMONT 2nd Earl Of Warwick and Gundred De WARENNE, after 1150 in 2ND/3Rd Wife.1585 Gundred was born about 1143 in Warwick Castle, Warwickshire, England and died between 1200 and 1208 1585 about age 57. Another name for Gundred was Gundred De NEWBURGH.


8044364121. Juliana De VERE,415,505,1585,1633 daughter of Aubrey II De VERE Sheriff Of London and Alice De CLARE, was born in 1116 in Hedingham, Essex, England and died after 1185 1585.

General Notes: Juliana de Vere (daughter of Alice and Aubrey de Vere II), living 1185; m. (1) as his (2) wife, Hugh Bigod, 1st Earl of Norfolk, b. c 1095, Lord of Framlingham 1120, Royal Steward 1123 (son of Roger Bigod, d. Sep 1107, and his wife Alice, living 1130, daughter of Robert de Toeni, Lord of Belvoir). The marriage of Juliana and Hugh was annulled. Juliana m. (2) Walkelin Maminot, d. 1182 and (3) Roger de Glanville, dead 7 Richard I. Hugh m. (2) Gundred, d. 1200/8, apparently daughter of Roger, Earl of Warwick, by Gundred, daughter of William de Warenne, Earl of Surrey. [Magna Charta Sureties]

Juliana married Hugh BIGOD 1st Earl Of Norfolk 954,1585 about 1133 in 1st Husband - Marriage Was Annulled.1585 Hugh was born about 1095 in Belvoir Castle, Leicestershire, England,1585 died about 1177 in Thetford Church, Norfolk, England 954 about age 82, and was buried in Thetford Church, Norfolk, England.

Juliana next married Walkelin II MAMINOT Lord Of West Greenwich 1585,1634 after 1150 in 2ND Husband.1585 Walkelin was born about 1111 in West Greenwich, Kent, England and died in 1182 in (Dsp) 1585 about age 71.

Juliana next married Roger De GLANVILLE 1585 after 1182 in 3rd Husband.1585 Roger was born about 1111.


8044364124. John "The Marshal" FITZGILBERT Of Rockley,399,415,505,662,854,855,856,857,858,859,860,861,862,863 son of Gilbert Le Mareschal FITZ ROBERT Of Winterbourne and Miss De VENUZ, was born before 1109 in Winterbourne Monkton, Marlborough, Wiltshire, England 860 and died before 29 September 1165 in Rockley, Marlborough, Wiltshire, England 860. Another name for John was John Fitzgilbert Le MARSHAL.

General Notes:
John FitzGilbert, styled also John the Marshal, 1st son and heir [of Gilbert], a party to the suit aforesaid, succeeded to his father's lands and office in or shortly before 1130, when he owed 22.13.4 marks for them. He then held land in Wiltshire, and owed 40 marks silver for the office of supplying fodder for the royal horses in his charge, as well as 30 marks silver for the land and daughter of Walter Pipard. He was with Henry I in Normandy in 1137 and in England in 1138, in which year he fortified the castles of Marlborough and Ludgershall. In 1140 he held Marlborough for the King, and captured Robert FitzHubert, who had taken the royal castle of Devizes. After Stephen had been taken prisoner at Lincoln, John joined the Empress, with whom he was at Reading in May, at Oxford in July, and at Winchester in Aug-Sep 1141, where in the final rout he was cut off and surrounded in Wherwell Abbey, but escaped with the loss of an eye and other wounds (b). In 1142 he was again with the Empress at Oxford, and some 2 years later at Devizes. In 1144 he was raiding the surrounding country form Marlborough Castle and oppressing the clergy. He was with Maud's son Henry at Devizes in 1149 and 1153; and in 1152 Newbury Castle was defended by his constable against Stephen. After Henry's accession John was granted Crown lands in Wiltshire worth 82 marks per annum, including Marlborough Castle; but he had to surrender the castle in 1158. He was present at the Council of Clarendon in 1164; soon after which he sued Thomas Becket for part of his manor at Pagham, in Sussex. John was a benefactor to the priory of Bradenstoke, the abbey of Troarn, and the Templars.

He m., 1stly, Aline, who may have been the daughter and heir of Walter Pipard. He is said to have repudiated her circa 1141, and he m., 2ndly, Sibyl, sister of Patrick de Salisbury, 1st Earl of WIltshire, and daughter of Walter de Salisbury, hereditary sheriff of Wiltshire and constable of Salisbury Castle, by Sibyl, daughter of Patrick de Chaources (Chaworth). John d. in 1165, before Michaelmas. [Complete Peerage X:Appendix G:93-95]

(b) According to the poem, John escaped from Winchester on foot to Marlborough, and there assembled troops, with which he inflicted much loss on the King and his partisans, and when Stephen marched towards Ludgershall, the Marshal waylaid and defeated the royal forces. After this Patrick de Salisbury (whom the poet prematurely makes an Earl) is said to have made many attacks on the Marshal, with the King's support; until the feud was settled by John repudiating his 1st wife and marrying Patrick's sister.

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John Marshal, whom the Gesta Stephani rather unkindly describes as 'a limb of hell and the root of all evil' was a man who loved warfare, and played the game of politics with great success. At first he supported Stephen but, when he began to realise the failings of the King and the potentialities of Matilda's party, he changed sides. Almost immediately he proved by a consummate act of bravery and hardihood, that he was worth having: escorting Matilda to safety in his castle at Ledgershall, John found that the party was going dangerously slowly because Matilda was riding side-saddle, so he persuaded her to ride astride, and stopped behind to delay the pursuers at Wherwell. His force was soon overpowered by the numbers of the enemy, and John took refuge with one of his knights in the Abbey. The opposing party promptly set fire to the church, and John and his knight had to take cover in the tower, John threatening to kill his knight if he made any move to surrender. As the lead of the roof began to melt and drop on the two soldiers, putting out one of John's eyes, the enemy moved off, convinced that they were dead. They escaped, in a terrible state, but triumphant, to John's castle.

He plainly expected his children to be as tough as himself, as an incident of the year 1152, when William was about six, will show. King Stephen went to besiege Newbury Castle, which Matilda had given John to defend; the castellan, realising that provisions and the garrison were both too low to stand a long siege, asked for a truce to inform his master. This was normal practice, for if the castellan were not at once relieved, he could then surrender without being held to have let his master down. Now John had not sufficient troops to relieve the castle, so he asked Stephen to extend the truce whilst he, in turn, informed his mistress, and agreed to give William as a hostage, promising not to provision and garrison the castle during the truce. This he promptly did, and when he received word from Stephen that the child would be hung if he did not at once surrender the castle, he cheerfully replied that he had hammer and anvils to forge a better child than William. [Who's Who in the Middle Ages, John Fines, Barnes & Noble Books, New York, 1995]

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John Mareschall, attaching himself to the fortunes of Maud against King Stephen, was with Robert, the consul, Earl of Gloucester, at the siege of Winchester Castle, when the party of the empress sustained so signal a defeat. Upon the accession of Henry II, however, in 1154, his fidelity was amply rewarded by considerable grants in the co. Wilts; and in the 10th of that monarch's reign, being then marshal, he laid claim, for the crown, to one of the manors of the see of Canterbury from the prelate, Thomas à Becket, who about that period, had commenced his contest with the king. To this John s. his son and heir, John Mareschall. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited, and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 357, Marshal, Barons Marshal]

John married Aline PIPARD Heiress Of Wooton Basset 860,865 about 1130 in 1st Husband 1St Wife - Divorced By 1141 860.,864 Aline was born about 1105 in Wooton Basset, Wiltshire, England.

John next married Sibyl De SALISBURY 856,858,860,861,867,868 in 1142 in 2ND Wife.866 Sibyl was born in 1127 of Salisbury Castle, Wiltshire, England 389,390 and died on 3 June of Pembroke, Pembrokeshire, Wales 389,390. Other names for Sibyl were Sibilla D'evereux, and Sibel D' EVREUX.

8044364125. Sibyl De SALISBURY,399,415,505,643,856,858,860,861,867,868,874,875,876 daughter of Walter D'evereux SALISBURY Sheriff Of Wiltshire and Sibyl De CHAWORTH Countess Of Salisbury, was born in 1127 of Salisbury Castle, Wiltshire, England 389,390 and died on 3 June of Pembroke, Pembrokeshire, Wales 389,390. Other names for Sibyl were Sibilla D'evereux, and Sibel D' EVREUX.

General Notes:
He [John the Marshal] m., 2ndly, Sibyl, sister of Patrick de Salisbury, 1st Earl of WIltshire, and daughter of Walter de Salisbury, hereditary sheriff of Wiltshire and constable of Salisbury Castle, by Sibyl, daughter of Patrick de Chaources (Chaworth). John d. in 1165, before Michaelmas. [Complete Peerage X:Appendix G:93-95]

Sibyl married John "The Marshal" FITZGILBERT Of Rockley 662,854,855,856,857,858,859,860,861,862,863 in 1142 in 2ND Wife.866 John was born before 1109 in Winterbourne Monkton, Marlborough, Wiltshire, England 860 and died before 29 September 1165 in Rockley, Marlborough, Wiltshire, England 860. Another name for John was John Fitzgilbert Le MARSHAL.

8044364126. Richard Strongbow De CLARE 2nd Earl Pembroke,415,854,1635,1636 son of Gilbert De CLARE 1st Earl Of Pembroke and Isabel (Elizabeth) De BEAUMONT, was born about 1130 in Tonbridge, Tunbridge Wells, Kent, England 1635 and died on 20 April 1176 in Dublin, Leinster, Ireland 1635 about age 46. Another name for Richard was Richard De Clare Earl Of PEMBROKE.

General Notes: Earldom of Pembroke: His [Gilbert's] son the 2nd Earl of Pembroke ("Strongbow") was instigator of the Anglo-Norman/Cambro-Norman incursion into Ireland in 1169 or 1170. Pembroke himself managed to subdue Leinster. His daughter and ultimately heiress married William (the) Marshal, who was created Earl of Pembroke in 1199 by King John, though he may already have had some kind of status as Earl of Pembroke in right of his wife. [Burke's Peerage]

Richard married Eve (Aoife) MACMURROUGH 854 about 26 August 1171 in Waterford, Ireland.1635 Eve was born about 1141 in Ireland and died after 1186 in Waterford, Ireland 1635.

Children from this marriage were:

4022182063       i.  Isabel De CLARE Countess Of Pembroke (born about 1172 in Pembroke, Pembrokeshire, Wales - died in 1220 in Pembroke, Pembrokeshire, Wales)

               ii.  Miss De CLARE was born about 1174 in Pembroke, Pembrokeshire, Wales.

              iii.  Joan De CLARE was born about 1176 in Pembroke, Pembrokeshire, Wales.


8044364127. Eve (Aoife) MACMURROUGH,415,854 daughter of Diarmait Macmurchada King Of LEINSTER and More O'TOOLE, was born about 1141 in Ireland and died after 1186 in Waterford, Ireland 1635.

Eve married Richard Strongbow De CLARE 2nd Earl Pembroke 854,1635,1636 about 26 August 1171 in Waterford, Ireland.1635 Richard was born about 1130 in Tonbridge, Tunbridge Wells, Kent, England 1635 and died on 20 April 1176 in Dublin, Leinster, Ireland 1635 about age 46. Another name for Richard was Richard De Clare Earl Of PEMBROKE.

8044364136. Humphrey IV "The Young" De BOHUN,415,505,531,1332,1637,1638 son of Humphrey III Baron De BOHUN Of Trowbridge and Margaret De GLOUCESTER, was born in 1143 in Trowbridge, Melksham, Wiltshire, England and died in 1182 1637 at age 39.

General Notes: Humphrey de Bohun was Earl of Hereford and Constable of England in right of his mother, if the Chronicles of Llanthony be correct. His lordship m. Margaret of Scotland, dau. of Henry, Earl of Huntingdon, sister of William, King of Scots, and widow of Conan le Petit, Earl of Brittany and Richmond, and was s. by his son, Henry de Bohun, 1st Earl of Hereford. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, London, 1883, p. 57, Bohun, Earls of Hereford, Earls of Essex, Earls of Northampton, and High Constables of England]

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The following was supplied in an e-mail to me by Lora Cline, which seems to have been copied from a Rand Corp. employee's genealogy website:

Les Seigneurs de Bohon
(The Noblemen of Bohun)

The following material is excerpted from Les Seigneurs de Bohon by Jean LeMelletier, Coutances: Arnaud-Bellee, 1978. This was translated from French to English by a friend. The book was found at UCLA's Research Library as CS 439 D416L45 1978.

Humphrey IV

According the the chronicle of Lanthony, Humphrey IV was earl of Hereford and constable of England. But he died before his father, probably in 1182 in France while serving Henry the younger, so he never had the titles.
Humphrey was married to Margaret of Scotland (who died 1201), daughter of Henry, earl of Huntington, and sister of King William the Lion of Scotland, and widow of Conan le Petit, earl of Brittany and Richmond (who died 1171).

After Humphrey's death, his widow confirmed the gift of a marketplace to the priory of Bradenstoke that he had specified in his will.

Humphrey married Margaret De HUNTINGDON 531,1027,1332,1638,1639 before April 1175 in 2ND Husband.1638 Margaret was born in 1144 in Huntingdon, Huntingdonshire, England, died in 1201 in Richmond, North Riding Yorkshire, England 1638 at age 57, and was buried in Sawtrey Abbey, Huntingdonshire, England. Another name for Margaret was Margaret Of SCOTLAND.

The child from this marriage was:

4022182068       i.  Henry De BOHUN 1st Earl Of Hereford, Mcs (born in 1176 in Warwick, Warwickshire, England - died on 1 June 1220 on A Pilgrimage To Holy Land)


8044364137. Margaret De HUNTINGDON,415,505,531,670,1027,1332,1638,1639 daughter of Henry Earl Of HUNTINGDON Prince Of Scotland and Ada De WARENNE, was born in 1144 in Huntingdon, Huntingdonshire, England, died in 1201 in Richmond, North Riding Yorkshire, England 1638 at age 57, and was buried in Sawtrey Abbey, Huntingdonshire, England. Another name for Margaret was Margaret Of SCOTLAND.

General Notes: He [Conan Duke of Brittany] married, in 1160, Margaret of Scotland, sister of MALCOLM IV, King of Scofland, and daughter of Henry, EARL OF HUNTINGDON, by Ada or Adeline, daughter of William (DE WARENNE), EARL OF SURREY. He died 20 February 1171. His widow married, 2ndly, before Easter 1175, Humphrey DE BOHUN, Constable of England; she died in 1201, and was buried at Sawtrey Abbey, Hunts. [Complete Peerage X:791-3, XIV:545, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

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Margaret of Scotland, dau. of Henry, Earl of Huntingdon, sister of William, King of Scots, and widow of Conan le Petit, Earl of Brittany and Richmond. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, London, 1883, p. 57, Bohun, Earls of Hereford, Earls of Essex, Earls of Northampton, and High Constables of England]

Margaret married Conan IV Duke Of BRITTANY Earl Of Richmond 1027,1639,1640 in 1160 in 1st Husband 1638.,1639 Conan was born about 1140 in Nantes, Bretagne, France and died from 20 February 1170 to 1171 in Richmond, North Riding Yorkshire, England 1639,1640 about age 30.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194851       i.  Constance De BRITTANY Countess Of Richmond (born about 1162 in Nantes, Bretagne, France - died on 5 September 1201 in Nantes, Bretagne, France)

Margaret next married Humphrey IV "The Young" De BOHUN 531,1332,1637,1638 before April 1175 in 2ND Husband.1638 Humphrey was born in 1143 in Trowbridge, Melksham, Wiltshire, England and died in 1182 1637 at age 39.

8044364138. Geoffrey FITZPIERS 3rd Earl Of Essex,415,505,936 son of Piers De LUTEGARESHALE and Maud, was born before 1163 in Saffron Walden, Essex, England 937 and died on 14 October 1213 in Shouldham Priory, Downham, Norfolk, England 938. Another name for Geoffrey was Geoffrey De MANDEVILLE 3rd Earl Of Essex.

General Notes: Upon the decease of William de Mandeville, 3rd Earl of Essex, much dispute arose regarding the inheritance: Beatrix, his aunt and heir, in the first place, preferring her claim, sent Geoffrey de Say, her younger son, to transact the business for the livery thereof, but Geoffrey FitzPiers insisted upon the right of Beatrix, his wife. Nevertheless, Geoffrey de Say, in consideration of 7,000 marks promised to be paid on a certain day, obtained an instrument in right of his mother, under the king's seal, for the whole of the barony, but the said Geoffrey de Say, making default of payment, this Geoffrey FitzPiers, being a man of great wealth and reputation, made representation that the barony was the right of his wife and, promising to pay the money, obtained livery thereof and procured the king's confirmation of his title. One of the earliest acts of this feudal lord was to dispossess the monks of Walden of certain lands which they had derived from his predecessors, a proceeding followed by a long controversy, which, after being referred to the Pope and the King, was finally compromised. Upon the removal of Hubert, Archbishop of Canterbury, from the office of Justice of England by Richard I, this Geoffrey was appointed to succeed him, and at the coronation of King John, 26 June, 1199, he was girt with the sword as Earl of Essex, and then served at the king's table. Being nominated patron of the monastery at Walden, he appears soon after to have been received with great ceremony by the monks and perfectly reconciled to those holy fathers. In the 7th King John, he had a grant of the castle and honour of Berkhamstead, with the knights' fees thereunto belonging to hold to him and the heirs of his body, by Aveline, his 2nd wife. His lordship m. 1st, Beatrix de Say, by whom he had issue, Geoffrey, William, Henry, all of whom assumed the name of Mandeville, and Maud, m. to Robert de Bohun. He m. 2ndly, Aveline ---, and had an only son, John FitzPiers, Lord of Berkhamstead. His lordship, whom Matthew Paris characterizes as "ruling the reins of government so that after his death the realm was like a ship in a tempest without a pilot," d. 2 October, 1213, and was s. by his eldest son, Geoffrey de Mandeville. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, England, 1883, p. 353, Mandeville, Earls of Essex]

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GEOFFREY FITZ PETER (d. 1213), earl of Essex and chief justiciar of England, was a sheriff, a justice itinerant and a justice of the forest under Henry II. During Richard's absence on crusade he was one of the five justices of the king's court who stood next in authority to the regent, Longchamp. In 1190 Fitz Peter succeeded to the earldom of Essex, in the right of his wife, who was descended from the famous Geoffrey de Mandeville. In attempting to asset his hereditary rights over Walden priory Fitz Peter came into conflict with Longchamp, and revenged himself by joining in the baronial agitation through which the regent was expelled from his office. Though refusing to give him formal investiture of the Essex earldom, Richard appointed him justiciar in succession to Hubert Walter (1198). Fitz Peter continued Walter's policy of encouraging foreign trade and the development of the towns; many of the latter received, during his administration, charters of self-government. He was continued in his office by John, who found him an able instrument of extortion. He profited to no small extent by the spoliation of church lands in the period of the interdict. But he was not altogether trusted by the king. The contemporary "Historie des ducs" described Fitz Peter as living in constant dread of disgrace and confiscation. In the last years of his life he endeavoured to act as a mediator between the king and the opposition. It was by his mouth that the king promised to the nation the laws of Henry I. (at the council of St. Albans, Aug. 4, 1213). But Fitz Peter died a few weeks later (Oct. 2). Fitz Peter was neither a far-sighted nor a disinterested statesman; but he was the ablest pupil of Hubert Walter, and maintained the traditions of the great bureaucracy which the first and second Henries had founded.

Geoffrey married Beatrix De SAY 938,940 before 25 January 1184-1185 in 1st Wife.939 Beatrix was born about 1160 in Kimbolton, St Neots, Huntingdonshire, England and died before 19 April 1197 939.

Geoffrey next married Aveline De CLARE,945,946 daughter of Roger Fitzrichard CLARE 2nd Earl Of Hertford and Maud De ST. HILARY, before 20 May 1205 in 2ND Husband 2ND Wife.945 Aveline was born about 1168 in Hereford, Herefordshire, England 389,390 and died before 4 June 1225 in , , , England 389,390,939,945.

8044364139. Beatrix De SAY,415,505,938,940 daughter of William II De SAY Of Sawbridgeworth and Aufrica Of HUNTINGDON, was born about 1160 in Kimbolton, St Neots, Huntingdonshire, England and died before 19 April 1197 939.

Beatrix married Geoffrey FITZPIERS 3rd Earl Of Essex 936 from before 25 January 1184 to 1185 in 1st Wife.939 Geoffrey was born before 1163 in Saffron Walden, Essex, England 937 and died on 14 October 1213 in Shouldham Priory, Downham, Norfolk, England 938. Another name for Geoffrey was Geoffrey De MANDEVILLE 3rd Earl Of Essex.

8044364140. Geoffrey De LUSIGNAN,415 son of Hugh VIII "Le Brun" Sire De LUSIGNAN and Bourgogne (Berbone) De RANCON, was born about 1150 in Lusignan, Vienne, Poitou, France and died in 1224 about age 74.

Geoffrey married Umberge De LIMOGES. Umberge was born about 1155 in Limoges, Haute Vienne, Limousin, France and died about 1187 in Jaffa, Holy Lands about age 32.

The child from this marriage was:

4022182070       i.  Raoul I De LUSIGNAN Comte D'eu (born about 1178 in La Marche, Poitou, France - died on 1 May 1219 in Shenton, Leicestershire, England)


8044364141. Umberge De LIMOGES,415 daughter of Adhemir (Aymar) V Vicomte De LIMOGES and Unknown, was born about 1155 in Limoges, Haute Vienne, Limousin, France and died about 1187 in Jaffa, Holy Lands about age 32.

Umberge married Geoffrey De LUSIGNAN. Geoffrey was born about 1150 in Lusignan, Vienne, Poitou, France and died in 1224 about age 74.

8044364142. Henry Count D' EU Lord Of Hastings 415,1641,1642 was born in 1155 in Hastings, Sussex, England and died from 11 March 1182 to 1183 in Eu, Seine Inferieure, Normandy, France 1641 at age 27.

Henry married Maud (Mahaut) Plantagenet De WARENNE 1641,1642,1643 in 1st Husband.1642 Maud was born about 1166 in Lewes, Sussex, England and died about 1212 1641 about age 46.

The child from this marriage was:

4022182071       i.  Alice Countess D' EU Lady Hastings (born about 1183 in Shenton, Leicestershire, England - died on 15 May 1246)


8044364143. Maud (Mahaut) Plantagenet De WARENNE,415,1641,1642,1643 daughter of Hamelin PLANTAGENET 5th Earl Of Surrey and Isabel De WARENNE 4th Countess Of Surrey, was born about 1166 in Lewes, Sussex, England and died about 1212 1641 about age 46.

General Notes: Maud [daughter of Hamelin Plantagenet & Isabel de Warenne], who m. 1stly Henry, Count of Eu and lord of Hastings, and 2ndly Henry d'Estouteville or de Stuteville, of Eckington, co. Derby, and Dedham, Essex, lord of Valmont and Rames in Normandy. [Complete Peerage]

Maud married Henri D' ESTOUTEVILLE Sgr. De Valmont & Rames 1642,1644 after 1183 in 2ND Husband.1642 Henri was born about 1155 in Valmont, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France and died on 5 April 1232 in Rames, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France 1644 about age 77. Another name for Henri was Henry De STUTEVILLE Of Eckington & Dedham.

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  Jean I Seigneur D' ESTOUTEVILLE was born about 1190 in Estouteville-Sur-Mer, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France and died on 15 August 1258 1645 about age 68.

Maud next married Henry Count D' EU Lord Of Hastings 1641,1642 in 1st Husband.1642 Henry was born in 1155 in Hastings, Sussex, England and died from 11 March 1182 to 1183 in Eu, Seine Inferieure, Normandy, France 1641 at age 27.

8044364640. William FITZALAN Lord Of Oswestry 415,980,1255,1337,1338 was born about 1105 in Oswestry Castle, Shropshire, England and died in 1160 in Oswestry Castle, Shropshire, England 1255,1337,1338 about age 55.

General Notes: William FitzAlan; feudal Baron of Oswestry, Sheriff Salop and Castellan of Shrewsbury 1138; besieged there as an adherent of the Empress Maud by King Stephen; restored to his lands by Henry II 1155 and set about recovering the Barony of Oswestry, by now in Welsh hands; founder of Haughmond Abbey; m. 1st Christian, possibly a niece of Robert FitzRoy, 1st Earl of Goucester of the 1122 cr., illegitimate son of Henry I, and had a daughter (Christian, m Hugh Pantulf); m 2nd Isabel....daughter and heir of Ingram de Say, feudal Lord of Clun, Salop and d. 1160. [Burke's Peerage]

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The Lordship of Clun in Shropshire belonged, temp. Stephen, to Ellis de Say, whose daughter and heir, Isabel, brought it to her husband, William FitzAlan, feudal Lord of Oswaldestre (ie. Oswestry) in that co., who d. abt 1210. Their son and heir, William FitzAlan, Lord of Clun and Oswestry, dsp 1216, and was succeeded by his brother and heir, John FitzAlan, Lord of Cluny and Oswestry, who m. Isabel, sister (whose issue became coheirs) of Hugh d'Aubigny, Earl of Arundel. This John FitzAlan d. 1240, and was succeeded by his son and heir, John FitzAlan, feudal Lord of Clun and Oswestry, to whom (jure maris) the Castle and Honour of Arundel were awarded, 27 Nov 1243, whereby, according to the admission of 1433, he became Earl of Arundel. . . [Complete Peerage, III:335 as corrected by XIV:194]

NOTE: The above account by CP is wrong in its handling of the FitzAlan descendancy:

Isabel de Say's husband was William FitzAlan (d. 1160). Their son William FitzAlan died in 1210 and was succeeded by his son William, who died at Easter 1215, and whose brother and heir was John, as given above. [Some Corrections & Additions to the Complete Peerage]

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William FitzAlan, in the contest between King Stephen and the Empress Maud, being then governor of Shrewsbury and sheriff of the county of Salop, held the castle of Shrewsbury for the latter until it was taken by assault. He was also with the empress at the siege of Winchester Castle in the 6th Stephen [1141], when she and her whole army were put to flight; and afterwards, continuing to adhere stoutly to the same cause, he was reconstituted sheriff of Salop so soon as King Henry attained the crown. This William m. Isabel, dau. and heir of Helias de Say, Lady of Clun, niece of Robert, Earl of Gloucester, and dying some time before 1160, was s. by his son, William FitzAlan. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited, and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 200, Fitz-Alan, Earls of Arundel, Barons Maltravers]

William married Christian Of GLOUCESTER 1255,1338 about 1135 in 1st Wife.1255 Christian was born about 1118 in Bristol, Gloucestershire, England.

William next married Isabel De SAY 980,1255,1338 before 1146 in 1st Husband 2ND Wife 1255.,1338 Isabel was born in 1135 in Clun, Shropshire, England and died about 1199 1255,1338 about age 64.

8044364641. Isabel De SAY 415,980,1255,1338 was born in 1135 in Clun, Shropshire, England and died about 1199 1255,1338 about age 64.

General Notes: Isabel (married 2nd c1166 Geoffrey de Vere, married 3rd c1188 William Boterel, died c1199), daughter and heir of Ingram de Say, feudal Lord of Clun, Salop. [Burke's Peerage]

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The following is copied from the website, maintained by Chris Phillips, entitled: "Some corrections and additions to the Complete Peerage":

Isabel was the daughter of Elias, not Ingram, de Say, and married the first William FitzAlan (d. 1160), not his son William, who died in 1210. Their son and heir William died about Easter, 1215. For a fuller account, see below.

Eyton, in Antiquities of Shropshire [vol.7, pp.211-253 and elsewhere; 1853-60], gave a very detailed account of the early FitzAlans. In the reference cited above, J.H. Round corrected the early part of Eyton's work, dealing with Alan FitzFleald's ancestry. However, for the following generations, Eyton's account remains both fuller and more accurate than later work [cf. Sanders, English Baronies, pp.70, 71, 124, 391, 392 (1960); Keats-Rohan, Domesday Descendants, pp.515, 680, 860 (2002)].

In the following summary, I have included references to source material only for points omitted or contradicted by the later writers (and in one case for an addition to Eyton's account).

1. Alan FitzFleald, who married Aveline de Hesding.

2. William FitzAlan, their son and heir, who married 1stly Christiana, neptis (niece or kinswoman) of Robert Earl of Gloucester, and 2ndly Isabel, daughter and heir of Elias de Say, lord of Clun [Isabel is described as the daughter of Elias in a 12th-century narrative from the cartulary of Lilleshall Abbey, printed by Dugdale, Monasticon, vol.6, p.262, cited by Eyton, vol.9, p.358]. After William's death in 1160, Isabel remarried, before 1166, to Geoffrey de Vere (d. 1170) and, before 1188, to William Boterel; she died probably in 1199, and was survived by her third husband.

3. William FitzAlan, the son and heir of William by Isabel, who succeeded as a minor and apparently came of age in 1175. He married a daughter of Hugh de Lacy, Lord of Meath [Rot. Hundredorum, vol.2, pp.69, 76, 80, referring to land given to William FitzAlan with the sister of Walter de Lacy, cited by Eyton, vol.5, p.86, vol.10, p.126] and died in 1210 [Eyton, vol.7, p.244 citing the Annals of Dunstaple Priory; since printed in Annales Monastici, vol.3 (Rolls Series no 36; 1866)].

4. William FitzAlan, their son and heir, who succeeded as a minor, married Mary, the daughter of Thomas de Erdington, and died without issue, Easter 1215 [Eyton, vol.10, p.326, citing a copy of a letter from Thomas de Erdington to the king, referring to William's death at Easter and dated by Eyton to 1215 on internal evidence (Vincent's Collections, vol.3, p.98, College of Arms)]. Mary remarried to William de Duston, and both were living June 1220 [Curia Regis Rolls, vol.9, p.57].

5. John FitzAlan, his brother and heir, as given above.

(Note that Sanders gave an alternative reconstruction, in which the second William FitzAlan died 1212-1213 and was the grandfather, not the father, of William (d. 1215) and his brother John. But this is shown to be incorrect by the statement of a jury in 1223 that John FitzAlan's father, William, had been a minor in the custody of Henry II [Curia Regis Rolls, vol.11, p.69].)

[The error concerning the identity of the William FitzAlan who married Isabel de Say, and much of the evidence presented by Eyton, were pointed out by Joe Cochoit in April 2002. Peter Stewart pointed out the disagreement between Eyton's and Sanders's reconstructions in May 2002. Thanks to Cris Nash, Ian Fettes, Leo van de Pas, Rosie Bevan and Robert S. Baxter for many other helpful contributions during the ensuing discussion.]

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Curt Hofemann, curt_hofemann@yahoo.com, in a post-em, wrote:

It appears the name of her father was Ellis/Elias/Helias de SAY/SAYE & not Ingram/Ingelram:

(Ellis de Say) whose da. and h., Isabel, brought it (the Lordship of Clun in Shropshire) to her husband, William FitzAlan [Ref: CP II:335 as corrected by CP XIV]

In CP V:391 it states "...Isabel, da. and h. of Ingram de Say..."
Isabel was the daughter of Elias, not Ingram, de Say... Isabel, daughter and heir of Elias de Say, lord of Clun [Isabel is described as the daughter of Elias in a 12th-century narrative from the cartulary of Lilleshall Abbey, printed by Dugdale, Monasticon, vol.6, p.262, cited by Eyton, vol.9, p.358]. [Ref: Some corrections and additions to the Complete Peerage, FitzAlan (of Oswestry), Volume 5, page 391: http://www.medievalgenealogy.org.uk/cp/vol3.shtml]

As I have noted, after 1160, Guy le Strange, Sheriff of Shropshire was appointed to administer the Fitz Alan estates and Eyton gives many examples of entries by him with regard to these estates. In 1165, Geoffrey de Vere married Isabel de say and became lord of Clun in her right. This is recorded in the Liber Niger and numerous financial entries. Her third husband, William Boterell, would also become Baron of Clun in her right. William II Fitz Alan (her son) is not recorded with regard to Clun until 1203, after her death. She actually died in 1199 so presumably William FA (FITZALAN) was baron of Clun from 1199-1210.

Beginning in 1166, Geoffrey de Vere began receiving income from the Fitz Alan estates. This continues until 1170 when Eyton notes "Geoffrey de Vere died; but credit is taken for his full annuity out of the Fitz Alan estates up to Michaelmas. The word habuit is however used instead of the word habet in respect of the lands which had furnished the said annuity and which he had ceased to hold."

All this clearly shows that Isabel de Say, Lady of Clun married Geoffrey de Vere and that she is the same as the Isabel de Say who married William Fitz Alan (d. 1160). [Ref: Joe Cochoit <jcochoit@aol.com> message to soc.genealogy.medieval 19 May 2002]

Isabel Say, daughter and heir of Helias de Say, Lady of Clun, niece of Robert Say, Earl of Gloucester. [Ref: The Ancestors of Homer Beers James: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~pmcbride/james/f019.htm#T55]

married 1st: William FITZALAN (no date given) [Ref: CP V:392, Holloway p10, Watney p391]
(Holloway = "The Genealogy of Mary Wentworth, Who Became the Wife of William Brewster" by Naomi D. Holloway 1969 LDS Film 1738313)

married 2nd: Geoffrey de VERE before 1166 [Ref: Some corrections and additions to the Complete Peerage, FitzAlan (of Oswestry), Volume 5, page 391: http://www.medievalgenealogy.org.uk/cp/vol3.shtml]

married 3rd: William BOTEREL before 1188 [Ref: Some corrections and additions to the Complete Peerage, FitzAlan (of Oswestry), Volume 5, page 391: http://www.medievalgenealogy.org.uk/cp/vol3.shtml]

she died probably in 1199 [Ref: Some corrections and additions to the Complete Peerage, FitzAlan (of Oswestry), Volume 5, page 391: http://www.medievalgenealogy.org.uk/cp/vol3.shtml]

Regards,
Curt

Isabel married William FITZALAN Lord Of Oswestry 980,1255,1337,1338 before 1146 in 1st Husband 2ND Wife 1255.,1338 William was born about 1105 in Oswestry Castle, Shropshire, England and died in 1160 in Oswestry Castle, Shropshire, England 1255,1337,1338 about age 55.

8044364642. Hugh De LACY Lord Of Meath,415,712,1646 son of Gilbert I De LACY Of Hereford and Agnes, was born about 1125 in Ewias Lacy, Herefordshire, England, died on 25 July 1186 in Durrow, Ireland 712,1647 about age 61, and was buried in Bective Abbey, Meath, Ireland (Body), Dublin, Ireland (Head).

General Notes: In 1272, Hugh de Lacy was granted the Liberty of Meath by Henry II who sought to limit the expansionist policies of Strongbow [Richard de Clare], whom he feared might set up an independent Anglo-Norman kingdom in Ireland. Soon after his arrival at Trim, de Lacy built a wooden castle, the spike stockade mentioned in the "Song of Dermot and the Earl"--a poem of the period.

De Lacy left one of his barons, Hugh Tyrell, in charge, but when O'Connor, King of Connacht, threatened, Tyrell abandoned and burned the castle. By 1176, this wooden fortification had been replaced with a stone keep or tower. When the site was secure, the castle yard was surrounded by curtain walls and moat with a simple gate and bridge to the north. Analyses of samples of surviving structural timbers show that the keep was extended in at least two more phases and remodelled in the lifetime of Walter de Lacy, Hugh's son. Later, fore-buildings were built to protect the entrance to the keep. [Trim Castle Visitors Guide, Duchas--The Heritage Service of Ireland]

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Hugh was killed in Durrow while overseeing the building of a smaller castle. A man, who had gotten close to Hugh pulled an axe from under his cloak and lopped Hugh's head off. His body was buried at the Bective Abbey about 8 kms. from Trim Castle while his head was buried near his 1st wife in Dublin. The Cistercian Monks of Bective Abbey had hopes that the possession of Hugh's body would give them rights to Trim Castle and the extensive lands associated with it. However the king took the castle and lands until Walter came of age, at which time Richard I gave them to Walter.

Hugh married Rohese (Rose) De MONMOUTH 712,1647 in 2ND Husband 1St Wife.712 Rohese was born in 1142 in Monmouthshire, Wales and died before 1181 1648.

Children from this marriage were:

4022182321       i.  Miss De LACY (born about 1168 in Ewyas Harold, Herefordshire, England)

               ii.  Walter De LACY Lord Of Meath was born about 1172 in Ewyas Harold, Herefordshire, England 1647 and died from before 24 February 1240 to 1241 in Trim Castle, Meath, Ireland (Dspms) 708,711,712.

              iii.  Hugh De LACY 1st Earl Of Ulster was born about 1176 in Ulster, Ireland 1649 and died before 26 December 1242 in Franciscan Friars Convent, Carrickfergus, Ireland 902,1649,1650. Another name for Hugh was 1st Earl Of ULSTER Hugh De Lacy.

Hugh next married Rose Daughter Of Roderic King Of CONNAUGHT 1648 before 1181 in 2ND Wife.1648 Rose was born about 1160 in Connaught, Ireland and died after 1224 1648.


8044364643. Rohese (Rose) De MONMOUTH,415,712,1647 daughter of Baderon (Badeion) De MONMOUTH and Rohesia De CLARE, was born in 1142 in Monmouthshire, Wales and died before 1181 1648.

General Notes: Turton names her "Rose de Clare (Monmouth)", daughter of Gilbert de Clare, and states her 2nd marriage was to Hugh (as his 1st). I am going with AR.

Rohese married Hugh De LACY Lord Of Meath 712,1646 in 2ND Husband 1St Wife.712 Hugh was born about 1125 in Ewias Lacy, Herefordshire, England, died on 25 July 1186 in Durrow, Ireland 712,1647 about age 61, and was buried in Bective Abbey, Meath, Ireland (Body), Dublin, Ireland (Head).

8044364648. Hervey WALTER Of Weeton,415,505,981,1651 son of Hervey WALTER Of Weeton and Daughter Of Walter De CAEN, was born about 1130 in Weeton & Preese, Fylde, Lancashire, England.

General Notes: BUTLER FAMILY HISTORY

Whether his wife was Walter de Caen's daughter or Thomas Becket's aunt or someone else, Hervey was succeeded by his son Hervey Walter, whose marriage was of considerable consequence to the family that was taking root. For his wife was Maud de Valognes, sister in law of Ranulph de Glanville, the most powerful of all Henry II's subjects; and Ranulph, who took an avuncular interest in the upbringing of Maud's children, so advanced them that even by the end of the 12th century the family tree was no mean sapling.

At least one of those children, Hubert Walter, was outstanding. Contemporary records give us some idea of him: he was tall and stately, not exactly gifted with the eloquence of one who had kissed the Blarney Stone and perhaps a bit too attentive to idle rumours, but loyal, resolute, witty and wary and wise withal.

I suppose he is commonly remembered as having been mainly instumental in raising the enormous ransom demanded by the Emperor Henry VI for Richard Couer de Lion. But Hubert had other claims to fame: he governed England ably and far better than King Richard would have done; he even laid some of the foundations of democracy as we know it. He enriched the See of Canterbury, he founded monasteries, he was learned in the law and altogether his achievements were legion; but above all, he was immensely prudent and immensely powerful.

His prudence is best illustrated by the fact that, without surrendering any of his integrity, he managed to enjoy and retain the confidence of Henry II, Richard I, and John--three kings of widely contrasting characters and predilections.

As to his power and prestige: Hubert had been Bishop of Salisbury and had accompanied Richard on the Third Crusade; he was then Primate, Chief Justiciar, Papal Legate and Chancellor--a sort of Pooh-Bah of his day--and when Hubert died in 1205, John paid him the oblique compliment: "Now for the first time am I King of England". That was what led to Magna Carta ten years later. [Butler Family History]

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Curt Hofemann, curt_hofemann@yahoo.com, in a post-em, wrote:

of Amounderness, Lancashire, and West Dereham, Norfolk [Ref: Watney p187]

from the 1911 version of the Encyclopedia Britannica:
Hervey Walter, son of this Hervey, advanced his family by matching with Maude, daughter of Theobald de Valognes, lord of Parham, whose sister Bertha was wife of Ranuif de Glanville, the great justiciar, "the eye of the king." When Ranulf had founded the Austin Canons priory of Butley, Hervey Walter, his wife's brother-in-law, gave to the house lands in Wingfield for the soul's health of himself and his wife Maude, of Ranulf de Glanville and Bertha his wife, the charter, still preserved in the Harleian collection, being witnessed by Hervey's younger sons, Hubert Walter, Roger and Hamon.

Hervey married Maud De VALOINES 981.,1651 Maud was born about 1133 in Parham, Plomesgate, Suffolk, England. Another name for Maud was Maud De VALOGNES.

The child from this marriage was:

4022182324       i.  Theobald Walter Le BOTILLER 1st Butler (born before 1156 in West Dereham, Downham, Norfolk, England - died after April 1206 in Arklow, Wicklow, Leinster, Ireland)


8044364649. Maud De VALOINES,415,505,981,1651 daughter of Theobald De VALOINES Lord Of Parham and Unknown, was born about 1133 in Parham, Plomesgate, Suffolk, England. Another name for Maud was Maud De VALOGNES.

Maud married Hervey WALTER Of Weeton 981.,1651 Hervey was born about 1130 in Weeton & Preese, Fylde, Lancashire, England.

8044364652. Bertram De VERDUN Of Farnham & Alton,415,505,1557,1652,1653 son of William De VERDUN Of Saxlingham and Lesceline De CLINTON, was born before 1145 in Alton Castle, Cheadle, Staffordshire, England and died on 24 August 1192 in Joppa, Holy Lands 985.

General Notes: In 1166 Bertram de Verdon held two knights' fees in chief. In a return of the knights of Le Mont St-Michel in 1172 there is the entry "Radulfus de Fulgeriis debet unum militem de medietate de Buillun et de Chavei et de quadam parte Olivi. Istud autem servicium debet facere pro eo Bertramnus de Verdum, filius Normanni." The places are Bouillon (Manche, arr. Avranches, cant. Granville) and Chavoy (arr. and cant. Avranches). The entry makes it highly probable that Bertram derived his name from Verdun as above. (Verdun: a fief in par. Vessey, Manche, cant. Pontorson) [The Origins of Some Anglo-Norman Families]

Bertram married Rohese.1654 Rohese was born about 1155 in Buckinghamshire, England.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Lesceline De VERDUN was born about 1178 in Alton, Cheadle, Staffordshire, England and died before 1234 in Ulster, Ireland.

4022182326      ii.  Nicholas De VERDUN Of Alton, Sir (born after 1175 in Alton Castle, Cheadle, Staffordshire, England - died before 23 October 1231 in Farnham Royal, Buckinghamshire, England)


8044364653. Rohese 415,505,1654 was born about 1155 in Buckinghamshire, England.

Rohese married Bertram De VERDUN Of Farnham & Alton 1557,1652.,1653 Bertram was born before 1145 in Alton Castle, Cheadle, Staffordshire, England and died on 24 August 1192 in Joppa, Holy Lands 985.

8044364654. Philip Le BOTELER 415,505,1188 was born about 1157. Another name for Philip was Philip Le BUTILLER.

Philip married.

Children from this marriage were:

4022182327       i.  Clemence Le BOTELER (born about 1175 - died after 23 October 1231)

               ii.  Llywelyn Mawr Òthe Greató AP IORWERTH was born in 1173 in Aberffraw Castle, Caernarvonshire, Wales,1279 died on 11 April 1240 in Aberconway, Arllechwydd Isaf, Caernarvonshire, Wales 1279 at age 67, and was buried in Conway, Gwynedd, Caernarvonshire, Wales.


8044364658. Walkelin Seigneur De FERRIERS Lord Of Oakham,415,1293,1341,1655 son of Henry De FERRIERS Of Oakham & Lechlade and Unknown, was born about 1135 in Ferrieres-St-Hilaire, Eure, Normandy, France and died in Oakham Hall, Rutlandshire, England. Another name for Walkelin was Walcheline De FERRERS Lord Of Oakham.

General Notes: Builder of Oakhum Hall

-----------------

(c) . . . The lands in Normandy were eventually inherited by Henry de Ferrieres, his [Robert de Ferrieres, 1st Earl of Derby's] nephew (son and heir of one of his brothers, Engenulf or William). Henry, who was living in 1136, held Oakham, co. Rutland, and Lechlade, co. Gloucester (a manor held by his grandfather Henry at the Domesday Survey). He was father of Walkelin, who was father of (1) Henry, Seigneur de Chambres in 1202, (2) Hugh, of Lechlade, who dsp. in 1204, having m. Margaret, daughter and heir of Hugh de Say of Richard's Castle, and (3) Isabel (d. before 31 May 1252), who m., 1stly, Roger de Mortemer of Wigmore (d. 24 June 1214), and 2ndly, Piers fitz Herbert of Blaen Llyfni (d. 1 June 1235). Isabel inherited Lechlade, and also Oakham, which her eldest brother, Henry, had lost at the time of the conquest of Normandy. Henry was the ancestor of the seigneurs of Ferrieres and Chambrais, the last of whom, Jean, dspm. in 1504. A custom quite recently existed that a peer of the realm, the first time he passed through Oakham, should give a horse-shoe to be nailed upon the castle-gate; a toll or privilege dating, no doubt, from the time of the ancient lords of that town. [Complete Peerage IV:191 note (c)]

Walkelin married Goda De TOENI 1655 about 1162 in Sussex, England. Goda was born about 1136 in Eggington, Derbyshire, England.1655 Another name for Goda was Goda De TONI.

Children from this marriage were:

4022182329       i.  Isabel De FERRIERS (born in 1172 in Oakham Hall, Rutlandshire, England - died on 29 April 1252 in Lechlade, Faringdon, Gloucestershire, England)

               ii.  Hugh De FERRIERS Of Lechlade was born about 1175 in Lechlade, Faringdon, Gloucestershire, England and died in 1204 in (Dsp) 1656 about age 29. Another name for Hugh was Hugh De FERRERS Of Lechlade.

              iii.  Robert De FERRIERS Of Oakham was born in 1177 in Oakham Hall, Rutlandshire, England and died in December 1225 in (Dsp) 1657 at age 48. Another name for Robert was Robert De FERRERS Of Oakham.


8044364659. Goda De TOENI,415,1655 daughter of Roger III De TOENI Lord Of Flamstead and Ida (Gertrude) Of HAINAULT, was born about 1136 in Eggington, Derbyshire, England.1655 Another name for Goda was Goda De TONI.

Goda married Walkelin Seigneur De FERRIERS Lord Of Oakham 1293,1341,1655 about 1162 in Sussex, England. Walkelin was born about 1135 in Ferrieres-St-Hilaire, Eure, Normandy, France and died in Oakham Hall, Rutlandshire, England. Another name for Walkelin was Walcheline De FERRERS Lord Of Oakham.

8044364660. Iorwerth Drwyndwn Ap OWAIN Prince North Wales,415,505,631,1392 son of Owain Gwynedd Ap GRUFFUDD King Of Gwynedd and Gwladus Verch LLYWARCH, was born about 1129 in Aberffraw Castle, Anglsy, Wales and died about 1174 1279,1392 about age 45.

Iorwerth married Marared Verch MADOG 1392,1591 about 1163. Marared was born about 1129 in Powys-Vadoc, Wales.

The child from this marriage was:

4022182330       i.  Llewelyn Ab IORWERTH Prince Of Wales (born in 1173 in Aberffraw Castle, Caernarvonshire, Wales - died on 11 April 1240 in Aberconway, Arllechwydd Isaf, Caernarvonshire, Wales)


8044364661. Marared Verch MADOG,415,631,1392,1591 daughter of Madog Ap MAREDUDD King Of Powys and Susanna VERCH GRUFFYDD AP CYNAN, was born about 1129 in Powys-Vadoc, Wales.

General Notes:
It has been suggested that Llywelyn's mother was a Corbet. Dugdale indicates that Llywelyn referred to a Walter Corbet as Òfrater Willielmi Corbet avunculi mei.Ó However, there are other ways in which an uncle-nephew relationship between William Corbet, an obscure individual, and Llywelyn can be explained, so there is no good reason to reject the identity of his mother as Margred. 1591

Marared married Iorwerth Drwyndwn Ap OWAIN Prince North Wales 1392 about 1163. Iorwerth was born about 1129 in Aberffraw Castle, Anglsy, Wales and died about 1174 1279,1392 about age 45.

8044364662. John I "Lackland" PLANTAGENET King Of England,399,415,417,505,642,670,774,775,776,777,779,825,827,835,855,1057,1062,1065,1108,1166,1167,1168,1169,1170,1171,1172,1173,1174,1175,1176,1177,1178,1179,1180,1181,1182 son of Henry II "Curt Mantel" PLANTAGENET King Of England and Eleanor Of AQUITAINE Duchess Of Aquitaine, was born on 24 December 1166 in Kings Manor House, Oxford, Oxfordshire, England,389,390,835,1112 was christened in Kings Manor House, Oxford, Oxfordshire, England, died on 19 October 1216 in Newark Castle, Nottinghamshire, England 389,390,835,1112 at age 49, and was buried in 1216 in Cathedral, Worcester, Worcestershire, England.389,390 The cause of his death was dysentery. Another name for John was 3rd Earl Of GLOUCESTER John King Of England.1113

General Notes: John (French: Jean) (December 24, 1166–October 18, 1216) reigned as King of England from 1199 to 1216. He succeeded to the throne as the younger brother of King Richard I (known as "Richard the Lionheart"). John acquired the nicknames of "Lackland" (in French, sans terre) and "Soft-sword".

John's reign has been traditionally characterized as one of the most disastrous in English history: it began with defeats—he lost Normandy to Philippe Auguste of France in his first five years on the throne—and ended with England torn by civil war and himself on the verge of being forced out of power. In 1213, he made England a papal fief to resolve a conflict with the Church, and his rebellious barons forced him to sign Magna Carta in 1215, the act for which he is best remembered. Some have argued, however, that John ruled no better or worse than his immediate predecessor or his successor.

Born at Oxford, John was the fifth son of King Henry II of England and Eleanor of Aquitaine, and was always his father's favourite son, though as the youngest, he could expect no inheritance (hence his nickname, "Lackland"). In 1189 he married Avisa, daughter and heiress of the Earl of Gloucester. (She is given several alternative names by history, including Isabella, Hawise, Joan, and Eleanor.) They had no children, and John had their marriage annulled on the grounds of consanguinity, some time before or shortly after his accession to the throne, which took place on April 6, 1199, and she was never acknowledged as queen. (She then married Geoffrey de Mandeville as her second husband and Hubert de Burgh as her third).

Before his accession, John had already acquired a reputation for treachery, having conspired sometimes with and sometimes against his elder brothers, Henry and Richard . In 1184, John and Richard both claimed that they were the rightful heir to the Aquitaine, one of many unfriendly encounters between the two. In 1185 though, John became the ruler of Ireland, whose people grew to despise him, causing John to leave after only eight months.

During Richard's absence on crusade from 1190 to 1194, John attempted to overthrow his designated regent, despite having been forbidden by his brother to leave France. This was one reason the older legend of Hereward the Wake was updated to King Richard's reign, with "Prince John" as the ultimate villain and with the hero now called "Robin Hood". However, on his return to England in 1194, Richard forgave John and named him as his heir.

On Richard's death, John did not gain immediate universal recognition as king. Some regarded his young nephew, Arthur of Brittany, the posthumous son of John's brother Geoffrey, as the rightful heir. He and John contested for the throne, but John captured Arthur and his sister Eleanor around 1203. Arthur died, allegedly murdered, about this time and Eleanor remained a prisoner the rest of her life (which ended in 1241); through deeds such as these, John acquired a reputation for ruthlessness.

In the meantime, John had remarried, on August 24, 1200, Isabella of Angoulême, who was twenty years his junior. She was the daughter of Aimer Taillfer, Count of Angouleme. Isabella eventually produced five children, including two sons (Henry and Richard), Joan of England, Isabel of England and Eleanor of England. Around this time John also married off his illegitimate daughter, Joan, to the Welsh prince Llywelyn the Great, building an alliance in the hope of keeping peace within England and Wales so that he could recover his French lands. The French king had declared most of these forfeit in 1204, leaving John only Gascony in the southwest.

John had other illegitimate children. By a mistress, daughter of Hamelin Plantagenet and Isabel de Warenne, John had Richard Fitz Roy (or De Warrenne), Baron of Chilham. By another mistress, Hawise, John had Oliver Fitz Roy. By unknown mistress (or mistresses) John had other illegitimate children: Geoffrey Fitz Roy; John Fitz Roy; Henry Fitz Roy; Osbert Gifford; Eudes (or Ives) Fitz Roy; Bartholomew Fitz Roy and Maud Fitz Roy.

As far as the administration of his kingdom went, John functioned as quite a just and enlightened ruler, but he won the disapproval of the barons by taxing them. The tax known as scutage, a penalty for those who failed to supply military resources, became particularly unpopular. He also fell out with the Pope by rejecting Stephen Langton, the official candidate for the position of Archbishop of Canterbury. This resulted in John's excommunication. He had much the same kind of dispute with the church as his father had had before him. Unfortunately, his excommunication encouraged his political rivals to rise against him. Having successfully put down the Welsh Uprising of 1211, he turned his attentions back to his overseas interests and regained the approval of Pope Innocent III.

The European wars culminated in defeat at the Battle of Bouvines, which forced the king to accept an unfavourable peace with France. This finally turned the barons against him, and he met their leaders at Runnymede, near London, on June 15, to sign the Great Charter called, in Latin, Magna Carta. Because he had signed under duress, however, John felt entitled to break his word as soon as hostilities had ceased, provoking the First Barons' War.

In the following year, John, retreating from an invasion by Prince Louis of France (whom the majority of the English barons had invited to replace John on the throne), crossed the marshy area known as The Wash in East Anglia and lost his most valuable treasures, including the Crown Jewels as a result of the unexpected incoming tide. This dealt him a terrible blow, which affected his health and state of mind, and he succumbed to dysentery, dying on October 18 or October 19, 1216, at Newark in Lincolnshire*. Numerous, if fictitious, accounts circulated soon after his death that he had been killed by poisoned ale or poisoned plums. He lies buried in Worcester Cathedral in the city of Worcester. His nine-year-old son succeeded him and became King Henry III of England, and although Louis continued to claim the English throne, the barons switched their allegiance to the new king, forcing Louis to give up his claim and sign the Treaty of Lambeth in 1217.

*Footnote: Newark now lies within the County of Nottinghamshire, close to its long boundary with Lincolnshire.

For a long time, school children have learned that King John had to approve Magna Carta by attaching his seal to it because he could not sign it, lacking the ability to read or write. This textbook inaccuracy resembled that of textbooks which claimed that Christopher Columbus wanted to prove the earth was round. Whether the original authors of these errors knew better and oversimplified because they wrote for children, or whether they had been misinformed themselves, as a result generations of adults remembered mainly two things about "wicked King John", both of them wrong. (The other "fact" was that, if Robin Hood had not stepped in, Prince John would have embezzled the money raised to ransom King Richard. The fact is that Prince John did embezzle the ransom money, by creating forged seals.)

In fact, King John did sign the draft of the Charter that the negotiating parties hammered out in the tent on Charter Island at Runnymede on 15–18 June 1215, but it took the clerks and scribes working in the royal offices some time after everyone went home to prepare the final copies, which they then sealed and delivered to the appropriate officials. In those days, legal documents were sealed to make them official, not signed. (Even today, many legal documents are not considered effective without the seal of a notary public or corporate official, and printed legal forms such as deeds say "L.S." next to the signature lines. That stands for the Latin locus signilli ("place of the seal"), signifying that the signer has used a signature as a substitute for a seal.) When William the Conqueror (and his wife) signed the Accord of Winchester in 1072, for example, they and all the bishops signed with crosses, as illiterate people would later do, but they did so in accordance with current legal practice, not because the bishops could not write their own names.

Henry II had at first intended that his son Prince John receive an education to go into the Church, which would have meant Henry did not have to give him any land, but in 1171 Henry began negotiations to betroth John to the daughter of Count Humbert III of Maurienne-Savoy (who had no son yet and so wanted a son-in-law), and after that, talk of making John a churchman ceased. John's parents had both received a good education—Henry II spoke some half dozen languages, and Eleanor of Aquitaine had attended lectures at what would soon become the University of Paris—in addition to what they had learned of law and government, religion, and literature. John himself had received one of the best educations of any king of England. Some of the books the records show he read included: De Sacramentis Christianae Fidei by Hugh St. Victor, Sentences by Peter Lombard, The Treatise of Origen, and a history of England—potentially Wace's Roman de Brut, based on Geoffrey of Monmouth's Historia Regum Britanniae.

According to records of payment made to King John's bath attendant, William Aquarius, the king bathed on average about once every three weeks, which cost a considerable sum of 5d to 6d each, suggesting an elaborate and ceremonial affair. Although this may seem barbaric by modern standards, it was civilized compared to monks who were expected to bath three times a year, with the right not to bathe at all if they so chose. By contrast King John dressed very well in coats made of fur from sable and ermine and other exotic furs such as polar bear. 1183

Noted events in his life were:

• Ruled: 1199-1216.

• Bullet: SIGNED THE MAGNA CHARTA, 1215.

John married Agatha De FERRERS,662,1184,1185,1186 daughter of William De FERRERS 3rd Earl Of Derby and Sybil De BRAOSE, not Married in No Marriage. Agatha was born about 1175 in Tutbury, Burton-On-Trent, Staffordshire, England.

John next married Clemence Le BOTELER 1187,1188,1189 before 1189 in No Marriage 389,390,1095.,1187 Clemence was born about 1175 and died after 23 October 1231 985. Another name for Clemence was Clemence Le BUTILLER.

Marriage Notes: Isabel was a Child Bride at 11
_NONE
CHAN26 Feb 2002


John next married Isabella Taillefer De ANGOULEME Queen Of England,835,1171,1192,1193,1194,1195,1196,1197,1198 daughter of Aymer (Adhemar) Taillefer De ANGOULEME Count Angouleme and Alice De COURTENAY Countess Of Angouleme, on 24 August 1200 in Bordeaux, Gironde, France 835,838.,1112 Isabella was born in 1188 in Angouleme, Charente, Poitou-Charentes, France,835,1199,1200,1201 died on 31 May 1246 in Fontevrault Abbey, Maine-Et-Loire, Pays-DE-La-Loire, France 835,1199 at age 58, and was buried in Fountevrault Abbey, Anjou, Isere, France. Another name for Isabella was Isabella TAILLEFER De \Angouleme\.

Noted events in her life were:

• Lived: Berkhamsted Castle, Hertfordshire, England. 1223

John next married Suzanne Plantagenet De WARENNE,1205 daughter of Hamelin PLANTAGENET 5th Earl Of Surrey and Isabel De WARENNE 4th Countess Of Surrey, not Married in No Marriage. Suzanne was born about 1168 in Surrey, England.662,1200,1206,1207

John next married Isabel Mortain FITZROBERT 3rd Countess Of Gloucester,662,785,1210,1211,1212,1213,1214,1215 daughter of William FITZROBERT 2nd Earl Of Gloucester and Hawise De BEAUMONT, on 29 August 1189 in 1st Husband 1St Wife - Divorced 1199 389,390,1095.,1210 Isabel was born about 1173 in Tewkesbury, Gloucestershire, England, died on 14 October 1217 in Kent County, England 1210,1212 about age 44, and was buried in Canterbury Cathedral, Canterbury, Kent, England. Other names for Isabel were Isabel Mortain, and 3rd Countess Of GLOUCESTER Isabel Fitzrobert.

John next married Constance BRETAGNE Countess Of Brittany 780 not Married. Constance was born on 12 June 1166 of Bretagne, Indre, France,785,1216,1217,1218,1219 died on 31 August 1201 in Nantes, Loire-Atlantique, France at age 35, and was buried on 5 September 1201 in Abbey DE Villeneuve, Pas-DE-Calais, France.

Noted events in her life were:

• Lived: Penthievre, Cotes-du-Nord, France.

John next married Clemence Clementia DAUNTSEY. Clemence was born about 1165.1220

John next married Maud Matilda Fitzharding BERKELEY 662,1222 in Unmd. Maud was born about 1160 in Brimsfield, Gloucester, England.

John next married Hawisa Hadwiga Of Gloucester FITZWARIN in Unmd. Hawisa was born about 1167 of Gloucester, , , England.

John next married CONCUBINE in Unmd. CONCUBINE was born about 1168 in Of, Kenilworth, Essex, England.

John next married PLANTAGENET in Kings Manor Hous, Oxford, Oxfordshire, England.

John next married Matilda GIFFORD in Not Married. Matilda was born about 1170 in Of, , , England.

John next married CONCUBINE. CONCUBINE was born about 1168 in Of, , Lincolnshire, England.

8044364663. Clemence Le BOTELER,415,505,670,1187,1188,1189 daughter of Philip Le BOTELER and Unknown, was born about 1175 and died after 23 October 1231 985. Another name for Clemence was Clemence Le BUTILLER.

General Notes: According to Paul Reed, Rohese was the only child that Clemence had by Nicholad de Verdun.

Douglas Richardson proposed that Clemence, the wife of Nicholas de Verdun, was mother of John's illegitimate daughter Joan, who was known to be named Clemence. This remains to be proven, although Douglas presented circumstantial evidence for his proposition. At the time he made the proposition, Nicholas de Verdun's wife was thought to be Clemence de Dauntsey. She was later proven to be Clemence de Butiller/Boteler by Paul Reed.

Clemence married Nicholas De VERDUN Of Alton, Sir 985 about 1205 in 2ND Wife.985 Nicholas was born after 1175 in Alton Castle, Cheadle, Staffordshire, England 985 and died before 23 October 1231 in Farnham Royal, Buckinghamshire, England 985.

Clemence next married John I "Lackland" PLANTAGENET King Of England 779,825,827,835,855,1062,1065,1108,1170,1171,1172,1173,1174,1175,1176,1177,1178,1179,1180,1181,1182 before 1189 in No Marriage 389,390,1095.,1187 John was born on 24 December 1166 in Kings Manor House, Oxford, Oxfordshire, England,389,390,835,1112 was christened in Kings Manor House, Oxford, Oxfordshire, England, died on 19 October 1216 in Newark Castle, Nottinghamshire, England 389,390,835,1112 at age 49, and was buried in 1216 in Cathedral, Worcester, Worcestershire, England.389,390 The cause of his death was dysentery. Another name for John was 3rd Earl Of GLOUCESTER John King Of England.1113

8044364664. William III De BRAOSE 11th Lord Abergavenny,415,505,712,885,1658 son of William II De BRAOSE 10th Lord Of Abergavenny and Bertha De GLOUCESTER Heiress Of Brecon, was born in 1153 in Bramber, Sussex, England, died on 9 August 1211 in Corbeil, Marne, Champagne, France 885,1658 at age 58, and was buried on 10 August 1211 in Abbey Of St Victorie, Paris, Ile-DE-France, France.

General Notes: OWNERS of the LORDSHIP of ABERGAVENNY (XI)

William de Briouze, Lord of Briouze [in Normandy], Bramber, Brecon, Over-Gwent, etc., son and heir (a). He m. Maud de St Valery, "Lady of La Haie." In consequence of his well-known quarrel with King John, his lands were forfeited in 1208, and his wife and 1st son starved to death in the dungeons of Corfe (or of Windsor) in 1210. He d. at Corbeil near Paris, 9, and was buried 10 Aug 1211, in the Abbey of St. Victor at Paris. [Complete Peerage I:22]

(a) He slaughtered Seisyll ap Dyvnwal and a host of unarmed Welshmen, in the castle of Abergavenny in 1175, in revenge for the death of his uncle Henry of Hereford. Seisyll was owner of Castle Arnold, and is said in an inaccurate version of the Brut to have captured Abergavenny in 1172, the slaughter being dated 1177. But the better version of the Brut, on the contrary, states that Seisyll was captured in 1172 by the garrison of Abergavenny.

--------------------------------------

At his peak Lord of Bramber, Gower, Abergavenny, Brecknock, Builth, Radnor, Kington, Limerick, and the three castles of Skenfrith, Grosmont, and Whitecastle.

William inherited Bramber, Builth, and Radnor from his father, Brecknock and Abergavenny through his mother. He was the strongest of the Marcher Lords involved in constant war with the Welsh and other lords. He was particularly hated by the Welsh for the massacre of three Welsh princes, their families and their men which took place during a feast at his castle of Abergavenny in 1175. He was sometimes known as the "Ogre of Abergavenny". One of the Normans' foremost warriors, he fought alongside King Richard at Chalus in 1199 (where Richard was killed).

William received Limerick in 1201 from King John. He was also given custody of Glamorgan, Monmouth, and Gwynllwg in return for large payments.

William captured Arthur, Count of Brittany at Mirebeau in 1202 and was in charge of his imprisonment for King John. He was rewarded in February 1203 with the grant of Gower. He may have had knowledge of the murder Prince Arthur and been bribed to silence by John with the city of Limerick in July. His honors reached their peak when he was made Sheriff of Herefordshire by John in 1206-7. He had held this office under Richard from 1192-1199.

His fall began almost immediately. William was stripped of his office as bailiff of Glamorgan and other custodies in 1206-7. Later he was deprived of all his lands and, sought by John in Ireland, he returned to Wales and joined the Welsh Prince Llewelyn in rebellion. He fled to France in 1210 via Shoreham "in the habit of a beggar" and died in exile near Paris. Despite intending to be interred at St John's, Brecon, he was buried in the Abbey of St Victorie, Paris by Stephen Langton, the Archbishop of Canterbury, another of John's chief opponents who was also taking refuge there.

His wife and son were murdered by King John-starved to death at Windsor Castle.

See Castle of Grosmont


William de Braose inherited the large estates of his grandmother, Berta de Gloucester, and besides possessed the Honour of Braose, in Normandy. This feudal lord was a personage of great power and influence during the reigns of Henry II and Richard I, from the former of whom he obtained a grant of the "whole kingdom of Limeric, in Ireland," for the service of sixty knight's fees, to be held of the king and his younger son, John. For several years after this period, he appears to have enjoyed the favour of King John and his power and possessions were augmented by divers grants from the crown. In the 10th of the king's reign [1209], when the kingdom laboured under an interdiction and John deemed it expedient to demand hostages from his barons to ensure their allegiance should the Pope proceed to the length of absolving them from obedience to the crown, his officers who came upon the mission to the Baron de Braose were met by Maud, his wife, and peremptorily informed that she would not entrust any of her children to the king, who had so basely murdered his own nephew, Prince Arthur. de Braose rebuked her for speaking thus, however, and said that if he had in anything offended the king, he was ready to make satisfaction according to the judgment of the court and the barons, his peers, upon an appointed day and at any fixed place without, however, giving hostages. This answer being communicated to the king, an order was immediately transmitted to seize upon the baron's person, but Braose having notice thereof fled with his family into Ireland.

This quarrel between de Braose and King John is, however, differently related by other authorities. The monk of Llanthony stated that King John disinherited and banished him for his cruelty to the Welsh in his war with Gwenwynwyn, and that his wife Maud and William, his son and heir, died prisoners in Corfe Castle. Another writer relates, "that this William de Braose, son of Philip de Braose, Lord of Buelt, held the lands of Brecknock and Went for the whole time of King Henry II, Richard I, and King John without any disturbance until he took to wife the Lady Maud de St. Walerie, who, in revenge of Henry de Hereford, cause divers Welshmen to be murthered in the castle of Bergavenny as they sat at meat; and that for this, and for some other pickt quarrel, King John banished him and all his out of England. Likewise, that in his exile, Maud his wife, with William, galled, Gam, his son, were taken and put into prison where she died the 10th year after her husband fought with Gwenwynwyn and slew three thousand Welch." From these various relations, says Dugdale, it is no easy matter to discover what his demerits were, but what usage he had at last, take here the credit of these two historians who lived near that time. "This year, viz. anno 1240," quoth Matthew of Westminster, "the noble lady Maud, wife of William de Braose, with William, their son and heir, were miserably famished at Windsor by the command of King John; and William, her husband, escaping from Scorham, put himself into the habit of a beggar and, privately getting beyond sea, died soon after at Paris, where he had burial in the abbey of St. Victor." And Matthew Paris, putting his death in anno 1212 (which differs a little in time), says, "That he fled from Ireland to France and, dying at Ebula, his body was carried to Paris and there honourably buried in the abbey of St. Victor." "But after these great troubles in his later days," continues Dugdale, "I shall now say something of his pious works. Being by inheritance from his mother, Lord of Bergavenny, he made great grants to the monks of that priory, conditionally, that the abbot and convent of St. Vincent, in Maine (to which this priory of Bergavenny was a cell) should daily pray for the soul of him, the said William, and the soul of Maud, his wife."

This great but unfortunate personage had issue by his wife, Maud de St. Walerie, I. William; II. Giles: III. Reginald; IV. Sir John; I. Joane; II. Loretta; III. Margaret; IV. Maud.

When the contest between King John and the barons broke out, Giles de Braose, bishop of Hereford, arraying himself under the baronial banner, was put in possession by the people of Bergavenny and the other castles of the deceased lord, and eventually King John, in the last year of his reign, his wrath then being assuaged, granted part of those lands to the bishop's younger brother and heir. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 72, Braose, Baron Braose, of Gower]

William married Maude De ST. VALERY 712,885,1658 in 1169. Maude was born in 1155 in Isleworth, Middlesex, England,1659 died in 1210 in Corfe, Windsor, England 1660 at age 55, and was buried by Starvation, Walled Up In Corfe Castle Ordered By King John.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  William IV The Younger De BRAOSE Lord Bramber was born about 1175 of Bramber, Sussex, England & Gower, Wales 1658 and died in 1210 in Corfe, Windsor, England 1658 about age 35.

4022182332      ii.  Reginald De BRAOSE 13th Lord Of Abergavenny (born about 1179 in Bramber, Sussex, England - died before 9 June 1228 in Abergavenny, Over Gwent, Monmouthshire, Wales)

              iii.  Giles De BRAOSE 12th Lord Of Abergavenny was born about 1176 in Abergavenny, Over Gwent, Monmouthshire, Wales, died on 13 November 1215 in Gloucester, Gloucestershire, England (As A Bishop) 885 about age 39, and was buried in Hereford Cathedral, Herefordshire, England.

               iv.  Margaret De BRAOSE was born about 1177 in Abergavenny, Over Gwent, Monmouthshire, Wales and died on 19 November 1200 in Weobley, Herefordshire, England 1647 about age 23.

                v.  Laurette De BRAOSE Heir Of Tawstock was born about 1178 in Tawstock, Barnstaple, Devonshire, England and died from 4 March 1266 to 1267 in Hackington, Canterbury, Kent, England 1661 about age 88.

               vi.  Leuca De BRAOSE was born about 1181 in Bramber, Sussex, England and died in 1236 1662 about age 55.

              vii.  Eleanor (Annor) De BRAOSE was born about 1192 in Abergavenny, Over Gwent, Monmouthshire, Wales and died from after 26 January 1240 to 1241 in (As A Recluse) 1294.


8044364665. Maude De ST. VALERY,415,712,885,1658 daughter of Bernard IV De ST. VALERY Of Beckley & Horton and Eleanor (Aenor\Aanor) De DOMMART, was born in 1155 in Isleworth, Middlesex, England,1659 died in 1210 in Corfe, Windsor, England 1660 at age 55, and was buried by Starvation, Walled Up In Corfe Castle Ordered By King John.

Maude married William III De BRAOSE 11th Lord Abergavenny 712,885,1658 in 1169. William was born in 1153 in Bramber, Sussex, England, died on 9 August 1211 in Corbeil, Marne, Champagne, France 885,1658 at age 58, and was buried on 10 August 1211 in Abbey Of St Victorie, Paris, Ile-DE-France, France.

8044364666. William De BRIWERE Lord Of Sumburne & Torre,415,877,878,879,880,881 son of Henry De BRIWERE Of Stoke and Miss WALTON, was born about 1145 in Little Bytham, Lincolnshire, England 882 and died in 1226 in Little Somborne, Hampshire, England 883 about age 81.

General Notes: William Briwere, Sheriff of Bucks, Berks, Derbys, Devon, Nottingham and Oxon. [Burke's Peerage

Lord of Torre, Devonshire and of Horsley, Derbyshire. He gained control of the Horsley estate and was also granted the honour of the Lavendon estate in 1204.

Founded Dunkeswell Abbey.

------------------------------

The following information was contained in a post-em by Curt Hofemann, curt_hofemann@yahoo.com:

Sir William DE BRIWERRE. Lord of Horsley (DRB) Born circa 1145. Married Beatrice DE VAUX / DE VALLE. Sheriff of Devon for 10 years, until his death in 1227 in the reign of Henry III. After 1189 Itinerant Justice for King Richard. Seat: Bridgwater, Somersetshire. Circa 1192 "Richard employed his exceptional talents by making him an Itinerant Justice and an ambassador to the French court where he was instrumental in drawing up the terms for Richard's release from captivity, and on that king's second absence abroad Brewer was one of the 4 Justiciars appointed to guard the realm." (*Gladwin, Sheriff). Held the honour of Plympton as a Redvers tenant. Died in 1226 (Burke's Landed Gentry) (Weis, AR.). Died in 1227 (*Gladwin, Sheriff). *Irene Gladwin, The Sheriff: The Man and his Office. London: Victor Gollancz Ltd, 1974 [Ref: Pat Patterson <patpnyc@nyc.rr.com> message to soc.genealogy.medieval 23 Feb 2001]

baron and judge, and a justice itinerant, 1187; bought land at Ileshal, Devon; was one of the four justices to whom Richard I, on leaving England, entrusted the charge of the kingdom; went to Worms to assist Richard I, then in captivity, at his interview with the Emperor, Henry VI, 1193; founded the Abbeys of Torr and Dunkeswell, and the Nunnery of Polslo, in Devon, and the Abbey on Mottisfont in Southants; became lord of Somborne near Southampton, and Sheriff of Devon, co. Oxford, co. Buchingham, Berks., Northants, and co. Derby; supported John against the Barons; assisted at the coronation of Henry III 1216; was one of the Barons of the Exchequer 1221; received a grant of the manor of Bridgewater, where he founded the Hospital of St. John Baptist [Ref: Watney p156]

In 1190 the Manor of King's Somborne was granted to William Briwere, a loyal servant of the Plantaganet kings, who made him one of the most powerful men in the realm, and rewarded him handsomely. Among other offices he was at various times sheriff of Hampshire and of other counties, (including Nottingham while Richard Coeur-de Lion was on a Crusade: this makes him Robin Hood's notorious adversary). He also signed Magna Carta. Though much disliked and an extortioner, his family married well: one of his descendants married Henry of Lancaster: their daughter, Blanche, who inherited the Manor in 1362, married John of Gaunt; the Manor then passed to their son, Henry Bolingbroke, who in 1399 became King Henry IV. The Manor remained a royal possession till the time of Charles I.

In 1200 William Brewer received from King John a licence to fortify a castle at Ashley: Ashley church had stood for over half a century already, so William's bailey was built around it. Subsequently the King stayed there to hunt in the Forest of Bere. In 1201 Brewer (sic) founded a Priory of Augustinian Canons at Mottisfont; his son gave them the church of King's Somborne: from 1207 till the dissolution of the Monastery the Priory appointed the vicars of King's Somborne, and no doubt the priests to serve at the altars and chantry. His brother John presented Little Somborne to the Priory, and there is unreliable evidence that a third brother, Peter de Rivaulx, was a monk there of some sanctity, known as 'the Monk in the Wall'. [Ref: HISTORY OF THE CHURCH OF ST PETER & ST PAUL, KINGS SOMBORNE http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~villages/somchurc.htm]

Regards,
Curt

William married Beatrice De Vallibus De VAUX 877,878,884,885 in 1175 in 2ND Husband. Beatrice was born about 1160 in Gilsland, Irthington, Cumberland, England and died from 24 March 1216 to 1217 in Stoke, Devonshire, England 886 about age 56. Another name for Beatrice was Beatrice De VALLE.

8044364667. Beatrice De Vallibus De VAUX,415,877,878,884,885 daughter of Herbert De VAUX Sir and Grace, was born about 1160 in Gilsland, Irthington, Cumberland, England and died from 24 March 1216 to 1217 in Stoke, Devonshire, England 886 about age 56. Another name for Beatrice was Beatrice De VALLE.

General Notes: The following information was contained in a post-em by Curt Hofemann, curt_hofemann@yahoo.com:

Beatrice de Valle (or Vaux), wife of William Briwerre, was almost certainly the daughter of Hubert de Vaux, baron of Gilsland (see ID 20718?), Cumberland, by his wife, Grace.

The evidence for this is slim but compelling. Beatrice had property in Devonshire as her maritagium. The early history of this property is shrouded.

However, Hubert de Vaux is known to have owned property in Devonshire, and probably lived there during part of his life. Beatrice de Valle had a daughter Grace Briwerre who I presume was named for her mother, Grace de Vaux. Grace was rather rare as a woman's name in that period. I have proven that William Briwerre acquired property from one of Beatrice's Vaux brothers and I have proven that William Briwerre was involved in a suit with the widow of another brother. If nothing else, this proves that the two families knew each other well.

I should also note that Beatrice de Valle was almost certainly the mother of Henry Fitz Count, bastard son of Reginald, Earl of Cornwall. This is indicated by two successive charters which unfortunately I don't have in hand. In these two charters, Henry Fitz Count makes a gift to some religious house and in the next charter, Beatrice's Briwerre son refers back to his "brother" without naming him, as if the parties understood who he meant. This would only make sense if the two charters were recorded at the same time and if Henry Fitz Count was the "brother" named by Beatrice's Briwerre son. The charters are published in Monasticon Exoniensis.

The name Vaux, by the way, was usually written in Latin as Vallibus but I have seen it on rare occasions as Valle. Beatrice's maiden name is given as Valle in one charter I have seen. [Ref: Douglas Richardson 25 Jan 1999 message to soc.genealogy.medieval]

Research note: numerous listings on Rootsweb Worldconnect show the above Reginald (de Dunstanville), Earl of Cornwall (bastard son of Henry I by Sybil Corbet) as Beatrice de Valle/Vaux's father & Beatrice Mortaigne/Mortain or Beatrice fitzRichard as her mother, but sources are lacking... Curt

Regards,
Curt

Beatrice married Reynold De DUNSTANVILLE 1st Earl Of Cornwall,891,892,893,894 son of Duke & Lion Of Justice Henry I "Beauclerc" King Of ENGLAND and Sibyl (Adela) (Lucy) CORBET Lady Of Alcester, before 1174 in No Marriage.890 Reynold was born about 1096 in Dunstanville, Kent, England,389,390,895 died on 1 July 1175 in Chertsey, Surrey, England (Dspms Legit) 389,390,893,896 about age 79, and was buried in Abbey, Reading, Berkshire, England.389,390 Other names for Reynold were 01st Earl Of CORNWALL Reginald De Dunstanville, and Reginald FITZROY Earl Of Cornwall.897

Noted events in his life were:

• Title: Earl of Cornwall, , , Cornwall, England. 390,417

• Title: Sheriff of Devon, 1173, , Devon, Devonshire, England. 390,417

Beatrice next married William De BRIWERE Lord Of Sumburne & Torre 877,878,879,880,881 in 1175 in 2ND Husband. William was born about 1145 in Little Bytham, Lincolnshire, England 882 and died in 1226 in Little Somborne, Hampshire, England 883 about age 81.

8044378128. Gilbert De VENABLES 1,235,309,385,386,387,388,505 son of Gilbert De VENABLES and Unknown, was born in 1105 in Venables, Normandy, France 505 and died in Deceased in Kinderton cum Hulme, Northwich, Cheshire, England 505.

Gilbert married.388

The child from this marriage was:

4022189064       i.  Gilbert De VENABLES Of Kinderton (born in 1130 in Kinderton Cum Hulme, Northwich, Cheshire, England)


8044388354. Patrick De SALISBURY 1st Earl Of Salisbury,399,415,505,662,746,861,1006,1007,1008,1009 son of Walter D'evereux SALISBURY Sheriff Of Wiltshire and Sibyl De CHAWORTH Countess Of Salisbury, was born about 1120 in Salisbury, Wiltshire, England,389,390 died on 27 March 1168 in Slain In Poitou, Vienne, France 389,390,1006,1009 about age 48, and was buried in St. Hilaire Abbey, Poitiers, Poitou, Vienne, France.389,390 The cause of his death was killed by Guy de Lusignan.

General Notes:
Earldom of Salisbury: The first creation of this title took place some time between June 1142 and 1147, when the Empress Maud, Henry I's daughter made Patrick de Salisbury an Earl. He is sometimes referred to as Earl of Wiltshire and sometimes as Earl of Salisbury, usually the latter. At this time an earldom was an official position rather than title of honour, but was often held by successive members of the same family, though not necessarily by right. Patrick was descended from a line of men who had been Sheriffs of Wiltshire from shortly after the Norman Conquest and who may even have been of English rather than Norman origin. Patrick's son succeeded him as Earl but died leaving an only child, a daughter called Ela or Isabel. Richard I arranged her marriage to William Longespee ("Long Sword"), his illegitimate half-brother by Henry II out of either Rosamund/Rosamond Clifford (the "Fair Rosamond" of tradition) or a woman of obscure antecedents called Hikenai or Ykenai. (Longespee may, however have been born of some other woman altogether). [Burke's Peerage]

-------------------------

EARLDOM OF WILTSHIRE (II) Note: Hervey de Leon was styled 1st Earl of Wiltshire

EARLDOM OF SALISBURY (I)

PATRICK DE SALISBURY, 2nd but 1st surviving son and heir [of Walter de Salisbury, styled also Walter FitzEdward and Walter the Sheriff by Sibyl, da. of Patrick de Chaources], supported the Empress, who made him her Constable, and by whom he was created, within the years 1142 (June)-1147, and probably after July 1143, EARL OF WILTSHIRE, being styled usually EARL OF SALISBURY. He was sheriff of Wiltshire. He was with Henry, Duke of Normandy, at Devizes on 13 April 1149, and again in 1153 (January-August); and at Westminster on 6 November 1153 he witnessed the treaty between Stephen and Henry. After the accession of Henry II, he continued to act as sheriff, and was frequently at Court. In 1163 he was present at the (first) translation of Edward the Confessor. In 1166 he held 40 fees inherited from his father, and 15 of his mother's maritagium, all 55 being of the old fcoffinent. In 1167 he was left in charge of the royal forces in Poitou. He confirmed his father's gifts to Bradenstoke, and was a benefactor to the priory of St. Denys, Southampton, and to the Templars.

He married, 1stly, Maud, daughter of . . . . He married, 2ndly, Ela, widow of William DE WARENNE, 3rd EARL OF SURREY, daughter of William TALVAS, COUNT OF PONTHIEU AND ALENÇON, by Ela, daughter of Eudes, DUKE OF BURGUNDY. He was killed in battle in Poitou by Geoffrey de Lusignan, about 7 April 1168, and was buried in the Abbey of St. Hilaire in Poitiers. His widow died 10 October 1174. [Complete Peerage XI:375-7, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Noted events in his life were:

• Unknown: Earl of Salisbury, Salisbury, , Wiltshire, England. 390,417,418

Patrick married Maud 1009 in 1st Wife.1009 Maud was born about 1120 in England.

Patrick next married Ela De TALVAISE Countess Of Montreuil 1007,1009,1011,1012 before 1152 in 2ND Husband 2ND Wife 389,390,1006,1007.,1010 Ela was born from 1118 to 1119 in Alencon, Orne, Normandy, France 389,390 and died on 4 October 1174 in Priory, Bradenstoke, Wiltshire, England 389,390,1007,1009,1012 at age 55. Another name for Ela was Ela D' ALENCON.

8044388355. Ela De TALVAISE Countess Of Montreuil,415,505,670,1007,1009,1010,1011,1012 daughter of William III TALVAS Count Of Alencon & Ponthieu and Alice (Alix Or Ela) Borel Of BURGUNDY Duchess Of Alençon, was born from 1118 to 1119 in Alencon, Orne, Normandy, France 389,390 and died on 4 October 1174 in Priory, Bradenstoke, Wiltshire, England 389,390,1007,1009,1012 at age 55. Another name for Ela was Ela D' ALENCON.

General Notes:
He [William de Warenne] married Ela or Ala, daughter of William TALVAS, COUNT OF PONTHIEU (son of Robert DE BELLÊME, 3rd EARL OF SHREWSBURY), by Ela, widow of Bertrand, COUNT OF TOULOUSE, and daughter of Eudes BOREL, DUKE OF BURGUNDY. He died s.p.m. 19 January 1147/8, being slain when the rearguard of the French King's army was cut to pieces in the defiles of Laodicea. His widow married, probably in or before 1152, Patrick (DE SALISBURY), 1st EARL OF WILTSHIRE or SALISBURY (died 1168). She is said to have died 4 October 1174. [Complete Peerage XII/1:496-7, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Noted events in her life were:

• Title: Countess of Montreuil, <, Montreuil-Sous-Bois, Seine-St-Denis, France>. 390,417,1010

• Title: Countess of Ponthieu, <, Ponthieu, Picardie, France>. 390,417,1010

• Title: Countess of Salisbury, Salisbury, , Wiltshire, England. 390,417,1010

Ela married William De WARENNE 3rd Earl Of Surrey,1006,1011,1015 son of William De WARENNE 2nd Earl Of Surrey and Isabel (Elizabeth) De VERMANDOIS, about 1136 in 1st Husband 389,390,642,1007,1010.,1014 William was born about 1119 in Lewes, Sussex, England 389,390,1011,1015,1016 and died from 19 January 1147 to 1148 in Laodicea, Holy Lands (Dspm) 389,390,1011,1015 about age 28. The cause of his death was Died in the Holy Land. Another name for William was 03rd Earl Of SURREY William De Warenne.

Noted events in his life were:

• Title: Earl of Warren, , Warren, Sussex, England. 390,417,418,642,1014

• Title: Earl of Surrey, , , Surrey, England. 390,417,418,642,1014

Ela next married Patrick De SALISBURY 1st Earl Of Salisbury 662,746,861,1006,1007,1008,1009 before 1152 in 2ND Husband 2ND Wife 389,390,1006,1007.,1010 Patrick was born about 1120 in Salisbury, Wiltshire, England,389,390 died on 27 March 1168 in Slain In Poitou, Vienne, France 389,390,1006,1009 about age 48, and was buried in St. Hilaire Abbey, Poitiers, Poitou, Vienne, France.389,390 The cause of his death was killed by Guy de Lusignan.

8044388420. Robert II De MONTGOMERY 3rd Earl Shrewsbury,415,1354,1372,1375,1663,1664,1665,1666,1667 son of Roger II De MONTGOMERIE 1st Earl Of Shrewsbury and Mabel De Talvas D' ALENCON, was born between 1052 and 1056 in Alencon, Orne, Normandy, France,389,390,1354,1375,1665 died after 8 May 1131 in Wareham Castle, Dorsetshire, England (As A Prisoner) 389,390,1354,1665, and was buried in Wareham, Dorsetshire, England.1375 Other names for Robert were Robert II D' ALENCON 3rd Earl Of Shrewsbury,1120 03rd Earl Of ARUNDEL Robert II De Montgomery,1668 Robert II De BELLEME 3rd Earl Of Shrewsbury, Robert De Alençon EARL OF SHREWSBURY & ARUNDEL, and 3rd Earl Of SHREWSBURY Robert II De Montgomery.

General Notes:
Shrewsbury, Earldom of: Under the system then prevailing the Earldom passed to an elder brother, Robert de Belleme, who constructed Bridgnorth Castle and continued the family policy of harrying the Welsh. He rebelled against Henry I and in 1102 was deprived of the Earldom of Shrewsbury/Shropshire, together with his English and Welsh estates. [Burke's Peerage, p. 2604]

------------------------------------------------------

According to Winston Churchill in "A History of the English Speaking People", the Montgomeries (a very great house of Norman England) sided with Robert, Duke of Normandy, against his brother Henry I, in the war of succession after William Rufus, William The Conqueror's designated heir for England was killed in a hunting accident [in which Henry I was involved--some think more than an "accident"]. Henry I destroyed the power of the Montgomeries starting in September, 1100. He captured Robert in Normandy in the battle at Tinchebrai and combined England and Normandy again.

--------------

EARLDOM OF ARUNDEL (III) 1098 to 1102

EARLDOM OF SHREWSBURY (III) 1098 to 1102

ROBERT (DE BELLÊME), EARL OF SHREWSBURY, elder brother and heir being 2nd but 1st surviving son and heir of the 1st Earl by his ist wife, was born probably between between 1052 and 1056 and baptised at St. Martin of Sées. As a child he was at Sées with his elder brother Roger attesting a charter for St. Martin of Sées; and, probably after Roger's death, he attested a charter for St. Aubin of Angers (1060-62). After the death of his great-uncle Yves Bishop of Sées in 1070, he accompanied his parents to Bellême, which had devolved on his mother. In 1073 he served in the Conqueror's invasion of Maine and was knighted by the King at the siege of Fresnay-le-Vicomte. Probably he was now of age and began to act independently of his father; and about 1077 he joined the party of Robert Curthose. On his mother's death, 2 December 1079, he succeeded her in France as Lord of Bellême; and either then or on his father's remarriage he succeeded to the Norman lordships of Alençon and Domfront. In 1086 he is found holding his court of justice at Bellême. In September 1087 he was on his way to the King's court, when he heard of William's death; and turning back he expelled the King's officers from Alençon, Belléme and his other castles. He then conspired with the Conqueror's halfbrothers and other nobles to dethrone William II in favour of Robert Curthose. Crossing to England, he joined the other rebel leaders, who were besieged in Rochester Castle; and in June 1088 they were forced to surrender. He was soon reconciled to the King and returning to Normandy with Prince Henry, he was arrested when he landed by Duke Robert and imprisoned at Neuilly-l'Evêque; but his father soon obtained his release. The Duke seems to have appointed Robert one of his Stewards. In 1090 Robert supported the Duke against the Norman rebels who favoured William Rufus.[a] In 1092 his town of Dornfront revolted and called in Prince Henry, thus depriving Robert of one of his strongest castles. It was probably also in 1092 that he took a leading part in the successful siege of the castle of Breval by the King of France and the Duke of Normandy. In 1094 he made private war on his hereditary enemy Robert Géré, the lord of St. Céneri. On his father's death in 1094. he succeeded to all Roger's possessions in Normandy. When William Rufus invaded France in 1097 Robert was his "princeps militiae," and built for him the original castle at Gisors. In 1097, 1098 and 1099 he was at war with Hélie Count of Maine. After the death of his brother Hugh in 1098, Robert obtained Hugh's Earldom and lands in England and Wales from the King on payment of a relief of £3000 and thus became EARL OF SHROPSHIRE or SHREWSBURY. He also bought for a large sum, the honor of Blythe and all the land of his kinsman, Roger de Busli. He built the castle of Bridgnorth on the Severn, carried on the war against the Welsh and built a castle at "Caroclove" in Wales. He was in Normandy when William Rufus was killed; and hastening to England he did homage to Henry I, who confirmed him in the possession of his lands and dignities. In October 1100 by the death of his father-in-law he became Count of Ponthieu. In 1101 with other nobles, he stirred up Robert of Normandy to invade England; and when the Duke arrived in the autumn he deserted Henry to join him; but the Royal brothers came to an agreement. In 1102 Henry I summoned Robert de Bellême to his court to answer 45 accusations; but the Earl fled and fortified his castles; and he devastated Staffordshire with a force of Normans and Welsh. The King took his castles of Arundel, Blythe, and Bridgnorth and besieged him in Shrewsbury, while he incited the Duke of Normandy to take up arms against Robert in the Duchy. Finally Robert surrendered and was given a safe-conduct to the sea; but he was deprived of all his honours and lands in England and Wales. Thereby the Earldom of Shrewsbury became extinct. Robert retired to Normandy, where in 1103 he defeated the ducal army on the road from Exmes to Sées; but in the early summer of 1104 he made peace with the Duke. About 1105 he was at war with Rotrou, Count of Perche, who had claimed a share of the great Bellême inheritance and who defeated him. In the autumn of 1105 he attacked Henry's supporters in Normandy. However, before Christmas he went to England to treat with the King; but he returned to Normandy unreconciled. When Henry invaded Normandy in the early autumn of 1106, Robert adhered to the Duke. He commanded the rear division at the Battle of Tinchebrai, 28 September, but fled when the front division was badly cut up. Failing in an attempt to seduce the Count of Maine from his alliance with Henry, Robert made peace with the King on advantageous terms. On 17 May 1110 he was with Henry at Dover, when a treaty was made there with the Count of Flanders; but in 1111 he took a leading part in the plot to restore Normandy to Duke Robert's son William Clito, and in 1112 he rebelled and aided the Count of Anjou against the King. Later in that year the King of France sent him as Ambassador to Henry, to demand the release of Duke Robert, but the King seized him. He was tried on 4 November 1112 at Bonneville-sur-Touque on various charges, and was condemned in the King's court to the most rigorous imprisonment. He was confined at Cherbourg, and all his honours, lands and castles were forfeited. In July 1113 the King took him to England, where he was imprisoned in Wareham Castle, Dorset. He then disappears from history; but he was still living and presumably in Wareham Castle at Michaelmas 1130, when the Pipe Roll records payments under Dorset and Wiltshire of £18.5.0 for the maintenance, and 40 shillings for the clothes, of Robert de Bellême. Before 1092 Robert expelled the Canons from St. Leonard of Bellême and gave the church to the Abbot of Marmoutier, who replaced them by monks and a prior William. As Earl of Shrewsbury he gave the church of Catford to the abbey of St. Mary la Sauve Majure (diocese of Bordeaux), so that, as a canon died, a monk might receive his prebend.

He married before 9 September 1087, Agnes, 1st daughter and coheir of Guy I, COUNT OF PONTHIEU, by Ada. Agnes, who was sole heir to her father's comté, was treated cruelly by her husband, who kept her shut up for a long time in his castle at Bellême. She escaped by the help of a faithful chamberlain, took refuge with Adela Countess of Blois and retired to Ponthieu; whence she never returned to her husband. She was living on 6 October 1100, but died probably not very long afterwards. Robert died 8 May, not earlier than 1131, almost certainly in Wareham Castle and was presumably buried at Wareham.[f] [Complete Peerage XI:689-96, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

[a] On 3 November 1090 he took part in crushing the rebellion in Rouen. He built castles at Fourches and Château-Gontier. Being attacked by Hugh de Grandmesnil and other barons, after fierce fighting, in which Robert was aided by his brothers Roger and Arnulf, he appealed for help to the Duke, who came in force and besieged Courcy; until the landing of Rufus with an English army caused him to raise the siege (Orderic, Vol. iii, pp. 352, 356, 358, 361-66).

[f] Probably secretly, in a nameless grave. All the authorities agree in denouncing Robert as lawless, faithless and wicked; and above all they insist on his inhuman cruelty.

Noted events in his life were:

• Alt. Death: Alt. Death, 1119. 1120

Robert married Agnes Heiress Of Montreuil & PONTHIEU Countess Of Shrewsbury 1120,1354,1665 before 9 September 1087 in <, , , France> 389,390,1375,1663,1665.,1666 Agnes was born about 1065 in Ponthieu, Somme, Picardy, France 389,390 and died after 6 October 1100 in Ponthieu, Somme, Picardy, France 389,390,1354,1665.

Marriage Notes:
Reference Number:49821

The child from this marriage was:

4022194210       i.  William III TALVAS Count Of Alencon & Ponthieu (born after 1087 in Alencon, Orne, Normandy, France - died on 30 June 1171)


8044388421. Agnes Heiress Of Montreuil & PONTHIEU Countess Of Shrewsbury,415,1120,1354,1663,1665 daughter of Guy I Count Of Montreuil & PONTHIEU and Ada Of AMIENS, was born about 1065 in Ponthieu, Somme, Picardy, France 389,390 and died after 6 October 1100 in Ponthieu, Somme, Picardy, France 389,390,1354,1665.

General Notes:
He [Robert de Belleme] married before 9 September 1087, Agnes, 1st daughter and coheir of Guy I, COUNT OF PONTHIEU, by Ada. Agnes, who was sole heir to her father's comté, was treated cruelly by her husband, who kept her shut up for a long time in his castle at Bellême. She escaped by the help of a faithful chamberlain, took refuge with Adela Countess of Blois and retired to Ponthieu; whence she never returned to her husband. She was living on 6 October 1100, but died probably not very long afterwards. Robert died 8 May, not earlier than 1131, almost certainly in Wareham Castle and was presumably buried at Wareham.[f] [Complete Peerage XI:689-96, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Noted events in her life were:

• Title: Countess of Shrewsbury, , Shrewsbury, Shropshire, England. 390,417,1663

• Title: Countess of Ponthieu, , Ponthieu, Picardie, France. 390,417,1663

Agnes married Robert II De MONTGOMERY 3rd Earl Shrewsbury 1354,1372,1375,1664,1665,1666,1667 before 9 September 1087 in <, , , France> 389,390,1375,1663,1665.,1666 Robert was born between 1052 and 1056 in Alencon, Orne, Normandy, France,389,390,1354,1375,1665 died after 8 May 1131 in Wareham Castle, Dorsetshire, England (As A Prisoner) 389,390,1354,1665, and was buried in Wareham, Dorsetshire, England.1375 Other names for Robert were Robert II D' ALENCON 3rd Earl Of Shrewsbury,1120 03rd Earl Of ARUNDEL Robert II De Montgomery,1668 Robert II De BELLEME 3rd Earl Of Shrewsbury, Robert De Alençon EARL OF SHREWSBURY & ARUNDEL, and 3rd Earl Of SHREWSBURY Robert II De Montgomery.

8044388422. Eudes I Borel Duke Of BURGUNDY,415,670,1007,1669 son of Henry Of BURGUNDY and Sibylle Of BARCELONA, was born in 1058 in Dijon, Cote-D'or, Bourgogne, France 390,630 and died from 23 March 1102 to 1103 in Tarsus, Cilicia 390,630,1670 at age 44. Another name for Eudes was Eudes I BOREL Duke Of Burgundy.

Eudes married Matilda Of BURGUNDY 1669 in 1080. Matilda was born in 1065 in Bourgogne, France.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Hugh II "Le Pacifique" Duke Of BURGUNDY was born about 1085 in Dijon, Cote-D'or, Bourgogne, France 1669 and died from after 6 February 1142 to 1143 1669.

4022194211      ii.  Alice (Alix Or Ela) Borel Of BURGUNDY Duchess Of Alençon (born in November 1080 in Dijon, Cote-D'or, Bourgogne, France - died on 28 February 1142 in <Alençon, Bell, Orne, France>)

Eudes next married Sibylle De LOMBARDY Countess Of Burgundy in 1080 in <, Burgundy, Marne, France> 390.,630 Sibylle was born about 1065 in , Burgundy, Marne, France 390,630 and died after 1103 390,630.

Noted events in her life were:

• Unknown: Relationship. 390

• Unknown: Countess of Burgundy. 390,417,1671

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  Hugue Borel Le Pacifique De BURGUNDY was born in 1084 in <, Burgundy, Marne, France> 390,1672 and died in 1143 390,1672 at age 59.


8044388423. Matilda Of BURGUNDY,415,670,1669 daughter of William I "The Great" Count Of Macon & BURGUNDY and Stephanie (Etiennette) De LONGWY, was born in 1065 in Bourgogne, France.

Matilda married Eudes I Borel Duke Of BURGUNDY 1007,1669 in 1080. Eudes was born in 1058 in Dijon, Cote-D'or, Bourgogne, France 390,630 and died from 23 March 1102 to 1103 in Tarsus, Cilicia 390,630,1670 at age 44. Another name for Eudes was Eudes I BOREL Duke Of Burgundy.

8044388424. Andre I Seigneur De VITRE 415,744,1673,1674,1675 was born about 1065 in Vitre, Ille-Et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France 389,390 and died in 1139 1674 about age 74.

Andre married Agnes De MORTAGNE 1676 about 1061 in , Vitré, Îlle-Et-Vilaine, France 389,390,744,1270.,1673 Agnes was born about 1036 in Mortagne-Au-Perche, Orne, Normandy, France.389,390 Another name for Agnes was Agnes De MORTAIN.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Hawise De VITRE Countess Of Derby was born about 1069 in Vitre, Ille-Et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France.389,390

               ii.  Eudes De VITRÉ Count Of Rethel was born about 1070 in <, Vitré, Îlle-Et-Vilaine, France> 390,1677 and died in 1158 in <, Rethel, Ardennes, France> 390,1677 about age 88.

              iii.  Isabelle (Marquise) De VITRE was born about 1110 in Vitre, Ille-Et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France and died in 1162 1678 about age 52.

4022194212      iv.  Robert II Seigneur De VITRE (born about 1090 in Vitre, Ille-Et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France - died before 22 May 1161)


8044388425. Agnes De MORTAGNE,415,744,1673,1676 daughter of Robert De MORTAIGNE Earl Of Cornwall and Maud De MONTGOMERY, was born about 1036 in Mortagne-Au-Perche, Orne, Normandy, France.389,390 Another name for Agnes was Agnes De MORTAIN.

Agnes married Andre I Seigneur De VITRE 1674,1675 about 1061 in , Vitré, Îlle-Et-Vilaine, France 389,390,744,1270.,1673 Andre was born about 1065 in Vitre, Ille-Et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France 389,390 and died in 1139 1674 about age 74.

8044388426. Gualteir De La GUERCHE was born about 1069 in , , Brittany, France.390,1362

Gualteir married Basilia De La GUERCHE about 1093 in , , Brittany, France 390.,1362 Basilia was born about 1073 in , , Brittany, France.390,1362

The child from this marriage was:

4022194213       i.  Emma De La GUERCHE (born in 1105 in La Guerche, Vienne, Poitou, France - died after 10 April 1161)


8044388427. Basilia De La GUERCHE was born about 1073 in , , Brittany, France.390,1362

Basilia married Gualteir De La GUERCHE about 1093 in , , Brittany, France 390.,1362 Gualteir was born about 1069 in , , Brittany, France.390,1362

8044388428. Geoffrey DINHAM Knight 415,1679,1680 was born about 1065 in Dinan, Ille-Et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France 389,390,461 and died in 1138 389,390 about age 73.

Noted events in his life were:

• Unknown: Knighthood, <, Dinan, Côtes-Du-Nord, France>. 390

Geoffrey married Radegonde NERONDES about 1087 in <, Hartland, Devon, England> 389,390.,461 Radegonde was born about 1069 in Nerondes, Cher, Berry/Centre, France 389,390,461,1681 and died in 1147 390,1681 about age 78.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Oliver II De DINHAM & Hartland was born about 1088 in Buckland Dinham, Frome, Somerset, England 389,390 and died about 1150 in Hartland, Bideford, Devonshire, England 389,390,1679 about age 62.

4022194214      ii.  Alan De DINAN Of Burton (born about 1100 in Dinan, Ille-Et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France - died in 1150 in Burton, Northamptonshire, England)

              iii.  Josce De DINAN Sir was born about 1106 in Dinan, Ille-Et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France 389,390,461 and died in 1167 389,390,461,682 about age 61.

               iv.  William DINHAM was born about 1094 in <, Dinan, Côtes-Du-Nord, France>.389,390

                v.  Rolland DINHAM was born about 1096 in <, Gains, Berkshire, England>.389,390


8044388429. Radegonde NERONDES 415 was born about 1069 in Nerondes, Cher, Berry/Centre, France 389,390,461,1681 and died in 1147 390,1681 about age 78.

Radegonde married Geoffrey DINHAM Knight 1679,1680 about 1087 in <, Hartland, Devon, England> 389,390.,461 Geoffrey was born about 1065 in Dinan, Ille-Et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France 389,390,461 and died in 1138 389,390 about age 73.

8044388430. Stephen Count Of BRITTANY Baron Of Richmond,415,1682,1683,1684 son of Eudes Count Of Penthievre & BRITTANY and Agnes Canhiart Of CORNOUAILLE, was born in 1065 in Penthievre, Morbihan, Bretagne, France and died before 21 April 1136 in St Marys, York, Yorkshire, England 1684,1685. Another name for Stephen was Etienne De PENTHIEVRE.

General Notes: Founder (1110) Augustinian Abbey of St. Croix at Guincamp, Brittany, France.
Founder Cistercian Abbey of Begard, Brittany, France.
Held Honour of Richmond in England.

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STEPHEN, a count of Brittany, youngest son of Eudon,[a] succeeded his eldest brother, Geoffrey Boterel I, or Geoffrey's son Conan in the Breton lands, and his brother Alan the Black in the honor of Richmond in England, thus uniting all the possessions of the family, but he appears to have been out of possession of the honor of Richmond for a time during the reign of William II. In March 1101, he was a surety for Henry I for the observance of an alliance with Robert, Count of Flanders, and on 3 September 1101 at Windsor he witnessed charters of the King for Herbert, Bishop of Norwich, and for St. Peter's, Bath. On 30 October 1107 he executed at Lamballe a charter for the abbey of SS. Sergius and Bacchus at Angers, and in 1123 at Guingamp one for the abbey of St. Melaine at Rennes. He was a benefactor of the abbey of St. Mary, York, and in the period 1125-35 confirmed to that house gifts of churches, tithes and lands in Yorkshire, Lincolnshire, Cambridgeshire, and Norfolk, which formed part of the honor of Richmond. About the year 1110 he and his, wife founded the Augustinian abbey of Ste. Croix at Guingamp, and In 1130 he founded the Cistercian abbey of Bégard.

He married Hawise, whose parentage is unknown (e). He died 21 April, probably in 1135 or I 136. His tomb was in the quire of St. Mary's, York. [Complete Peerage X:786-7, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

[a] The filiation of Stephen has been a matter of dispute since the lives of him and his father cover about 135 years, and those of the two and Stephen's youngest son, Count Henry, about 180. The descent, however, is beyond doubt, since in a charter for St. Edmund's he describes himself as "Stephanus comes Britanniae Eudonis comitis filius" and refers to his brother Alan the Red and to his sons Geoffrey, Alan and Henry, and this is borne out by other charters, in particular that of Duke Conan. There is no express evidence that Stephen was the son of Eudon's wife Orguen, and he may have been the issue of a second marriage.

(e) She was living in 1135, when, as "comitissa Hadewisa" she witnessed her husband's charter for St. Edmunds. In the first edition of the present work it is stated that she was Countess of Guingamp and that Stephen became Count of Guingamp in her right. For this there seems to be insufficient foundation: Guingamp in the diocese of Treguier would be a part of the lands of Count Eudon.

Stephen married Hawise de SOURDEVAL Countess of Guingamp 1686,1687 on 24 April 1087 in Chateaudun, Eure-Et-Loire, France. Hawise was born in 1066 in Guingamp, Cotes-Du-Nord, Bretagne, France, died on 14 October 1153 in Richmond, Yorkshire, England 1688 at age 87, and was buried on 17 October 1153 in Killburn Abbey Cemetery, London, Middlesex, England. Other names for Hawise were Hawise de GUINCAMP, and Havoise De GUINGAMP.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Matilda (Maud) De BRITTANY was born in 1090 in Brittany, France.

               ii.  Alan "the Black" Duke of BRITTANY 1st Earl Of Richmond was born before 1100 in York, Yorkshire, England 505,1689 and died on 15 September 1146 in Begard, Bretagne, France 505,1685,1689. Another name for Alan was Alan de BRETAGNE 1st Earl of Richmond.

              iii.  Theophania De PENTHIEVRE was born about 1104 in Penthievre, Morbihan, Bretagne, France.

4022194215      iv.  Agnorie Of BRITTANY (born about 1105 in Penthievre, Morbihan, Bretagne, France)

                v.  Olive Of BRITTANY was born about 1110 in Penthievre, Morbihan, Bretagne, France and died before 1187. Another name for Olive was Olive De PENTHIEVRE.


8044388431. Hawise de SOURDEVAL Countess of Guingamp 415,1686,1687 was born in 1066 in Guingamp, Cotes-Du-Nord, Bretagne, France, died on 14 October 1153 in Richmond, Yorkshire, England 1688 at age 87, and was buried on 17 October 1153 in Killburn Abbey Cemetery, London, Middlesex, England. Other names for Hawise were Hawise de GUINCAMP, and Havoise De GUINGAMP.

General Notes:
He [Stephen, Count of Brittany] married Hawise, whose parentage is unknown (e). He died 21 April, probably in 1135 or I 136. His tomb was in the quire of St. Mary's, York. [Complete Peerage X:786-7, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

(e) She was living in 1135, when, as "comitissa Hadewisa" she witnessed her husband's charter for St. Edmunds. In the first edition of the present work it is stated that she was Countess of Guingamp and that Stephen became Count of Guingamp in her right. For this there seems to be insufficient foundation: Guingamp in the diocese of Treguier would be a part of the lands of Count Eudon.

Hawise married Stephen Count Of BRITTANY Baron Of Richmond 1682,1683,1684 on 24 April 1087 in Chateaudun, Eure-Et-Loire, France. Stephen was born in 1065 in Penthievre, Morbihan, Bretagne, France and died before 21 April 1136 in St Marys, York, Yorkshire, England 1684,1685. Another name for Stephen was Etienne De PENTHIEVRE.


8044388456. Ranulph Le MESCHIN 1st Earl Of Chester,415,902,1690,1691 son of Ranulph Le MESCHIN Viscount Of Bayeux and Margaret D' AVRANCHES Heiress Of Chester, was born about 1070 in Briquessard, Calvados, Normandy, France, died from January 1128 to 1129 in Chester, Cheshire, England 1691,1692 about age 58, and was buried in St Werburgh, Chester, Cheshire, England. Another name for Ranulph was 04th\1St Earl Of CHESTER Ranulph Le Meschin.

General Notes:
Ranulph III le Meschin, de Briquessart, d. c 1129, buried St Werburg's, Chester, lord of Cumberland, vicomte of Bayeux in Normandy, Earl of Chester in 1120, following the death of his first cousin Hugh d'Avranches, Earl of Chester; in 1124 commander of the Royal Forces in Normandy; m. probably c 1098 Lucy, living 1130, widow susscessively, of Ives Taillebois and Roger Fitz Gerold. [Ancestral Roots]

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EARLDOM OF CHESTER (IV, 1)

RANULPH LE MESCHIN (a), styled, also, "DE BRIQUESSART," VICOMTE DE BAYEUX in Normandy, son and heir of Ranulph, VICOMTE DE BAYEUX, by Margaret, sister of Hugh (D'AVRANCHES), EARL OF CHESTER, being thus 1st cousin and heir to the last Earl (whom he succeeded as VICOMTE D'AVRANCHES) &C.) in Normandy), obtained, after the Earl's death in 1120, the grant of the county palatine of Chester becoming thereby EARL OF CHESTER. He appears thereupon to have surrendered the Lordship of the great district of Cumberland, which he had acquired, shortly before, from Henry I. In 1124 he was Commander of the Royal forces in Normandy. He married Lucy, widow of Roger FITZ-GEROLD (by whom she was mother of William de Roumare, afterwards Earl of Lincoln). He died 17 or 27 January 1128/9, and was buried at St. Werburg's, Chester. The Countess Lucy confirmed, as his widow, the grant of the Manor of Spalding to the monks of that place (f). [Complete Peerage III:166, XIV:170, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

(a) ie. "The young" from the Latin "Mischinus"; French "Meschin" (Le Jeune). "Apud Francos mediae aetatis scriptores sumitur vox "Meschin" pro adolescente et juvenculo." Ducange.

(f) She paid 500 marks to King Henry in 1130 for license to remain unmarried for 5 years.

Note: The name should be "le" instead of "de" Meschin because "de" implies a place that the person was from, which is not the case here.

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Ranulf or Randle de Meschines, surnamed de Bricasard, Viscount Bayeux, in Normandy, (son of Ralph de Meschines, by Maud, his wife, co-heir of her brother, Hugh Lupus, the celebrated Earl of Chester), was given by King Henry I the Earldom of Chester, at the decease of his 1st cousin, Richard de Abrincis, 2nd Earl of Chester, of that family, without issue. By some historians, this nobleman is styled Earl of Carlisle, from residing in that city; and they further state that he came over in the train of the Conqueror, assisted in the subjugation of England, and shared, of course, in the spoil of conquest. He was lord of Cumberland and Carlisle, by descent from his father, but having enfeoffed his two brothers, William, of Coupland, and Geffrey, of Gillesland, in a large portion thereof, he exchanged the Earldom of Cumberland for that of Chester, on condition that those whom he had settled there should hold their lands of the king, in capite. His lordship m. Lucia, widow of Roger de Romara, Earl of Lincoln, and dau. of Algar, the Saxon, Earl of Mercia, and had issue, Ranulph, his successor; William, styled Earl of Cambridge, but of his issue nothing in known; Adeliza, m. to Richard Fitz-Gilbert, ancestor of the old Earls of Clare; and Agnes, m. to Robert de Grentemaisnil. The earl d. in 1128 and was s. by his elder son, Ranulph de Meschines. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant and Extinct Peerages,. Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 365, Meschines, Earls of Chester]

Ranulph married Lucy (Lucia) Of MERCIA 1022,1691,1692 about 1098 in 3rd Husband.1692 Lucy was born about 1070 in Crowland & Spalding, Lincolnshire, England 1270 and died in 1141 1270 about age 71.

Children from this marriage were:

8044364117       i.  Adeliz (Alice) Le MESCHIN (born about 1100 in Chester, Cheshire, England - died after 1142)

4022194228      ii.  Ranulph De GERNON 2nd Earl Of Chester (born about 1100 in Guernon Castle, Normandy, France - died on 16 December 1153 in Chester, Cheshire, England (Poisoned))

              iii.  William De ST. PIERRE was born about 1103 in St Pierre & Runstone, Chepstow, Monmouthshire, Wales.


8044388457. Lucy (Lucia) Of MERCIA,415,1022,1691,1692 daughter of Turold Sheriff Of LINCOLN and Alvarissa MALET, was born about 1070 in Crowland & Spalding, Lincolnshire, England 1270 and died in 1141 1270 about age 71.

General Notes: Lucy, living 1130, widow susscessively, of Ives Taillebois and Roger Fitz Gerold; m. probably c 1098 Ranulph III le Meschin. [Ancestral Roots]

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He [Ranulph le Meschin] married Lucy, widow of Roger FITZ-GEROLD (by whom she was mother of William de Roumare, afterwards Earl of Lincoln). He died 17 or 27 January 1128/9, and was buried at St. Werburg's, Chester. The Countess Lucy confirmed, as his widow, the grant of the Manor of Spalding to the monks of that place (f). [Complete Peerage III:166, XIV:170, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

(f) She paid 500 marks to King Henry in 1130 for license to remain unmarried for 5 years.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------
The following copied from www.linacre.ox.ac.uk/research/prosop/PRSPN2.stm,
gives the latest research on the ancestry of Lucy:
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Antecessor Noster:
The Parentage of Countess Lucy Made Plain

A lot of ink has flowed on the subject, but there can be no doubt that the 'mysterious' Countess Lucy of Chester was William Malet's thrice-married granddaughter, the daughter of Robert Malet's sister and Turold the Sheriff of Lincoln (dead by 1079). The suggestion was first made by R. Kirk in 1888. As N. Sumner has more recently observed: 'This account has the merit of explaining why the lordship of Spalding and other places in Lincolnshire were held after Ivo's death not by Beatrice, his direct heir and the daughter of his marriage to Lucy, but by the later husbands of Lucy, Roger fitz Gerold and Ranulph Meschines.' It is clear from her charters that Lucy was an heiress; as was to be expected, her estates passed to the sons of her second and third marriages. Kirk's work was based upon conjecture, and contained a number of errors. The question of Lucy's parentage has therefore remained open. Nevertheless, there is proof that Kirk was right.

A spurious charter of Crowland Abbey made Turold of Bucknall (the Sheriff) the founder of the priory of Spalding as a cell of Crowland. It also called Turold brother of Godiva countess of Mercia, but subsequently described Godiva's son Earl Algar as Turold's cognatus (cousin). A genealogia fundatoris of Coventry Abbey made Lucy a daughter of Earl Algar and sister and heiress of earls Edwin and Morcar. The Peterborough Chronicle and the Pseudo-Ingulf's Chronicle of Crowland both made Lucy the daughter of Algar and niece or great-niece of Turold. We know that William Malet was half-English, so these traditions probably boil down to a relationship between Countess Godiva and William's English mother.

In 1153 a charter [RRAN, III, 180] of the future Henry II for Lucy's son Ranulf II of Chester referred to her uncles Robert Malet and Alan of Lincoln. Alan of Lincoln was the successor, and almost certainly the son, of Domesday's Alfred of Lincoln. Chronologically, it is most unlikely that Alan was Lucy's uncle. It was probably another of Alfred's sons whom Domesday described as Alfred nepos [nephew or grandson] of Turold, then holding a fee which was certainly thereafter held with the rest of the senior Alfred's fee by his heir Alan. Domesday provides a further indication that Alfred senior married another of William Malet's daughters when it names a William as Alfred's predecessor in two of his manors. Other parts of each of these manors (Linwood and Rothwell) were held in 1086 by Durand Malet, who was probably William's son. It seems that Henry's charter can be explained by seeing a scribe, perhaps in search of rhetorical balance, commit the error of ascribing two uncles to Lucy, instead of a niece (Lucy) and a nephew (Alan of Lincoln) to Robert Malet, who was uncle to both.

Turold is evidenced in Domesday Book as a benefactor of Crowland Abbey, to which he gave a parcel of land at Bucknall. The abbey also held land at Spalding that had probably been granted to it by Earl Algar and there is evidence to suggest that Turold the Sheriff gave further land there to the abbey of St Nicholas, Angers, before 1079. Lucy and her first husband Ivo Taillebois subsequently founded, or perhaps re-founded, a priory at Spalding subject to St Nicholas, Angers. A revealing phrase from the Register of Spalding Priory reads: 'mortuo quia dicto Thoraldo relicta sibi herede Lucia predicta' [at his death Turold left an heir, the aforesaid Lucy]. The word heres, 'heir', was often used of the child who was to inherit his/her father's property. Lucy later confirmed the gifts of all three of her husbands: 'pro redempcione anime patris mei et matris mee et dominorum meorum et parentum meorum' [for the souls of my father and mother, my husbands and my (other) relatives]. The association of the priory with such a small group of people and the description of Lucy as heres of Turold strongly hint at Lucy's parentage. But we can go further still.

In their initial benefaction Ivo and Lucy referred to 'antecessorum suorum Turoldi scilicet uxorisque eius regine' [our 'ancestors' Turold and his wife]. The reference to Turold's wife indicates that some part of his landholding had come to him through his wife, something also indicated by the occurrence of William Malet amongst those who had held the Domesday lands of Lucy's first husband Ivo Taillebois before him. The apparently vague Latin words antecessor and predecessor can both be used to mean something like 'predecessor'. Each of them conveys a range of very precise meanings in different circumstances. The description of Turold and his wife as antecessores of Ivo and Lucy may be compared to the usage in a charter in the cartulary of Mont-Saint-Michel by which the Angevins Hugh Chalibot and his wife confirmed the grants of her father, who was described as antecessor noster. Other examples of this phrase show clearly that it was used by a married man to describe the parent from whom his wife had inherited the property she brought to the marriage. Acting on her own account (normally after her husband's death), the heiress will often describe herself as the daughter of the parent her husband described as antecessor noster. A rare use of the phrase was to indicate the couple's immediate predecessor, not her father but her brother. In Lucy and Ivo's case the plurality of their antecessores, Turold and his wife, puts the matter beyond doubt. Lucy's parents were indeed Turold the Sheriff and a daughter of William Malet.

K. S. B. Keats-Rohan
Linacre College
Oxford

Noted events in her life were:

• Alt. Death: Alt. Death, After 1130. 1692

Lucy married Ives (Ivo) De TAILLEBOIS 1st Baron Of Kendal 1022,1694,1695 after 1086 in 1st Husband 2ND Wife.1693 Ives was born about 1036 in Cristot, Calvados, Normandy, France 1696 and died in 1094 in Kendal, Cambria, England 1697 about age 58. Another name for Ives was Ivo TAILBOYS.

Lucy next married Roger Fitzgerold Seigneur De ROUMARE 1691,1692 after 1094 in 2ND Husband.1693 Roger was born about 1050 in Roumare, Seine Inferieure, Normandy, France and died before 15 July 1098 in Lincoln, Lincolnshire, England 1698. Another name for Roger was Roger FITZGEROLD Seigneur De \Roumare\.

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  William De ROUMARE Earl Lincoln & Cambridge was born about 1096 in Crowland, Peterborough, Lincolnshire, England 1699 and died before 1161 in Revesby, Horncastle, Lincolnshire, England (As Monk) 1699.

Lucy next married Ranulph Le MESCHIN 1st Earl Of Chester 902,1690,1691 about 1098 in 3rd Husband.1692 Ranulph was born about 1070 in Briquessard, Calvados, Normandy, France, died from January 1128 to 1129 in Chester, Cheshire, England 1691,1692 about age 58, and was buried in St Werburgh, Chester, Cheshire, England. Another name for Ranulph was 04th\1St Earl Of CHESTER Ranulph Le Meschin.

Lucy next married Ives (Ivo) De TAILLEBOIS 1st Baron Of Kendal 1022,1694,1695 after 1086 in 1st Husband 2ND Wife.1693 Ives was born about 1036 in Cristot, Calvados, Normandy, France 1696 and died in 1094 in Kendal, Cambria, England 1697 about age 58. Another name for Ives was Ivo TAILBOYS.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Christina De TAILLEBOIS was born after 1086 in Kendal, Cambria, England.

               ii.  Beatrice De TAILLEBOIS was born about 1090 in Taillebois, Orne, Normandy, France.


8044388458. Robert De CAEN 1st Earl Of Gloucester,415,670,1210,1372,1375,1664,1700,1701,1702,1703,1704,1705,1706,1707 son of Duke & Lion Of Justice Henry I "Beauclerc" King Of ENGLAND and Sibyl (Adela) (Lucy) CORBET Lady Of Alcester, was born about 1090 in Caen, Calvados, Normandy, France,389,390,1372,1375,1700,1704,1706,1707,1708,1709 died on 31 October 1147 in Bristol, Gloucestershire, England 389,390,1372,1375,1707,1710,1711,1712 about age 57, and was buried in Acceded: Aug 1122. Interred: St. James Priory, Bristol..389,390,1375,1702,1713 The cause of his death was Fever. Another name for Robert was 1st Earl Of GLOUCESTER Robert De Caen.

General Notes:
[From Burke's Peerage-see source for details]
An undoubted Earl of Gloucester, perhaps the first authentic one, at any rate after the Conquest, is Robert FitzHamon's son-in-law, another Robert, who was an illegitimate son of Henry I and was so created 1122. The Earldom passed to his eldest son, William FitzRobert, and from him to John, later King John and husband from 1189 to 1199 (when he divorced her) of Isabel, the youngest of William FitzRobert's three daughters. On John's coming to the throne the title did not merge in the Crown for it was not his in his own right but in right of his wife.

Robert was born about 1090, probably in Caen, Normandy (hence he was known as 'Robert of Caen'). His mother was probably an unknown woman of Caen and not Sibyl Corbet, as is stated by CP and others. He was acknowledged by his father King Henry I from his birth, and was raised at court from the time of his father's accession to the throne and educated under his direct supervision. Robert had a reputation for learning and literary appreciation, rare attributes at this time, which were undoubedly fostered by his scholarly father. By the time he was in his early twenties he was one of his father's leading military captains and advisers.

In 1107 he received from Henry the hand of a wealthy heiress, Mabel of Gloucester, daughter of Robert FitzHamon, who brought with her the barony of Gloucester and lordship of Glamorgan. They had a mansion at Tewkesbury.

Robert fought at the Battle of Bremule in 1119, where Henry defeated King Louis VI of France. In 1122, after the death of his legitimate half-brothers, the earldom of Gloucester was created for his benefit.

In 1123, he led a force to assist in the capture of the castle of Brionne, which was held by rebel Norman barons. In 1126 he had custody of his uncle, the imprisoned rebel, Robert, Duke of Normandy.

In 1127 he did homage to his half-sister the Empress Matilda, recognizing her as their father?s successor to the throne. Henry looked to him to protect Matilda's interests after his death. Robert was with his father when he died in 1135, and it was Robert who made the funeral arrangements.

Robert was a significant figure in the struggle for succession between Stephen (his cousin) and Matilda. Robert and Stephen had been fierce rivals at the English court since 1127, and some barons encouraged Robert to claim the throne himself (after all, his grandfather William the Conqueror had also been illegitimate), but when Stephen was chosen as king, Robert eventually did conditional homage to him for his English lands.

In 1137 he accompanied King Stephen to Normandy, where Matilda was raising support, and a quarrel ensued between the men when Stephen tried to ambush Robert. Robert then threw his support behind Matilda, who was in Normandy, and obtained the surrender of Caen and Bayeux to her husband Geoffrey, Count of Anjou. In September 1139 Robert landed in England with Matilda and took her to Arundel Castle. He then made his way to Bristol Castle, which had remained loyal to him, and was later joined there by Matilda.

Robert became her commander-in-chief in the civil war which followed. Unlike most barons of the time, he fought his battles within the rules of warfare and was not unnecessarily violent or cruel, but was also regarded as brave and a good commander. He was also known for his respect for law and justice, and his integrity and chivalry. Between 1139 and 1141, he progressively took control of most of the south-west.

In early 1141, Robert obtained word that Stephen was besieging Lincoln Castle. Robert quickly moved there and forced battle by personally swimming across the River Trent and requiring his troops to follow. In the battle, many of Stephen's knights fled and Stephen was captured by Robert; he was imprisoned at Bristol in the care of Robert's wife Mabel.

Matilda went to London to be crowned, but she made herself unpopular with the Londoners and they were forced to flee. While beseiging Winchester, they themselves were surrounded. Robert engaged Stephen's queen's army for long enough to allow Matilda to escape, but he himself was captured and place in the custody of Stephen's queen at Rochester. Stephen and Robert were then returned to their respective camps in an even exchange, although Robert had wanted some of his supporters released to compensate for his lower status. The even exchange reflected Robert?s value to Matilda as her main supporter and battle leader.

In 1142 Matilda sent Robert to Anjou to attempt to convince her husband Geoffrey to come to her aid. Geoffrey declined to help until he had conquered Normandy, so Robert joined in his campaign. However, hearing that Matilda was besieged at Oxford, he hurried back to her assistance. He took Matilda and Geoffrey's son, nine year old Henry (the future King Henry II), with him. Despite some more victories, Matilda's support had gradually dwindled; Robert was unable to continue to press her cause, although he continued to support his nephew Henry. He did however retain control of most of the West Country, imposing law and order there. In 1144 one of Robert's sons, Philip, rebelled against his father in support of Stephen.

In 1147 thirteen year old Henry arrived in England with mercenary troops, meaning to conquer England. After a couple of weeks he turned up on Robert's doorstep in Bristol asking for money to pay the troops. Robert marched him straight to Wareham and put him on a ship, paying the captain to make sure he got back to his father in Normandy. Henry later regarded Robert as one of the formative influences on his life, the man who had made it possible for him to become king of England.
Later in 1147 Robert died of a rapid fever at Bristol, even though he was still very fit and able to lead an army himself. After his death Matilda's cause collapsed completely, a measure of his indispensability to her.

Robert was a patron of scholars, including some of the best-known medieval chroniclers such as William of Malmesbury and Geoffrey of Monmouth, and was known for his own cleverness and literary ability. One of his enemies, Baldwin fitz Gilbert, described him in terms which suggested he was all bark and no bite - a man who threatened much but did little, eloquent but lazy. His record as a soldier would tend to refute this last point, at the very least. He was also a generous benefactor of the Church, founding the Benedictine priory of St. James just outside Bristol and a Cistercian abbey at Margam, South Wales, and suppporting abbeys at Tewkesbury, Gloucester, and Neath. He was buried in a magnificent green jasper tomb at his foundation of St. James [CP queries the site of his burial, also claimed for Tewkesbury]. [Ref: Suzanne Doig <smd49@csc.canterbury.ac.nz> 14 Sep 1998 messaage to soc.genealogy.medieval]

Research note 1: mother Sibyl Corbet [Ref: Weir RoyalFam p48]
Research note 2: illegitimate son of Henry I, probably by Sibil, dau of Robert Fitz Corbet, burgess of Caen [Ref: Watney p404]
Research note 3: shown as son of Sibilla Corbet, but "There is no certain evidence to show that Sybilla really was Robert's mother, who may have been an unknown woman of Caen" [Ref: Weir RoyalFam p48]

Robert married Unknown MISTRESS in No Marriage. Unknown was born about 1092 in England.

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  Robert Castellan Of GLOUCESTER was born about 1120 in Bristol, Gloucestershire, England and died after 1160 1714.

Robert next married Mabel FITZHAMON 1370,1372,1375,1664,1666,1707,1710,1716 about 1115 in Gloucestershire, England 389,390,1372,1373,1375,1664,1666,1707,1713.,1715 Mabel was born about 1094 in Tewkesbury, Gloucestershire, England 1375 and died in 1157 in Bristol, Gloucestershire, England 1270,1372,1373,1375,1707 about age 63. Other names for Mabel were Maud, and Sibyl.

Marriage Notes:
Reference Number:38764

Noted events in their marriage were:

• Alt. Marriage: Alt. Marriage, Abt 1120. 1270

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  William FITZROBERT 2nd Earl Of Gloucester was born on 23 November 1116 in Tewkesbury, Gloucestershire, England and died on 23 November 1183 in Cardiff Castle, Glamorganshire, Wales 1710 at age 67. Another name for William was 2nd Earl Of GLOUCESTER William Fitzrobert.

4022194229      ii.  Maud Fitzrobert De CAEN Countess Of Chester (born about 1117 in Gloucestershire, England. - died on 29 July 1189 in , Chester, Cheshire, England)

              iii.  Christiana OF GLOUCESTER.

8044362315      iv.  Christian Of GLOUCESTER (born about 1118 in Bristol, Gloucestershire, England)

                v.  William Fitzrobert EARL OF GLOUCESTER was born on 23 November 1116 of Gloucestershire, England,1375 died on 23 November 1183 1375,1713 at age 67, and was buried in 2ND Earl..1375,1713


8044388459. Mabel FITZHAMON,415,1370,1372,1375,1664,1666,1707,1710,1716 daughter of Robert FITZHAMON Lord Of Thoringni & Tewkesbury and Sibyl De MONTGOMERIE, was born about 1094 in Tewkesbury, Gloucestershire, England 1375 and died in 1157 in Bristol, Gloucestershire, England 1270,1372,1373,1375,1707 about age 63. Other names for Mabel were Maud, and Sibyl.

General Notes:
Mabel, daughter and heir of Robert FITZ-HAMOND, lord of Tewkesbury. [Complete Peerage]

Mabel married Robert De CAEN 1st Earl Of Gloucester 1210,1372,1375,1664,1700,1701,1702,1703,1704,1705,1706,1707 about 1115 in Gloucestershire, England 389,390,1372,1373,1375,1664,1666,1707,1713.,1715 Robert was born about 1090 in Caen, Calvados, Normandy, France,389,390,1372,1375,1700,1704,1706,1707,1708,1709 died on 31 October 1147 in Bristol, Gloucestershire, England 389,390,1372,1375,1707,1710,1711,1712 about age 57, and was buried in Acceded: Aug 1122. Interred: St. James Priory, Bristol..389,390,1375,1702,1713 The cause of his death was Fever. Another name for Robert was 1st Earl Of GLOUCESTER Robert De Caen.

8044388460. Amaury IV Seigneur De MONTFORT Count Evreux,415,1379,1382,1717,1718 son of Simon I Seigneur De MONTFORT and Agnes D' EVREUX, was born about 1070 in Montfort-L'amaury, Yvelines, Ile-DE-France, France, died in 1137 in Evreux, Eure, Normandy, France 1379,1382 about age 67, and was buried in Haute-Bruyere Abbey Near Montfort-L'amaury, France.

General Notes:
THE ANCESTORS OF SIMON DE MONTFORT EARL OF LEICESTER (VI)

Amauri de Montfort, brother and heir [of Simon] (a). In 1098 he aided William II against his brother's castles of Montfort and Epernon. After the death of William de Breteuil in 1103, Amauri supported the claim of William's Burgundian nephew, Renaud de Grancei, to succeed to his estates against that of his Breton nephew, William de Gael. On the death sp. in 1118 of his maternal uncle, William, Count of Evreux, Amauri claimed the comte, and when Henry I denied him the inheritance led a widespread revolt, and obtained possession of Evreux. In the following year Henry besieged Evreux, but his nephew Theobald, Count of Champagne, reconciled him and Amauri, who surrendered the castle to the King and thereupon received his uncle's comte. In 1123 Amauri joined the revolt of Waleran, Count of Meulan--subsequently husband of his daughter Agnes--against Henry. Next year Amauri fought at Bourghteroulde, and was captured when fleeing from the field by William de Grandcourt, who, rather than hand over his prisoner to captivity, went into exile with him, but before the end of the year Amauri made his peace with the King, and seems to have maintained friendly relations with him during the rest of the reign.

He m. 1stly, Richeude, daughter of Baldwin, Count of Hainault, from whom he separated. He m. 2ndly Agnes, niece of Stephen de Garlande, with whom he received Rochefort and Gournay-sur-Marne; her parentage is uncertain. She was probably the mother of his eldest son, Amauri, and certainly of his second son Simon, and of a daughter, Agnes (e). He d. 18 or 19 Apr, year unkown, and was buried at the Abbey of Haute-Bruyere, which he had founded. [Complete Peerage VII:Appendix D:713-4]

(a) Said by both Orderic and Robert de Torigni to be the son of Simon by Agnes, sister of William Count of Evreux.

(e) She, who had Gournay m. Waleran, Count of Meulan.

Amaury married Richeude (Richilde) De HAINAULT,1718 daughter of Baudouin II Count Of HAINAULT and Ida De LOUVAIN, in 1st Wife - Separated (Consanguinity?).1718 Richeude was born about 1095 in Hainault, Belgium.

Amaury next married Agnes De GARLANDE Heir Of Rochefort & Gournay 1379,1382,1717,1718 in 1120 in 2ND Wife 1379,1718.,1719 Agnes was born about 1095 in Rochefort-En-Yevlines, Yvelines, Ile-DE-France, France and died in 1143 in Gournay-Sur-Marne, Seine-Et-Marne, Ile-DE-France, France 1719 about age 48.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Amauri V De MONTFORT Comte D'evreux was born about 1121 in Montfort-L'amaury, Yvelines, Ile-DE-France, France and died in 1140 in Evreux, Eure, Normandy, France (Dsp) 1720 about age 19.

4022194230      ii.  Simon III Chauve De MONTFORT Count D'evreux (born about 1123 in Montfort-L'amaury, Yvelines, Ile-DE-France, France - died on 13 March 1181 in Evreux, Eure, Normandy, France)

              iii.  Agnes De MONTFORT Heiress Of Gournay was born about 1124 in Montfort-L'amaury, Yvelines, Ile-DE-France, France and died on 15 December 1181 in Gournay-Sur-Marne, Seine-Et-Marne, Ile-DE-France, France 1717,1721 about age 57.


8044388461. Agnes De GARLANDE Heir Of Rochefort & Gournay,415,1379,1382,1717,1718 daughter of Anselm De GARLANDE De Rochefort and Beatrix De MONTLHERY, was born about 1095 in Rochefort-En-Yevlines, Yvelines, Ile-DE-France, France and died in 1143 in Gournay-Sur-Marne, Seine-Et-Marne, Ile-DE-France, France 1719 about age 48.

General Notes: He [Amauri de Montfort] m. 2ndly Agnes, niece of Stephen de Garlande, with whom he received Rochefort and Gournay-sur-Marne; her parentage is uncertain. She was probably the mother of his eldest son, Amauri, and certainly of his second son Simon, and of a daughter, Agnes. He d. 18 or 19 Apr, year unkown, and was buried at the Abbey of Haute-Bruyere, which he had founded. [Complete Peerage VII:Appendix D:713-4]

Agnes married Amaury IV Seigneur De MONTFORT Count Evreux 1379,1382,1717,1718 in 1120 in 2ND Wife 1379,1718.,1719 Amaury was born about 1070 in Montfort-L'amaury, Yvelines, Ile-DE-France, France, died in 1137 in Evreux, Eure, Normandy, France 1379,1382 about age 67, and was buried in Haute-Bruyere Abbey Near Montfort-L'amaury, France.

8044388464. Andomar De MONTE ALTO 415 was born in 1060 in Tuscany, Italy. Another name for Andomar was Andomar De MONTALT.

Andomar married.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194232       i.  Robert De MOHAUT (born about 1087 in Hawarden, Flintshire, England - died before 1141 in Castle Montalt, Hawarden, Flintshire, England)


8044388466. Robert De DELAVAL 415 was born in 1065 in Normandy, France.

Robert married.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194233       i.  Emma De DELAVAL (born about 1096 in England)


8044388468. William I FITZNEEL Of Halton,Constable Cheshire,415 son of Neel (Nigel) Constable Of CHESTER and Unknown, was born in 1058 in Cotentin/Manche, Normandy, France and died in 1134 in Halton Castle, Runcorn, Cheshire, England at age 76. Another name for William was William FITZNIGEL Lord Of Halton.

William married Miss De WIDNESS. Miss was born in 1062 in Halton, Runcorn, Cheshire, England.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Albreda De ST. SAUVEUR was born about 1080 in Halton Castle, Runcorn, Cheshire, England.

4022194234      ii.  William II FITZNEEL Lord Of Holton & Widnor (born about 1085 in Halton Castle, Runcorn, Cheshire, England - died before 1139 in (Dspm))

              iii.  Matilda FITZNEEL was born about 1088 in Halton Castle, Runcorn, Cheshire, England.

               iv.  Agnes FITZNEEL was born about 1094 in Halton Castle, Runcorn, Cheshire, England and died in 1166 in Alnwick Castle, Northumberland, England about age 72. Another name for Agnes was Agnes FITZNIGEL.


8044388469. Miss De WIDNESS,415 daughter of Yarfrid Lord Of WIDNESS and Unknown, was born in 1062 in Halton, Runcorn, Cheshire, England.

Miss married William I FITZNEEL Of Halton,Constable Cheshire. William was born in 1058 in Cotentin/Manche, Normandy, France and died in 1134 in Halton Castle, Runcorn, Cheshire, England at age 76. Another name for William was William FITZNIGEL Lord Of Halton.

8044388470. Gilbert De GAND Lord Of Folkingham,415,880,905,1722 son of Ralph (Raoul) De GAND Seigneur D'alost and Gisele Of LUXEMBOURG, was born about 1048 in Ghent, Flanders Now Belgium and died about 1095 in Folkingham, Bourne, Lincolnshire, England 905,1722 about age 47. Another name for Gilbert was Gilbert De GHENT.

General Notes: Gilbert de Gant, son of Baldwin, Earl of Flanders, by Maud, sister of William the Conqueror, accompanied his uncle into England and, participating in the triumph of Hastings, obtained a grant of the lands of a Danish proprietor named Tour, with numerous other lordships. This Gilbert happened to be at York, anno 1069, and had a narrow escape when the Danes in great force, on behalf of Edgar Etheling, entered the mouth of the Humber and, marching upon that city, committed lamentable destruction by fire and sword, there being more than 3,000 Normans slain. Like most of the great lords of his time, Gilbert de Gant disgorged to the church a part of the spoil which he had seized, and amongst other acts of piety restored Bardney Abbey, co. Lincoln, which had been utterly destroyed many years before by the Pagan Danes, Inquar and Hubba. He m, Alice, dau. of Hugh de Montfort, and had issue, Hugh, who assumed the name Montfort; Walter, his successor; Robert, Lord Chancellor of England, anno 1153; and Emma, m. to Alan, Lord Percy. This great feudal chief d. in the reign of William Rufus. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited, and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 227, Gant, Earls of Lincoln]

Note: Maud was not a sister, but wife of William the Conqueror; Baldwin VI was her brother, while Baldwin V was her father. The two Baldwins were Counts not Earls of Flanders. Earl is an English term not used on the continent. I do not agree with the above parentage for Gilbert in any case.

------------------------------

Emma, daughter of Gilbert de Gant (himself son of Baldwin, Count of Flanders, and nephew of Queen Matilda or Maud, wife of William I The Conqueror) by Gilbert's wife Alice, herself daughter of Hugh de Montfort. [Burke's Peerage]

Note: I do not agree with the above parentage for Gilbert.

-------------------------------

More Important NOTE: Ancestral Roots, in a revised lineage for the 7th edition, states that Gilbert's parents are Gisele (or Gisla) of Luxembourg and Rudolph I of Aalst (or Alost) (also called Ralph de Gand or Ghent). Whoever AR had as parents of Gilbert in prior editions had been removed based on new evidence. I will go with AR.

Gilbert de Gant (Gaunt or Ghent), d. c 1095, buried Bardney, probably arrived in England in 1066; was a commander in York 1068, and was taken prisoner there by the Danes in 1069. He was a tenant-in-chief and one of the largest landholders in co. Lincoln in 1086. Folkingham being the head of his barony; m. Alice de Montfort, daughter of Count Hugh de Montfort-sur-Risle. [Ancestral Roots]

--------------------------------

Curt Hofemann referrred me to this site (http://www.rootsweb.com/~medieval/gant.htm), which has information from SGM:

GEN-MEDIEVAL/soc.genealogy.medieval
Who were the parents
of Gilbert de Gant?
compiled by Raymond W. Phair

[This article has been slightly modified from a posting which was made to GEN-MEDIEVAL / soc.genealogy.medieval on 12 July 1999.]

His parents very probably were Ralph, lord of Alost (Aalst in Flemish), and Gisele, daughter of Frederick count of Luxembourg.

Sherman has given the most recent detailed account which is the basis for what is summarized below, unless another reference is stated. All the records cited by Sherman have been published. He emphasized the evidence was very strong, but not conclusive.

Gilbert I de Gant (d. ca.1095) was in England by 1069 when he and William Malet unsuccessfully defended York castle against the Danish invasion and local rebellion [Sherman; EYC 2:432; CP 6:672n; P. Dalton, Conquest, anarchy and lordship, 1994, p.11].

A 1075 transaction in the Watten abbey chronicle was witnessed by Gilbert, described as having come from England and as the brother of Baldwin of Ghent. In 1052 Ralph of Ghent and his son Baldwin attested a charter of the abbey of St. Peter of Mount Blandin, Ghent (Gand, Gent), presumably the same Baldwin. Their records are the main source of information for this family.

Ralph the Advocate was one of the advocates of St. Peter from as early as 1026 to sometime before 1058. He was succeeded by Baldwin the Advocate. They are believed to be Gilbert's father and brother mentioned in the previous paragraph. It is from their service as advocates that some members of their family were called 'de Gandavo' (of Ghent). Sherman proposed the castellans of Ghent were the other family of advocates of St. Peter. He also noted that while Gilbert's family were the lords of what was probably the county of Alost, they were never titled counts in any records.

In a 1094 gift to the abbey of Bergues St. Winnoc, witnessed by Baldwin of Ghent (son of Gilbert's brother Baldwin who d. 1082), Ralph the Chamberlain identified himself as a son of Ralph of Alost and Gisele. He was a fellow witness with Gilbert to the 1075 transaction mentioned above. He may have been the Ralph son of Ralph in a 1056 charter of St. Peter, prior to his appointment as chamberlain. Alternatively, the 1056 Ralph son of Ralph might have been Gilbert's father, but he appeared to have been dead in that year, or someone unrelated.

The annals of St. Peter record about 1042 a gift from Ralph of Ghent and his wife Gisele -- their earliest joint appearance. They had at least 3 sons: Baldwin (their heir), Ralph the Chamberlain, and Gilbert. It is thus extremely probable that she was the unidentified Gisele in 1056 and 1058 who gave land and a serf to the abbey for the souls of her father, her husband Ralph, and her sons. Both of her gifts were witnessed by Baldwin, Ralph, and Gilbert, described as her sons. Although they were not called 'of Alost' or 'of Ghent', it would be an extraordinary coincidence if these were not the members of that family.

Rubincam, using a source not used by Sherman (and published after Vanderkindere), found that in 1036 Ralph of Ghent and his wife Gisele made a gift to the abbey. Neither Rubincam nor Sherman provided sufficient details to determine if this was the gift Sherman reported occurred in 1042. Rubincam also found, but didn't cite a source, that Ralph in 1056 witnessed a gift by count Baldwin to the abbey of St. Omer. Rubincam believed he was Gilbert's father, but he was probably the brother.

Assuming this was Gilbert de Gant in the 1056 gift and that he was about 16 or older, then he was born about 1040 or earlier. His brother Baldwin was probably the Baldwin of Ghent who witnessed a St. Peter charter in 1046, suggesting he was born about 1030 or earlier.

Also, if that was a grant by Gilbert's mother, then his father Ralph had apparently died sometime between 1052 (his last occurrence) and 1056. His parentage is unknown, but it seems likely that he was a descendant of the Ralph the Advocate who appeared in the abbey's records in 994.

Vanderkindere (1:121) mentioned a Baldwin occured as advocate in 962 (not discussed by Sherman) who may thus be another ancestor of Ralph. Moriarty assumed Baldwin was the father of the earlier Ralph who was in turn the father of Ralph husband of Gisele. In view of the large gaps, however, there may have been additional generations.

Gilbert's mother was probably the Gisele who was a sister of Otgiva (Ogive), wife of Baldwin IV count of Flanders, and thus Gilbert was one of Charlemagne's descendants. The burials of both Otgiva (d. 21 Feb 1030) and Gisele (d. 21 May, year unknown) are mentioned in the annals of St. Peter, but it, unfortunately, did not name Gisele's husband.

Europaische Stammtafeln (ES), 6:128 (1978), identified Gisele as a daughter of count Frederick and wife of Ralph of Alost, but didn't show their children on that page. It also showed her sister Otgiva married about 1005 Baldwin IV. ES 2:5 (1984) had 1012 for Otgiva's marriage date, as did K.F. Werner's 'Die Nachkommen Karls des Grossen', in Karl der Grosse, ed. W. Braunfels, vol.4 (1967).

Sherman wondered if the erroneous ancestry for Gilbert given in Monasticon Anglicanum (5:491) may have arisen when the unknown author, writing after 1307, found in an unknown source that Gilbert was described as 'nepos' of William the Conqueror and assumed it to mean 'nephew', although in this case its less frequent meaning of 'kinsman' was intended. Gilbert was the first cousin once removed of William's wife, if the assumption about Gisele's identity is correct.

Gilbert's name appears to have come from his mother's family -- her older brother was Gilbert count of Luxembourg (1047-59), and she had a paternal uncle also named Gilbert. He had a son named Ralph and a grandson named Baldwin, while his brother Baldwin of Ghent named one of his sons Gilbert [CP 7:672; Sherman].

Sherman didn't mention if any tenants of Gilbert de Gant in England can be traced to Flanders. Gilbert did not seem to hold any land in Flanders.

The identification of Gilbert's father as Ralph of Alost first appeared in A. Duchesne, Histoire genealogique des maisons ... de Gand, ..., 1631. Among the many later writers who have given it were the following:

L.V.J.A. Vanderkindere, Histoire de la formation territoriale des principautes belges au moyen age, vol.1 (1899).
W. Farrer, Early Yorkshire Charters (EYC), 2:432 (1915).
Complete Peerage (CP), 7:672n (1929).
M. Rubincam, 'The true origin of the house of Gaunt', Genealogists' magazine, 9:1-7 (1940).
F.M. Stenton, Anglo-Saxon England, 1st ed., 1941, p.621; 3rd ed., 1971, p.629 (no source). D.C. Douglas, William the Conqueror, 1964, p.267, only cited Stenton for it.
G.A. Moriarty, 'The ancestry of Gilbert de Gant', The American Genealogist, 34:39-40 (1958).
R.M. Sherman, 'The continental origins of the Ghent family of Lincolnshire', Nottingham Medieval Studies, 22:23-35 (1978).

Sherman did not use Farrer, Rubincam, nor Moriarty. See his paper for references to additional works discussing this family.

Gilbert married Alice Countess De MONTFORT 880,905,1722 in 1071 in Folkingham, Bourne, Lincolnshire, England. Alice was born in 1050 in Montfort-Sur-Risle, Eure, Normandy, France.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Felia De GAND was born about 1070 in Folkingham, Bourne, Lincolnshire, England. Another name for Felia was Felia De GAUNT.

               ii.  Hugh De MONTFORT Sir was born about 1072 in Montfort-Sur-Risle, Eure, Normandy, France and died about 1124 in Folkingham, Warwickshire, England about age 52.

              iii.  Emma De GAND was born about 1075 in Folkingham, Bourne, Lincolnshire, England and died in 1135 about age 60.

               iv.  Walter De GAND Lord Of Folkingham was born about 1080 in Fordington, Lincolnshire, England and died in 1139 1723 about age 59. Other names for Walter were Walter De GAUNT Of Folkingham, and Walter De LINDSAY Sir.1724

                v.  Piers (Peter) De MONTFORT Of Beaudesert was born about 1085 in Beaudesert Castle, Warwickshire, England.

4022194235      vi.  Agnes De GAND (born about 1092 in Folkingham, Bourne, Lincolnshire, England)


8044388471. Alice Countess De MONTFORT,415,880,905,1722 daughter of Hugh II Count De MONTFORT and Alice De BEAUFFOU, was born in 1050 in Montfort-Sur-Risle, Eure, Normandy, France.

Alice married Gilbert De GAND Lord Of Folkingham 880,905,1722 in 1071 in Folkingham, Bourne, Lincolnshire, England. Gilbert was born about 1048 in Ghent, Flanders Now Belgium and died about 1095 in Folkingham, Bourne, Lincolnshire, England 905,1722 about age 47. Another name for Gilbert was Gilbert De GHENT.

8044388544. Maredudd Ap BLEDDYN,415,505,1034 son of Bleddyn "Sais" Ap CYNFYN Prince Of Powys and Haer Verch CYNILLIN, was born about 1047 in Monmouthshire, Wales 1034 and died about 1132 1034 about age 85.

Maredudd married Hunydd Verch EINUDD.1034 Hunydd was born about 1078 in Dyffryn Clwyd, Denbighshire, Wales.1034

Children from this marriage were:

4022194272       i.  Gruffudd Ap MAREDUDD (born about 1095 in Cyfeiliog, Montgomeryshire, Wales - died in 1128)

8044362320      ii.  Madog Ap MAREDUDD King Of Powys (born about 1097 in Powys, Wales - died in 1160 in Winchester, Herefordshire, England)

Maredudd next married Eva Verch BETRWS. Eva was born about 1050 in Wales.

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  Iorwerth "Goch" Ap MAREDUDD was born about 1080 in Wales.


8044388545. Hunydd Verch EINUDD,415,505,1034 daughter of Einudd Ap MORIEN and Efa Verch LLEWELYN, was born about 1078 in Dyffryn Clwyd, Denbighshire, Wales.1034

Hunydd married Maredudd Ap BLEDDYN.1034 Maredudd was born about 1047 in Monmouthshire, Wales 1034 and died about 1132 1034 about age 85.

8044388546. Gwrgeneu Ap HYWEL,505,1034 son of Hywel Ap Ieuaf and Unknown, was born in 1075 in Radnorshire, Wales.1034

Gwrgeneu married Margred Verch RHYS.1034 Margred was born in 1082 in Carmarthenshire, Wales.1034

The child from this marriage was:

4022194273       i.  Gwerful Verch GWRGENEU (born in 1100 in Radnorshire, Wales)


8044388547. Margred Verch RHYS,505,1034 daughter of Rhys Ap TEWDWR King Of Deheubarth and Gwladus Verch RHIWALLON, was born in 1082 in Carmarthenshire, Wales.1034

Margred married.

Margred married Gwrgeneu Ap HYWEL.1034 Gwrgeneu was born in 1075 in Radnorshire, Wales.1034

8044388548. Gruffudd Ap CYNAN King Of Gwynedd,415,505,1034,1388,1392 son of Cynan Ab IAGO Prince Of North Wales and Ragnaillt O'olaf Of DUBLIN, was born in 1055 in Dublin, Ireland,1034,1725 died in 1137 in Wales 1034,1388,1392 at age 82, and was buried in Bangor Cathedral, Bangor, Caernarvonshire, Wales.1034

Gruffudd married Angharat Verch OWAIN 1034,1725 about 1095.1725 Angharat was born about 1065 in Tegaingl, Flintshire, Wales 1034 and died in 1162 1034 about age 97.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Margred Verch GRUFFUDD was born about 1080 in Wales.

               ii.  Gwenllian Verch GRUFFUDD was born about 1086 in Caernarvonshire, Wales and died in 1136 in Maes Gwenllian, Outside Walls Of Kidwelly, Wales 1726 about age 50.

              iii.  Cadwaladr Ap GRUFFUDD Lord Of Anglesey was born about 1096 in Caernarvonshire, Wales,389,390,1034,1037 died from March 1171 to 1172 in Anglesey, Wales 389,390,1034,1037,1386 about age 75, and was buried in Bangor Cathedral, Is Gwyrfai, Caernarvon, Wales.389,390,1034,1037

8044362321      iv.  Susanna VERCH GRUFFYDD AP CYNAN (born about 1098 in Caernarvonshire, Wales)

4022194274       v.  Owain Gwynedd Ap GRUFFUDD King Of Gwynedd (born in 1137 in Aberffraw Castle, Angelesey, Wales - died in 1170 in Bangor Cathedral, Is Gwyrfai, Caernarvonshire, Wales)

Gruffudd next married Ferch Llychwy,1034 daughter of Llychwy and Unknown. Ferch was born about 1070 in Llanbeulan, Llechylched, Anglesey, Wales.1034

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  Yslani Ferch Gruffudd was born about 1104 in Caernarvonshire, Wales.1034


8044388549. Angharat Verch OWAIN,415,505,1034,1725 daughter of Owain Ap EDWIN and Morwyl Verch EDNYWAIN, was born about 1065 in Tegaingl, Flintshire, Wales 1034 and died in 1162 1034 about age 97.

Angharat married Gruffudd Ap CYNAN King Of Gwynedd 1034,1388,1392 about 1095.1725 Gruffudd was born in 1055 in Dublin, Ireland,1034,1725 died in 1137 in Wales 1034,1388,1392 at age 82, and was buried in Bangor Cathedral, Bangor, Caernarvonshire, Wales.1034

8044388550. Llywarch Ap TRAHAEARN,415,505,1034,1727 son of Trahaearn Ap CARADOG Prince Of North Wales and Nesta Verch GRUFFUDD, was born about 1070 in Arwystli, Powys, Wales 1034 and died about 1129 in Wales 1034,1727 about age 59.

Llywarch married Dyddgu Verch IORWERTH.1727 Dyddgu was born about 1060 in Buillth, Breconshire, Wales.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194275       i.  Gwladus Verch LLYWARCH (born about 1098 in Pembroke, Montgomershire, Wales - died before 1155)


8044388551. Dyddgu Verch IORWERTH,415,505,1727 daughter of Iorwerth Ap CADWGON and Gwenllian Verch ARON, was born about 1060 in Buillth, Breconshire, Wales.

Dyddgu married Llywarch Ap TRAHAEARN 1034.,1727 Llywarch was born about 1070 in Arwystli, Powys, Wales 1034 and died about 1129 in Wales 1034,1727 about age 59.

8044388552. Simon CORBET Lord Of Caus & Wattlesboro,415,505 son of William CORBET Lord Of Worthen & Wattlesboro and Unknown, was born about 1100 in Wattlesborough, Shrewsbury, Shropshire, England and died after 1155 in Caus Castle, Westbury, Shropshire, England.

Simon married.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194276       i.  Simon CORBET Lord Of Pontesbury (born about 1125 in Pontesbury, Atcham, Shropshire, England - died before 1165)

8044363792      ii.  Thomas "The Pilgrim" CORBET Viscount Of Pontesbury (born about 1149 in Pontesbury, , Shropshire, England)

              iii.  Thomas CORBET Lord Of Wattlesboro was born about 1135 in Wattlesboro, Shropshire, England.


8044388560. Roald (Roland) Le STRANGE Of Mileham 415,631,1039,1728 was born about 1096 in Mileham, Norfolk, England and died before 1158 in Hunstanton, Norfolk, England 760,1039,1728.

General Notes:
Roald 'Le Strange' or "Extraneus' may have been a Breton and was of a family that seems to have migrated from Brittany to England (hence his second name, whether in its French or Latin form). But it is less certain that his family were actually of Breton origin. He testified to a charter before 1122 and was a tenant of Alan fitz Fleald in Mileham, Norfolk; also held land in Hunstanton, Norfolk; married Maud, daughter of Ralph fitz Herlewin or Ralph de Hunstanton, and was in all probability dead by 1158, having had [John], with two other but not necessarily younger sons (Hamon, held lands in Cheswardine, Salopshire, dead by 1163/4; Guy, granted land in Alveley, Salop, Sheriff of Salop 1159-60, had at least two daus). [Burke's Peerage]

-------------------

ROALD LESTRANGE (Extraneus) with others of the tenants of Alan FitzFlaald in Mileham, Norfolk, witnessed, before 1122, a charter of his lord in favour of Castleacre Priory; he held in Hunstanton, where he made a grant of land which was later confirmed by John Lestrange IV; he further attested a grant by Robert son of Wimer to Castleacre Priory. He married Maud, daughter of Ralph, son of HERLEWIN, or DE HUNSTANTON, by Helewise, daughter of Hugh DE PLAIZ, of Bernham, Suffolk. He died before, and probably some time before, 1158. [Complete Peerage XII/1:347-8, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Roald married Maud De HUNSTANTON.1728 Maud was born about 1100 in Hunstanton, Norfolk, England.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194280       i.  John I Le STRANGE Lord Of Cheswardine & Ness (born about 1132 in Cheswardine, Market Drayton, Shropshire, England - died before 29 September 1178 in Ness, Ellesmere, Shropshire, England)

               ii.  Guy LE STRANGE Of Alveley, Sheriff Salopshire was born about 1134 of Shropshire, England and died by 1199 about age 65.


8044388561. Maud De HUNSTANTON 415,631,1728 was born about 1100 in Hunstanton, Norfolk, England.

General Notes:
He [Roald Lestrange] married Maud, daughter of Ralph, son of HERLEWIN, or DE HUNSTANTON, by Helewise, daughter of Hugh DE PLAIZ, of Bernham, Suffolk. He died before, and probably some time before, 1158. [Complete Peerage XII/1:347-8, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Maud married Roald (Roland) Le STRANGE Of Mileham 1039.,1728 Roald was born about 1096 in Mileham, Norfolk, England and died before 1158 in Hunstanton, Norfolk, England 760,1039,1728.

8044388572. Robert I Fitzharold De EWYAS,415,631,1729 son of Count Of Paris Hugh Magnus Capet Of Neustria, Duke Of The FRANKS Count Of Paris and Princess Of The Germans Hedwige Of SAXONY, was born about 1089 in Sudley Castle, Gloucestershire, England and died after 1147 in Ewyas Harold, Herefordshire, England 1389,1729.

General Notes: Lord of Ewyas Harold, Herefordshire.

Robert married Sybil 1389 about 1124. Sybil was born about 1101 of Sudley, Gloucestershire, England.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194286       i.  Robert II De EWYAS Baron Of Ewyas Harold (born about 1125 in Ewyas Harold, Herefordshire, England - died in 1198 in Ewyas Harold, Herefordshire, England)


8044388573. Sybil 415,631,1389 was born about 1101 of Sudley, Gloucestershire, England.

Sybil married Robert I Fitzharold De EWYAS 1729 about 1124. Robert was born about 1089 in Sudley Castle, Gloucestershire, England and died after 1147 in Ewyas Harold, Herefordshire, England 1389,1729.

8044388574. Godfrey SCUDAMORE 415,631 was born about 1116 in Upton Scudamore, Wiltshire, England and died in 1164 about age 48.

Godfrey married Matilda GIFFARD. Matilda was born about 1127 in Brimpsfield, Cirencester, Gloucestershire, England.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194287       i.  Petronilla (Pernel) SCUDAMORE (born about 1145 in Kentchurch, Hereford, Herefordshire, England - died after 28 October 1204)

               ii.  Elias SCUDAMORE Of Upton Scudamore was born about 1148 in Upton Scudamore, Wiltshire, England.


8044388575. Matilda GIFFARD,415,631 daughter of Elias II GIFFARD Lord Of Brimpsfield and Bertha (Berta) FITZPONCE, was born about 1127 in Brimpsfield, Cirencester, Gloucestershire, England.

Matilda married Godfrey SCUDAMORE. Godfrey was born about 1116 in Upton Scudamore, Wiltshire, England and died in 1164 about age 48.

8044388608. Renebault Sire De TANKERVILLE,415 son of Guillaume Seigneur De TANCARVILLE and Maud D' ARQUES, was born about 1088 in Tancarville, Le Havre, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France and died in 1140 about age 52. Another name for Renebault was Renebault De TANCARVILLE.

Renebault married Agnes STIGAND. Agnes was born about 1090 in Normandy, France.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194304       i.  Geoffrey De CLINTON Chamberlain Of Henry I (born about 1105 in St Pierre-DE-Semily, St Lo, Manche, Normandy, France)


8044388609. Agnes STIGAND,415 daughter of Odon STIGAND and Unknown, was born about 1090 in Normandy, France.

Agnes married Renebault Sire De TANKERVILLE. Renebault was born about 1088 in Tancarville, Le Havre, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France and died in 1140 about age 52. Another name for Renebault was Renebault De TANCARVILLE.

8044388804. Ranulph "The Rich" de ST. LIZ 505,1730,1731 was born about 1018 in Normandy, France.505 Another name for Ranulph was Ranulph "The Rich" de SENLIS.505

Ranulph married Judith.505 Judith was born about 1023.505

The child from this marriage was:

4022194402       i.  Simon I De ST. LIZ Earl Of Huntingdon (born about 1046 in Normandy, France - died in 1111 in Priory Of La Charite-Sur-Loir, Nievre, France)


8044388805. Judith 505 was born about 1023.505

Judith married Ranulph "The Rich" de ST. LIZ 505,1730.,1731 Ranulph was born about 1018 in Normandy, France.505 Another name for Ranulph was Ranulph "The Rich" de SENLIS.505

8044388806. Waltheof II Earl Of Huntingdon & NORTHUMBERLAND,415,1411,1416,1732,1733,1734 son of Sigurd (Syward) BIORNSSON Jarl Of Northumbria and Aelflaed Of NORTHUMBRIA, was born about 1036 in Northumberland, England, died on 31 May 1076 in Beheaded At Winchester, Hampshire, England 1732,1734 about age 40, and was buried in Crowland, Lincolnshire, England. Another name for Waltheof was Waltheof II Earl Of HUNTINGDON & Northumberland.

General Notes: on the history of the Earldom of Huntingdon:

The first post-Conquest Earl of Huntingdon appears to have been Waltheof, son of Siward Earl of Northumberland and indeed Siward's successor in the latter Earldom as well. Waltheof was later beheaded for conspiring against William the Conqueror. [Burke's Peerage]

-------------------------------

EARLDOM OF NORTHAMPTON (I)

EARLDOM OF HUNTINGDON (I)

WALTHEOF, son of SIWARD, EARL OF NORTHUMBERLAND, by Ælfled, daughter of ALDRED of Bernicia, became EARL OF HUNTINGDON and EARL OF NORTHAMPTON when Tostig was banished in October 1065. He is not known to have opposed the Conqueror in 1066, but was taken to Normandy the following year. In 1069 he joined the Danes in their descent on Yorkshire, distinguishing himself in the attack on the city of York. When the Danes left England he submitted himself to William, in January 1070, and was restored to his Earldom, and to his father's Earldom of Northumberland in 1072. While attending the wedding of Ralph de Gael, Earl of Norfolk, at Exning in the spring or summer of 1075, he was enticed to join the conspiracy of the Earls of Norfolk and Hereford to seize England for themselves. He quickly repented, and by Lanfranc's advice went to Normandy and asked pardon of the King, who treated the matter lightly at the time; but at Christmas Waltheof was brought to trial at Westmminster, his wife Judith being a witness. He was imprisoned at Winchester, where on the resumption of the trial in May he was condemned and beheaded on St. Giles's Hill, 31 May 1076, and hastily buried .

He married, in 1070, Judith, daughter of Lambert, COUNT OF LENS, by Adelaide or Adeliz, sister of the Conqueror. He died as aforesaid, 31 May 1076, and a fortnight later the Abbot Ulfketel, at Judith's request and by the King's permission, removed his body to Crowland, where it was honourably entombed.(g) His widow, who as "Judith the Countess" is recorded in Domesday Book to have held estates in many counties in 1086, most of them apparently gifts from the King, her uncle, held Huntingdon in dower. She founded the Nunnery of Elstow, near Bedford. [Complete Peerage VI:638-40, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

[g] Many miracles are recorded, for Waltheof was by many regarded as a saint. An epitaph was written for the tomb by Orderic. Other epitaphs are in the Vita. He is described as strong in person and of great repute as a warrior, pious had learnt the psalter in his youth, was liberal to the clergy and the poor, and a benefactor in particular to Jarrow and Crowland. To the former he gave Tynemouth. The chief stain on his memory is his part in a family bloodfeud, for he ordered the murder of the sons of one Carl, who had killed Earl Ealdrcd, Walthcof's grandfather.

------------------------------------

The county which gives designation to this earldom of Huntingdon was, according to Dr. Heylin, a thickly wooded forest until the reign of the 2nd Henry, when the timber was first cleared away; the chief town, from the celebrity of the forest as a chase, was called Huntingtown, which soon became abbreviated into Huntington, or Huntingdon. The Earldom of Huntingdom was conferred by William the Conqueror upon Waltheof (son of Syward, the Saxon Earl of Northumberland), who had m. the dau. of that monarch's sister, by the mother's side, Judith. He was also Earl of Northampton, and of Northumberland, but conspiring against the Normans, he was beheaded in 1073 at Winchester, leaving issue, Maud and Judith. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited, and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 467-8, St. Liz, Earls of Huntingdon]

------------------------------------

Waltheof was the last of the Old English earls to survive under William I, his execution for treason in 1076 marking a significant stage in the aristocratic and tenurial revolution which followed 1066. Younger son of Siward, the Danish earl of Northumbria (1041-55) and Aelflaed, daughter of Aldred, earl of Northumbria, Waltheof received an earldom consisting of the shires of Huntingdon, Bedford, Northampton, Rutland, and Cambridge in 1065. As one of the few English magnates not from the Godwin faction, he accepted and was accepted by William I, witnessing royal charters and remaining loyal to the new regime until 1069 when he joined with the Danes in their invasion of Northumbria. He was prominent in their capture of York, hoping, no doubt, to be restored to his father's position. This opportunism is perhaps more characteristic of English magnate reactions to the political turmoil of 1065-70 than any supposed national feeling. However, the revolt and invasion were defeated by William's winter campaign of 1069-70. It is a measure of William's insecurity that when Waltheof submitted in 1070 he was restored to royal favour and, in 1072, added the earldom of Northumbria to his holdings. To bind him more tightly to the Norman dispensation, William gave him his niece Judith in marriage. But in 1075, Waltheof was implicated in the largely French revolt led by Ralph, earl of Norfolk, and Roger, earl of Hereford. Despite his lack of military action, his confession, apparent contrition and the support of Archbishop Lanfranc, Waltheof was executed on 31 May 1076.

The king's motives are obscure. Waltheof was the only prominent Englishman to be executed in the reign. Perhaps his removal was part of William's justifiably nervous response to the problem of controlling Northumbria. It may have made sense to take the chance to remove a potential --- and proven --- focus of northern discontent. Yet Waltheof's heirs were not harried, one daughter, Matilda, marrying David I of Scotland (1042-53), and another Ralph IV of Tosny, a leading Norman baron.

Waltheof is a significant reminder that the period around 1066 was transitional, with no necessarily definite beginnings or endings. Waltheof adapted to the new order, falling foul, it seems, of the ambitions and schemes of others, not least of parvenus Frenchmen. He married into the new elite, yet embodied the old. Heir to both English and Anglo-Danish traditions, it was he who completed one of the most celebrated of Anglo-Saxon blood-feuds. In 1016, Uchtred, earl of Northumbria was murdered by a northern nobleman called Thurbrand. He was, in turn, killed by Uchtred's son and successor, Ealdred, who was himself slain by Thurbrand's son, Carl. Waltheof's mother was Ealdred's daughter and he avenged his great-grandfather and grandfather by massacring a number of Carl's sons.

Waltheof was buried at Crowland Abbey where, as did many martyrs to royal policy in the middle ages, he found posthumous fame in a cult which, by the mid-twelfth century, was venerating him as a saint. Yet his career in the north shows that not far beneath the measured tones of Norman propagandists or the efficient gloss of English bureaucratic procedures simmered the violence of Dark Age epic. [Who's Who in Early Medieval England, Christopher Tyerman, Shepheard-Walwyn, Ltd., London, 1996; Encyclopædia Britannica CD, 1997]

Waltheof married Judith Of LENS 1416,1732,1733,1735 in 1070 in 1st Husband 1732.,1735 Judith was born in 1054 in Lens, Artois/Pas-DE-Calais, France 1736 and died after 1086 1732,1735.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194403       i.  Matilda De HUNTINGDON (born in 1072 in Huntington, Huntingdonshire, England - died on 23 April 1131 in Scotland)

               ii.  Alice De HUNTINGDON was born about 1077 in Huntington, Huntingdonshire, England and died after 1126 1733,1737.


8044388807. Judith Of LENS,415,1416,1732,1733,1735 daughter of Lambert De BOULOGNE Count Of Lens and Countess Of Aumale & Pont Adélaïde De NORMANDY Countess Of Aumale, was born in 1054 in Lens, Artois/Pas-DE-Calais, France 1736 and died after 1086 1732,1735.

General Notes: He [Waltheof] married, in 1070, Judith, daughter of Lambert, COUNT OF LENS, by Adelaide or Adeliz, sister of the Conqueror. He died as aforesaid, 31 May 1076, and a fortnight later the Abbot Ulfketel, at Judith's request and by the King's permission, removed his body to Crowland, where it was honourably entombed.(g) His widow, who as "Judith the Countess" is recorded in Domesday Book to have held estates in many counties in 1086, most of them apparently gifts from the King, her uncle, held Huntingdon in dower. She founded the Nunnery of Elstow, near Bedford. [Complete Peerage VI:638-40, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

------------------------

After the execution of Waltheof, Earl of Huntingdon, King William offered Judith, his niece, the deceased earl's widow, in marriage to Simon St. Liz, a noble Norman, but the lady peremptorily rejected the alliance, owing, Dugdale says, to St. Liz's halting in one leg, which refusal so displeased the Conqueror that he immediately seized upon the castle and honour of Huntingdon, which the countess held in dower, exposing herself and her dau. to a state of privation and obscurity in the Isle of Ely and other places, while he bestowed upon the said Simon St. Liz the town of Northampton and the whole hundred of Falkeley, then valued at £40 per annum, to provide shoes for his horses. St. Liz thus disappointed in obtaining the hand of the Countess of Huntingdon, made his addresses with greater success to her elder dau., the Lady Maud, who became his wife, when William conferred upon the said Simon de St. Liz, the Earldoms of Huntingdon and Northampton. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited, and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 467-8, St. Liz, Earls of Huntingdon]


NOTE: The parentage of Judith of Lens has come under critical study since the early 1970's, when Enguerrand II was thought by some to be her father. The currently acceptable parentage among most scholars is as stated, i.e., Lambert of Boulogne. [Roderick W. Stuart, Royalty for Commoners, 3rd ed., Genealogical Publishing Company, Baltimore MD, 1998]

Judith married Waltheof II Earl Of Huntingdon & NORTHUMBERLAND 1411,1416,1732,1733,1734 in 1070 in 1st Husband 1732.,1735 Waltheof was born about 1036 in Northumberland, England, died on 31 May 1076 in Beheaded At Winchester, Hampshire, England 1732,1734 about age 40, and was buried in Crowland, Lincolnshire, England. Another name for Waltheof was Waltheof II Earl Of HUNTINGDON & Northumberland.

Judith next married Ives (Ivo) De TAILLEBOIS 1st Baron Of Kendal 1022,1694,1695 after 1076 in 2ND Husband. Ives was born about 1036 in Cristot, Calvados, Normandy, France 1696 and died in 1094 in Kendal, Cambria, England 1697 about age 58. Another name for Ives was Ivo TAILBOYS.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  William De TAILLEBOIS Of Lancaster was born about 1077 in Lancaster, Lancashire, England.

               ii.  Waltheof (Waldelf) De HEPPLE was born before 1086 in Hepple, Rothbury, Northumberland, England and died before 1161. Another name for Waltheof was Waltheof (Waldelf) TAILBOYS Of Hepple.


8044388812. Richard Fitzgilbert De CLARE & Tonbridge, Sir 415,635,1403,1404,1405 was born before 1035 in Brionne, Eure, Normandy, France,1405 died in May 1089 in Clare, Risbridge, Suffolk, England 1406,1407, and was buried in Priory Of St Neot, Cambridgeshire, England. Another name for Richard was 01st Lord Of CLARE Richard De Clare.

General Notes: Richard Fitz Gilbert; also known as "de Bienfaite" (from the quantity of his fiefs [so states BP, but CP states Richard was lord of Bienfate & Orbec in Normandy]), "de Clare" or "de Tonbridge" (from actual fiefs); went with his cousin William I the Conqueror to England and was granted 176 Lordships, 95 of them associated with the Honour (feudal unit of administration) of Clare, Suffolk, and others with Tonbridge, Kent. [Burke's Peerage]

-----------------------------

Observations. In the times of the Heptarchy the border fortress of Clare (Suffolk), on the confines of the Kingdoms of East Anglia and Essex, was of the greatest importance, and continued to be so or many centuries afterwards, when, it was granted by the Conqueror to Richard FitzGilbert. FitzGilbert's successors the earlier Lords of Clare were, "it is implied in the Lords' Reports [vol. iii, p. 124] and elsewhere, styled Earls of Clare before they were Earls of Hertford, but investigation disproves this," though doubtless, these Lords, after they obtained that Earldom, were according to the usage of the period, frequently styled "Earls of Clare," just as the Earls of Derby were styled "Earls Ferrers," &c. On account of the great importance of these feudal Barons, the earlier Lords of Clare, so frequently considered to have been actual Peers, a short account of them is subjoined, as under.

HOLDERS OF THE HONOUR OF CLARE (I) temp. William I

RICHARD FITZGILBERT, styled (from his possessions) " DE BIENFAITE," "DE CLARE," and "DE TONBRIDGE, was son of Gilbert, COUNT OF BRIONNE in Normandy, which Gilbert was son and heir of Godfrey, COUNT OF BRIONNE, illegitimate son of Richard, DUKE OF NORMANDY. He was born before 1035, was Lord of Bienfaite and Orbec in Normandy, accompanied his kinsman, William the Conqueror, into England, and was rewarded by him with no less than 176 Lordships, of which 95 were in Suffolk, attached to the Honour of Clare, which honour,, with the Castle of Clare, as also the Castle of Tonbridge in Kent, he obtained, becoming thus Lord of Clare and of Tonbridge. During the King's absence he was joint Chief justiciar, and, as such, suppressed the revolt of 1075.

He married Rohese, daughter of Walter GIFFARD, the elder, and aunt and heir of Walter [GIFFARD], 2nd Earl of Buckingham, through which match his descendants became co-heirs to the lands of that family. He was living 1081, but appears to have died about 1090 being buried at St. Neots, co. Huntingdon. His widow was living, as such, 1113. [Complete Peerage III:242, XIV:183, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

-----------------------------

Richard FitzGilbert, having accompanied the Conqueror into England, participated in the spoils of conquest and obtained extensive possessions in the new and old dominions of his royal leader and kinsman. In 1073 we find him joined under the designation of Ricardus de Benefacta, with William de Warren, in the great office of Justiciary of England, with whom, in three years afterwards, he was in arms against the rebellious lords Robert de Britolio, Earl of Hereford, and Ralph Waher, or Guarder, Earl of Norfolk and Suffolk, and behaved with great gallantry. But afterwards, at the time of the General Survey, which was towards the close of William's reign, he is called Ricardus de Tonebruge, from his seat at Tonebruge (now Tunbridge) in Kent, which town and castle he obtained from the archbishop of Canterbury in lieu of the castle of Brion, at which time he enjoyed thirty-eight lordships in Surrey, thirty-five in Essex, three in Cambridgeshire, with some others in Wilts and Devon, and ninety-five in Suffolk, amongst those was Clare, whence he was occasionally styled Richard de Clare, and that place in a few years afterwards becoming the chief seat of the family, his descendants are said to have assumed thereupon the title of Earls of Clare. This great feudal lord m. Rohese, dau. of Walter Giffard, Earl of Buckingham, and had issue, Gilbert, his successor, Roger, Walter, Richard, Robert, a dau. m. to Ralph de Telgers, and a dau. mo. to Eudo Dapifer. Richard de Tonebruge, or de Clare, whose is said to have fallen in a skirmish with the Welsh, was s. by his eldest son, Gilbert de Tonebruge. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, London, 1883, p. 118, Clare, Lords of Clare, Earls of Hertford, Earls of Gloucester]

Noted events in his life were:

• Alt. Death: Alt. Death, Abt 1090. 1404,1405

Richard married Rohese GIFFARD 1404,1405.,1408 Rohese was born about 1036 in Longueville-Sur-Scie, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France and died after 1113 1405.

8044388813. Rohese GIFFARD 415,1404,1405,1408 was born about 1036 in Longueville-Sur-Scie, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France and died after 1113 1405.

General Notes: He [Richard FitzGilbert de Clare] married Rohese, daughter of Walter GIFFARD, the elder, and aunt and heir of Walter [GIFFARD], 2nd Earl of Buckingham, through which match his descendants became co-heirs to the lands of that family. He was living 1081, but appears to have died about 1090 being buried at St. Neots, co. Huntingdon. His widow was living, as such, 1113. [Complete Peerage III:242, XIV:183, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Noted events in her life were:

• Alt. Death: Alt. Death, After 1133. 1407

Rohese married Richard Fitzgilbert De CLARE & Tonbridge, Sir 635,1403,1404.,1405 Richard was born before 1035 in Brionne, Eure, Normandy, France,1405 died in May 1089 in Clare, Risbridge, Suffolk, England 1406,1407, and was buried in Priory Of St Neot, Cambridgeshire, England. Another name for Richard was 01st Lord Of CLARE Richard De Clare.


8044388832. Foulques V Comte D' ANJOU King Of Jerusalem,415,670,1059,1169,1738,1739 son of Foulques IV "Le Rechin" Comte D' ANJOU Count Of Anjou and Bertrade (Bertrada\Beatrice) De MONTFORT [Queen Of France], was born in 1092 in Anjou/Pays-DE-La-Loire, France,389,390,1740 died on 10 November 1143 in Jerusalem, Palestine 389,390,1740 at age 51, and was buried in 1143 in Church Of Holy Sepulcher, Jerusalem, Israel.389,390 Another name for Foulques was Foulques d' ANJOU.1741

General Notes:
Became King of Jerusalem 1131 on the death of his 2nd Father-in-Law.

Noted events in his life were:

• Unknown: King of Jerusalem, 1131-1143, Acre, Hazafon, Israel, Palestine. 390

• Unknown: Count of Anjou, 1109-1129, , , Anjou, France. 390

• Unknown: Count of Aragón, 1109-1129, , , Aragón, Spain. 390

Foulques married Ermengarde (Erembourg) Du MAINE Countess Of Anjou 1739,1740 on 11 July 1110 in , , Anjou, France 389,390.,1740 Ermengarde was born about 1097 in Fleche, Sarthe, Maine/Pays-DE-La-Loire, France 389,390 and died in 1126 in , , Maine, France 389,390,1740 about age 29.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Sibilla De ANJOU Duchess Of Normandy was born about 1115 in Anjou/Pays-DE-La-Loire, France 389,390 and died in 1165 in Bethlehem, Judea, Canaan, Palestine 389,390 about age 50.

4022194416      ii.  Geoffrey V "Le Bon"The Fair PLANTAGENET Count Of Anjou And Maine (born on 24 August 1113 in Anjou/Pays-DE-La-Loire, France - died on 7 September 1151 in Chateau, Eure-Et-Loire, Normandy, France)

              iii.  Helias II (Helie) Comte De MAINE was born about 1114 in Fleche, Sarthe, Maine/Pays-DE-La-Loire, France 1742 and died from 15 January 1150 to 1151 1742 about age 36.

Foulques next married Melisende De RETHEL Princess Of Jerusalem,1738,1743 daughter of Baldwin II De RETHEL King Of Jerusalem and Unknown, on 2 June 1129 in , , , France 389,390,1740.,1743 Melisende was born about 1110 in Jerusalem, Palestine,389,390 died on 11 September 1161 389,390,1740 about age 51, and was buried from 12 September 1160 to 1161.389,390

Noted events in her life were:

• Unknown: Father. 390

• Unknown: Princess of Jerusalem, Jerusalem, Judah, Israel, Palestine. 390,417

• Unknown: Countess of Anjou, , , Anjou, France. 390,417

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Baudouin III D'ANJOU King Of Jerusalem was born about 1129 in <, , Anjou, France>,389,390 died on 11 February 1163 in Berit, Jerusalem, Isreal, Palestine 389,390 about age 34, and was buried in Tomb Of Kings, Jerusalem, Israel, Palestine.389,390

               ii.  Amaury D'ANJOU King Of Jerusalem was born about 1131 in <, , Anjou, France>,389,390,1744 died on 11 July 1174 389,390,1744 about age 43, and was buried in St. Sepulcre Church, Jerusalem, Israel, Palestine.389,390 Another name for Amaury was Almeric I D' ANJOU King Of Jerusalem.


8044388833. Ermengarde (Erembourg) Du MAINE Countess Of Anjou,415,670,1739,1740 daughter of Helias De La Fleche Comte Du MAINE and Matilda (Maud) De CHATEAU DU LOIRE [Countess Of Mainf, was born about 1097 in Fleche, Sarthe, Maine/Pays-DE-La-Loire, France 389,390 and died in 1126 in , , Maine, France 389,390,1740 about age 29.

General Notes:
She succeeded her father, Helie de la Fleche, Count of Maine by-the-right of his wife, Paula de Maine, and co-reigned with husband Foulques d'Anjou who died in 1142. Her daughter, Mathilde, was given the county of Maine upon her marriage to William of Wales, who died 1120, and when Mathilde entered a convent, her son, Helie, became Count of Maine. Eremburge lived (ca. 1090-ca. 1126).

Noted events in her life were:

• Unknown: Countess of Anjou, , , Anjou, France. 390

• Unknown: Countess of Maine, , Le Mans, Maine-Et-Loire, France. 390

Ermengarde married Foulques V Comte D' ANJOU King Of Jerusalem 1738,1739 on 11 July 1110 in , , Anjou, France 389,390.,1740 Foulques was born in 1092 in Anjou/Pays-DE-La-Loire, France,389,390,1740 died on 10 November 1143 in Jerusalem, Palestine 389,390,1740 at age 51, and was buried in 1143 in Church Of Holy Sepulcher, Jerusalem, Israel.389,390 Another name for Foulques was Foulques d' ANJOU.1741


8044388834. Duke & Lion Of Justice Henry I "Beauclerc" King Of ENGLAND,415,417,642,670,774,775,1167,1168,1169,1598,1600,1601,1602,1745,1746 son of William I "The Conqueror" King Of ENGLAND and Countess Matilda (Maud) Of FLANDERS Queen Of England, was born in 1068 in Selby, West Riding Yorkshire, England,389,390,1598,1599 was christened on 5 August 1070 in , Selby, Yorkshire, England,389,390 died on 1 December 1135 in , St Denis, Seine-St Denis, France 389,390,1598 at age 67, and was buried from 4 January 1135 to 1136 in Reading Abbey, Reading, Berkshire, England.389,390

General Notes:
Henry I was born in the year 1068---a factor he himself regarded as highly significant, for he was the only son of the Conqueror born after the conquest of England, and to Henry this meant he was heir to the throne. He was not an attractive proposition: he was dissolute to a degree, producing at least a score of bastards; but far worse he was prone to sadistic cruelty---on one occasion, for example, personally punishing a rebellious burgher by throwing him from the walls of his town.

At the death of William the Conqueror, Henry was left no lands, merely 5,000 pounds of silver. With these he bought lands from his elder brother Robert Curthose, Duke of Normandy, only to see them taken back again a few years later by Robert, in unholy alliance with his brother William Rufus.

Henry could do little to avenge such treatment, but in England he found numerous barons who were tired of the exactions and ambitions of their king. He formed alliances with some of these, notably with the important de Clare family. He and some of the de Clares were with William Rufus on his last hunting expedition, and it is thought that the king's death was the result of Henry's plotting.

Certainly he moved fast to take advantage of it; leaving Rufus's body unattended in the woods, he swooped down on Winchester to take control of the treasury. Two days later he was in Westminster, being crowned by the Bishop of London. His speed is understandable when one realises that his elder brother, Robert [Curthose], was returning from the crusade, and claimed, with good reason, to be the true heir.

Henry showed great good sense in his first actions as King. He arrested Ranulph Flambard, William's tax-gatherer, and recalled Anselm, the exiled Archbishop. Furthermore, he issued a Charter of Liberties which promised speedy redress of grievances, and a return to the good government of the Conqueror. Putting aside for the moment his many mistresses, he married the sister of the King of Scots, who was descended from the royal line of Wessex; and lest the Norman barons should think him too pro-English in this action, he changed her name from Edith to Matilda. No one could claim that he did not aim to please.

In 1101 Robert Curthose invaded, but Henry met him at Alton, and persuaded him to go away again by promising him an annuity of £2,000. He had no intention of keeping up the payments, but the problem was temporarily solved.

He now felt strong enough to move against dissident barons who might give trouble in the future. Chief amongst these was the vicious Robert of Bellême, Earl of Shrewsbury, whom Henry had known for many years as a dangerous troublemaker. He set up a number of charges against him in the king's court, making it plain that if he appeared for trial he would be convicted and imprisoned. Thus Robert and his colleagues were forced into rebellion at a time not of their own choosing, were easily defeated and sent scuttling back to Normandy.

In Normandy Robert Curthose began to wreak his wrath on all connected with his brother, thus giving Henry an excellent chance to retaliate with charges of misgovernment and invade. He made two expeditions in 1104-5, before the great expedition of 1106 on which Robert was defeated at the hour-long battle of Tinchebrai, on the anniversary of Hastings. No one had expected such an easy victory, but Henry took advantage of the state of shock resulting from the battle to annex Normandy. Robert was imprisoned (in some comfort, it be said); he lived on for 28 more years, ending up in Cardiff castle whiling away the long hours learning Welsh. His son William Clito remained a free agent, to plague Henry for most of the rest of his reign.

In England the struggle with Anselm over the homage of bishops ran its course until the settlement of 1107. In matters of secular government life was more simple: Henry had found a brilliant administrator, Roger of Salisbury, to act as Justiciar for him. Roger had an inventive mind, a keen grasp of affairs, and the ability to single out young men of promise. He quickly built up a highly efficient team of administrators, and established new routines and forms of organisation within which they could work. To him we owe the Exchequer and its recording system of the Pipe Rolls, the circuits of royal justiciars spreading the king's peace, and the attempts at codification of law. Henry's good relationships with his barons, and with the burgeoning new towns owed much to skilful administration. Certainly he was able to gain a larger and more reliable revenue this way than by the crude extortion his brother had used.

In 1120 came the tragedy of the White Ship. The court was returning to England, and the finest ship in the land was filled with its young men, including Henry's son and heir William. Riotously drunk, they tried to go faster and faster, when suddenly the ship foundered. All hands except a butcher of Rouen were lost, and England was without an heir.

Henry's benefactions to the Church caused the monkish historians to palliate his sins and to find excuses for his lust; but they could not avert the fatal consequence. When the White Ship was wrecked on the deadly rock, a boat was launched and the King's only legitimate son and heir was being rowed to safety. It was the cries of his illegitimate half-sister, the Countess of Perche, which induced him to return to the wreck, where they sank together. [THE COMPLETE PEERAGE, Volume XI, Appendix D, pp. 105-121]

Henry's only legitimate child was Matilda, but she was married to the Emperor Henry V of Germany, and so could not succeed. But in 1125 her husband died, and Henry brought her home and forced the barons to swear fealty to her---though they did not like the prospect of a woman ruler. Henry then married her to Geoffrey of Anjou, the Normans' traditional enemy, and the barons were less happy---especially when the newly-weds had a terrible row, and Geoffrey ordered her out of his lands. In 1131 Henry, absolutely determined, forced the barons to swear fealty once more, and the fact that they did so is testimoney of his controlling power. Matilda and Geoffrey were reunited, and in 1133 she produced a son whom she named for his grandfather. If only Henry could live on until his grandson was old enough to rule, all would be well.

But in 1135, against doctor's orders, he ate a hearty meal of lampreys, got acute indigestion, which turned into fever, and died. He was buried at his abbey in Reading---some said in a silver coffin, for which there was an unsuccessful search at the Dissolution. [Source: Who's Who in the Middle Ages, John Fines, Barnes & Noble Books, New York, 1995]

Noted events in his life were:

• Ruled: 1100-1135.

Henry married Sibyl (Adela) (Lucy) CORBET Lady Of Alcester 893,1601,1748 about 1105 in No Marriage 390,630,893.,1747 Sibyl was born about 1092 in Longden, Pontesbury, Shropshire, England 389,390 and died after 1157 in <, Alcester, Warwick, England> 389,390,1747. Another name for Sibyl was Annora or Lucy.

Noted events in their marriage were:

• Partners: Abt 1090. 1701,1702,1713,1749

Children from this marriage were:

8044388458       i.  Robert De CAEN 1st Earl Of Gloucester (born about 1090 in Caen, Calvados, Normandy, France - died on 31 October 1147 in Bristol, Gloucestershire, England)

               ii.  Sibylla FITZHENRY was born about 1104 in Domfront, Normandy, France and died on 12 July 1122 in Island Of The Woman, Loch Tay, Scotland about age 18.

              iii.  Reynold De DUNSTANVILLE 1st Earl Of Cornwall was born about 1096 in Dunstanville, Kent, England,389,390,895 died on 1 July 1175 in Chertsey, Surrey, England (Dspms Legit) 389,390,893,896 about age 79, and was buried in Abbey, Reading, Berkshire, England.389,390 Other names for Reynold were 01st Earl Of CORNWALL Reginald De Dunstanville, and Reginald FITZROY Earl Of Cornwall.897

               iv.  Rohese De NORMANDIE Princess Of England was born about 1114 in <, Dunstan, Kent, England> 389,390 and died after 1176 in , , , England 389,390.

Henry next married Several MISTRESSES 1601,1750 in No Marriage 389,390,1095.,1750 Several was born about 1070 in England & France.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Mabel (Eustacia) FITZROY was born about 1088 in Normandy, France. Other names for Mabel were Eustacia\Richilde Of ENGLAND, and1751 Mabel De NORMANDY.

               ii.  Gilbert De NORMANDIE Prince Of England was born about 1103 in <, , Devonshire, England> 390,630 and died after 1142 390,630.

              iii.  William De TRACY Lord Of Bradninch was born after 1090 in Bradninch, Tiverton, Devonshire, England,389,390,1752 was christened in 1105 in <, Westminster, Middlesex, England>,389,390 and died after 1135 389,390,1752.

8044361945      iv.  Elizabeth Of ENGLAND (born in 1095 in Talby, Yorkshire, England)

Henry next married Edith FITZFORNE Baroness Of Greystoke 1464,1601 about 1089 in No Marriage 389,390.,1095 Edith was born about 1072 in Greystoke, Cumberland, England,389,390,1753 died in 1152 389,390,773,1753 about age 80, and was buried in Oseney Abbey, Oxford, Oxfordshire, England.389,390,1753

Marriage Notes: Mistress of Henry I
_STATConcubinage
CHAN26 Feb 2002

Noted events in her life were:

• Unknown: Baroness of Greystoke, , Greystoke Manor, Northumberland, England. 390,417

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  Robert FITZEDITH was born about 1098 in Devonshire, England and died on 31 May 1172 1750 about age 74. Another name for Robert was Robert FITZROY.

Henry next married Isabel (Elizabeth) De BEAUMONT 1601,1754,1755 in No Marriage.1754 Isabel was born about 1098 in Leicester, , Leicestershire, England,389,390 was christened in , Leicester, Leicestershire, England,389,390 and died from 6 January 1147 to 1148 in Carmarthen, Carmarthenshire, Wales 389,390 about age 49.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Alice Of ENGLAND was born about 1114 in Selby, Yorkshire, England and died in 1141 in Montmorency, Val D'oise, Ile-DE-France, France about age 27.

               ii.  Isabel Hedwig De NORMANDIE Princess Of England was born about 1116 in <, Reading, Berkshire, England>.389,390

              iii.  Constance FITZHENRY was born about 1115 in England.

Henry next married Edith 1750 in No Marriage.1750 Edith was born about 1070 in England.

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  Matilda Of ENGLAND was born in 1086 in England 1756 and died on 25 November 1120 in Drowned In Wreck Of The White Ship Along With Prince William 1750,1756 at age 34.

Henry next married Princess Of Wales Nest Verch RHYS Heiress Of Carew,1601,1758,1759,1760,1761,1762 daughter of Rhys Ap TEWDWR King Of Deheubarth and Gwladus Verch RHIWALLON, about 1098 in No Marriage 389,390,726,1095,1750.,1757 Nest was born about 1073 of Dynevor, Llandyfeisant, Carmarthenshire, Wales 389,390,1762 and died about 1163 about age 90.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Maud Of ENGLAND was born about 1099 in England.

               ii.  Henry FITZHENRY Of Narberth & Pebidiog was born about 1105 of Narberth & Pebidiog, Wales 1763 and died in 1158 in Killed 1757,1763 about age 53.

Henry next married Matilda "Atheling" SCOTLAND Queen Of England 1599,1600,1601 on 11 November 1100 in Westminster Abbey, London, England 389,390,726,1600,1750.,1757 Matilda was born in October 1079 in Dunfermline, Dunfermline, Fifeshire, Scotland,389,390,1600 died on 1 May 1118 in Westminster, London, Middlesex, England 389,390,1600 at age 38, and was buried in June 1118 in Church Of St Peter, Westminster, Middlesex, England.389,390

Children from this marriage were:

4022194417       i.  Maud "The Empress" Princess Of ENGLAND Queen Of England (born on 7 February 1101-1102 in Winchester, Hants, England - died on 10 September 1167 in Abbey Of Notre Dame Des Pres, Rouen, France)

               ii.  William ATHELING Prince Of England was born before 5 August 1103 in <Selby, West Riding, Yorkshire, England>,389,390 died on 25 November 1120 in <, Barfleur, Manche, France> 389,390, and was buried on 26 November 1120 in <, Barfleur, Manche, France>.389,390

Henry next married Adeliza (Adela) Of LOUVAIN 1595,1598,1599 from 29 January 1120 to 1121 in Windsor Castle, Berkshire, England 1598,1599.,1600 Adeliza was born about 1103 in Brabant, Netherlands,1599 died on 23 April 1151 in Affligem Nunnery, Brabant, Belgium (As A Nun) 1595,1599 about age 48, and was buried in Affligem Abbey, Brabant, Belgium. Another name for Adeliza was Adelicia Of LORRAINE.

Henry next married Adelicia Princess Of BRABANT Queen Of England 1595,1598,1599,1601 from 24 January 1120 to 1121 in , Windsor, Berkshire, England 389,390,1598,1599,1764.,1765 Adelicia was born about 1094 in Of, , Brabant, Netherlands,389,390,1599 died on 23 April 1151 in Affligham, Flanders, France 389,390,1595,1599 about age 57, and was buried on 23 April 1151 in Reading Abbey, Reading, Berkshire, England.389,390 Another name for Adelicia was Adelicia Of LORRAINE.

Noted events in her life were:

• Unknown: Queen of England, Westminster Abbey, Westminster, Middlesex, England. 390,417,1764,1765

• Unknown: Princess of Brabant, <Brabant, Antwerp, Belgium, Netherlands>. 390,417,1765

Henry next married Ansfride De SPARSHALT Concubine 2 about 1086 in <, , , England> 389,390.,1095 Ansfride was born about 1069 in <, Sparsholt, Berkshire, England> 389,390 and was buried in Abington Abbey, Abington, Berkshire, England.389,390

Marriage Notes: _STATConcubinage
CHAN26 Feb 2002

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Richard De NORMANDIE Prince Of England was born about 1089 in Abingdon, , Berkshire, England 389,390 and died on 26 November 1119 in , Barfleur, Manche, France 389,390 about age 30.

               ii.  Fulk De NORMANDIE Prince Of England was born about 1092 in Abingdon, , Berkshire, England.389,390




8044388835. Matilda "Atheling" SCOTLAND Queen Of England,415,642,643,670,774,775,1057,1599,1600,1601,1746,1766 daughter of Malcolm III Canmore King Of SCOTLAND and St. Margaret Aetheling Of SCOTLAND Queen Of Scotland, was born in October 1079 in Dunfermline, Dunfermline, Fifeshire, Scotland,389,390,1600 died on 1 May 1118 in Westminster, London, Middlesex, England 389,390,1600 at age 38, and was buried in June 1118 in Church Of St Peter, Westminster, Middlesex, England.389,390

General Notes:
Matilda of Scotland (d. 1118). Queen consort of Henry I from 1100; daughter of Malcolm III of Scots and granddaughter of Edmund Ironside. Known as Good Queen Maud, she was a strong supporter of Archbishop Anselm and the church. [Ref: Dict of Brit History p237]

Edith Matilda 'Atheling', Princess of SCOTLAND. Born about 1079/1080 Dunfermline, Fifeshire, Scotland. Died 1 May 1118 Westminster, Middlesex, England. Buried Jun 1118 Church of St Peter, Westminster, Middlesex, England. To please the English subjects of her husband, the king, she changed her Saxon name of Edith to the Norman name of Matilda. She is also known by the diminutive of that name - Maud (which had been the name of Henry's mother). She was the sister of Edgar, King of Scotland 1098-1107. [Ref: Unk]

Edith - Margaret (Matilda) of Scotland, born in 1080 and died in 1118, married Henry I. Beauclerc, King of England, son of William I The Conqueror (ruler from 1066 to 1087) and his wife, Matilda of Flanders, who died in 1083... Matilda was educated at Wilton and Romsey Abbey where she said that her aunt, Christina, forced her to wear a black veil. She threw it on the ground whenever left alone, in spite of beatings. When her mother died she came to England to Edgar Atheling, her uncle. She was a sister of King David of Scotland; she was a correspondent of Anselm and Hildebert, Bishop of Le Mans, who wrote poetry about her. She was a symbol of the union of Saxon and Norman. She was Henry's Queen for seventeen years and six months, and died in her prime like most of her family. Henry and Matilda had a son and a daughter... [Ref: McBride2]

Matilda (Edith) of Scotland (1079-1118) daughter of Malcolm III Canmore, King of Scots 1058-1093 and St. Margaret of Wessex. Born 1079 Dunfermline. Died 1 May 1118 Westminster Palace. Married 11 November 1100 Westminster Abbey Henry I, King of England 1100-1135. Born 1068 Selby, Yorkshire. Died 1 December 1135 St.Denis-le-Fermont, nr Rouen.

She was born in 1079 or 1080 and, as she was destined to become a nun, she went to Romsey where her Aunt Christina was the Abbess. However, in 1100 Henry I, the new king of England, demanded her hand in marriage; and on 11 November 1100 at Westminster she became his queen. Upon her marriage she adopted the name Matilda in honour of the king's mother. They had two, possibly three children. Queen Matilda built a leper hospital at St. Giles-in-the-Fields, London, and founded the Augustinian Priory at Aldgate. She was aged only about thirty-eight when she died. [Ref: Leo van de Pas]

Noted events in her life were:

• Title: Queen of England, 1 December 1135-July 1136, Westminster Abbey, Westminster, Middlesex, England. 390

• Title: Princess of Scotland, , Dunfermline, Fife, Scotland. 390

Matilda married Duke & Lion Of Justice Henry I "Beauclerc" King Of ENGLAND 1598,1600,1601,1602 on 11 November 1100 in Westminster Abbey, London, England 389,390,726,1600,1750.,1757 Henry was born in 1068 in Selby, West Riding Yorkshire, England,389,390,1598,1599 was christened on 5 August 1070 in , Selby, Yorkshire, England,389,390 died on 1 December 1135 in , St Denis, Seine-St Denis, France 389,390,1598 at age 67, and was buried from 4 January 1135 to 1136 in Reading Abbey, Reading, Berkshire, England.389,390

8044388836. Roger III De TOENI Lord Of Flamstead,415,1449,1767,1768 son of Ralph IV De TOENI De Conches, Lord Flamstead and Alice De HUNTINGDON, was born about 1104 in Flamstead, Hertfordshire, England 1767,1768 and died from before February 1161 to 1162 1767,1768. Another name for Roger was Roger De CONCHES.

General Notes: Roger, called de Toeni or de Conches; born probably c1104; married Ida, daughter of Baldwin III, Count of Hainault, and died between autumn 1157 and the beginning of 1162. [Burke's Peerage]

----------------------

ROGER DE TOENI III, styled also DE CONCHES, 1st son and heir, was born probably about 1104, and succeeded his father about 1126. In 1131 he attested Henry I's pancarte confirming all the grants of his ancestors and himself and others to the abbey of Conches. He is said to have waged war with Hugh de Chateauneuf in 1133. In 1135 the King suspected that he was preparing to rebel, together with William Talvas, Count of Ponthieu, on behalf of Henry's son-in-law, Geoffrey Plantagenet, and sent his own soldiers to garrison the castle of Conches. After the King's death Roger supported Geoffrey and his wife the Empress Maud against Stephen. After Easter 1136 hostilities began between him and the King's generals, the twins Waleran, Count of Meulan, and Robert, Earl of Leicester; and civil war raged in May and June. In the autumn the fighting flared up again; but on 3 October Roger was ambushed and captured by Count Waleran and Henry de la Pommeraye. His land was laid under an interdict and he was kept in prison for more than 6 months, but was released in 1137. In May 1138 he was attacked by the Count of Meulan and William d'Ypres, but defended himself successfully; and on 7 September he captured Breteuil and burnt the town. However, before the end of 1138 he made peace with the twin Earls, who conducted him to England, where he was reconciled to King Stephen. Nothing is known of what happened to his English lands during this period. In 1150 or 1151 he was with Henry, Duke of Normandy, at Rouen. After Henry had become King, Roger enjoyed the royal favour; for between Michaelmas 1157 and Michaelmas 1158 the King granted him 100 solidates of land at Holkham, Norfolk. He was a benefactor to the abbeys of la Noë, Conches and Bec.

He married Ida, daughter of BALDWIN III, COUNT OF HAINAULT, by Yolande, daughter of Gerard, COUNT OF GUELDERS. With her he had in marriage from Henry 120 librates of land out of the royal demesne at East Bergholt, Suffolk. He died after Michaelmas 1157 and probably before 1162. [Complete Peerage XII/1:763-4, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

----------------------

Following copied from soc.genealogy.medieval newgroup:

From: Paul C. Reed (reedpcgen@aol.com)
Subject: Idenity of Countess Ida revisited [2nd try]
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
Date: 2000/01/06

Roger de Toeni [the third of that name, or III] was born ca. 1104, and died after Michaelmas 1157, presumably before his son died in 1162. He married Ida of Hainault, daughter of Baldwin III, Count of Hainault, by his wife Yolande de Guelders. It is not known when Ida died, but she presumably survived him, as Henry II granted her [Ida de Tounay] land at Garsington, co. Oxford [Rot. Hund.].

This couple had four known sons:
(1) Ralph de Toeni [V], who succeeded his father and died 1262/3, having married Margaret de Beaumont.
(2) Roger de Toeni, Jr., dead by 1185, when his wife Ade/Alda de Chaumont was holding land at Holkington, co. Norfolk, of her son Baldwin de Toeni [II] (1170-1216), Seigneur de Acquigny, apparently father of Roger de Akeny and Sir William Dakeny [Acquigny]. The Rotuli de Dominabus states that Ade/Alda was born about 1155, and that she had five daughters aside from her son Baldwin. [Does anyone have any Dakeny ancestry?]
(3) Baldwin de Toeni, who settled in Hainault [having resided with his uncle Baldwin IV], where he died in 1170, leaving issue.
(4) Geoffrey de Toeni, a cleric who flourished 1157-62, 1177.


Two daughters have also been mentioned before:

1) Goda (c1136-) m Walchieline de Ferrers

2)Godeheut de Toeni (-<1186) m William de Mohun (<1143-1176); Of Dunster; s
of William by Agnes de Gaunt. They left Agnes and Yolante

[Latter posting on daughters from Adrian Channing, 10 Jan 2000]

Roger married Ida (Gertrude) Of HAINAULT 1449,1767.,1769 Ida was born about 1109 in Hainault, Belgium 1770 and died after 1162 in Garsington, Headington, Oxfordshire, England 1771.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194418       i.  Ralph V De TOENI Lord Of Flamstead (born about 1125 in Flamstead, Hertfordshire, England - died in 1162)

               ii.  Roger IV De TOENI was born about 1130 in Flamstead, Hertfordshire, England and died before 1185 1771.

              iii.  Godeheut De TOENI was born about 1135 in Flamstead, Hertfordshire, England and died before 1186 1772,1773.

8044364659      iv.  Goda De TOENI (born about 1136 in Eggington, Derbyshire, England)


8044388837. Ida (Gertrude) Of HAINAULT,415,670,1449,1767,1769 daughter of Baudouin III Count Of HAINAULT and Yolande Von WASSENBERG Of Guelders, was born about 1109 in Hainault, Belgium 1770 and died after 1162 in Garsington, Headington, Oxfordshire, England 1771.

General Notes: Ida, daughter of Baldwin III, Count of Hainault. [Burke's Peerage]

--------------------

He [Roger de Toeni] married Ida, daughter of BALDWIN III, COUNT OF HAINAULT, by Yolande, daughter of Gerard, COUNT OF GUELDERS. With her he had in marriage from Henry 120 librates of land out of the royal demesne at East Bergholt, Suffolk. He died after Michaelmas 1157 and probably before 1162. [Complete Peerage XII/1:763-4, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Ida married Roger III De TOENI Lord Of Flamstead 1449,1767.,1768 Roger was born about 1104 in Flamstead, Hertfordshire, England 1767,1768 and died from before February 1161 to 1162 1767,1768. Another name for Roger was Roger De CONCHES.

8044388838. Robert II De BEAUMONT 2nd Earl Of Leicester,415,505,670,1376,1774,1775 son of Robert I De BEAUMONT 1st Earl Of Leicester and Isabel (Elizabeth) De VERMANDOIS, was born in 1104 in Pont Audemer, Eure, Normandy, France,1774,1775 died on 5 April 1168 in Leicester Castle, Leicestershire, England 1774,1775 at age 64, and was buried in St Mary DE Pre Priory, St Albans, Hertfordshire, England. Another name for Robert was 2nd Earl Of LEICESTER Robert De Beaumont.

General Notes:
On Leicester, Earldom of [Burke's Peerage, p. 1671]:

Robert de Beaumont, a companion in arms of William I (The Conqueror) at Hastings was granted after the Conquest much land in the Midlands of England, but most of it was in Warwickshire rather than Leicestershire. Indeed his younger brother became Earl of Warwick. Robert also held territory in Normandy and is usually referred to as Count of Meulan. He was a leading political figure in the reigns of William II and Henry I and on the death of one Ives de Grandmesnil in the First Crusade, the funds for campaigning in which Ives had raised from Robert on the security of his estates, [Robert] came into full possession of them, including a sizeable part of Leicester. The rest of the town was granted him by Henry I and it is possible that he became Earl of Leicester. His son, another Robert, certainly called himself Earl of Leicester.

----------------------------

EARLDOM OF LEICESTER (II) 1118

ROBERT (a), EARL OF LEICESTER, younger son, being twin with Waleran, who succeeded his father as Count of Meulan, was born 1104, and was commonly called Le Bossu or Le Goczen. He
styles himself Earl of Leicester in the confirmation of his charter on behalf of Bec and St. Nicaise-de-Meulan in 1119. He and his brother Waleran were brought up at the court of Henry I with great care on account of the King's gratitude to their father. They accompanied Henry when he interviewed Pope Calixtus at Gisors, November 1119 where they astonished the Cardinals by their learning. On 8 September 1131 Robert was one of the five Earls who witnessed Henry's charter to Salisbury at the Northampton Council, and both the brothers were present at the deathbed of Henry L In the anarchy which followed Stephen's accession he engaged in private warfare with his hereditary enemy, Roger de Tosny, whom he captured with the assistance of his brother Waleran. In 1137 the twins returned to England with Stephen. Meanwhile, during Robert's absence in England, his possessions in Normandy were overrun until he came to terms with Roger de Tosny. In June 1139 the two brothers took a leading part in the seizing of the Bishops o! Salisbury and Lincoln at Oxford. At about this time he received from Stephen a grant to him as Earl of Leicester and to his heirs of the town and castle of Hereford "et totum comitatum de Herefordisc.," excepting the lands of the Bishop, those of the Abbot of Reading and of other churches and abbeys holding in chief of the King, and excepting also the fees of Hugh de Mortemer, Osbert son of Hugh, and others, "cum aliis omnibus rebus et libertatibus quae ad omnia prefata pertinent cum quibus Gul. filius Osbern unquam melius vel liberius tenuit." This grant was made at Newton (probably near Leominster) at a time when Miles of Gloucester had already taken possession of the county for the Empress, and therefore cannot have been effectual to bestow either the lands or the Earldom of Hereford, if such was Stephen's intention. After the defeat of Stephen, 2 Feb. 1141, Robert appears to have made a truce with the Angevin party in Normandy until he should return from England, and devoted himself to his foundation of St. Mary de Pré at Leicester, which was accomplished in 1143. According to the narrative of St. Mary's, he became a canon regular there circa 1153, and so remained until his death, but the story conflicts with his known public career. In that year Henry, son of the Empress, anticipating his succession to the throne (which was agreed by the Treaty of Waningford in November 1153), gave Robert and his son Robert charters, dated at Bristol, "restoring" to them the lands then held by the elder, Robert, and granting them the Stewardship of England and of Normandy, whereby he doubtless secured their support of his claims to the crown. Robert was at the siege of Torigny in October 1154 with Henry II just before his accession, attended his Coronation in December 1154, and rapidly rose in the new King's favour. He received a confirmation charter of the grant made at Bristol and thus became Steward of England and of Nor:mandy. He was made Justiciar in the following year, and he acted as Viccroy part of the time with Richard de Luci during the King's absence from England from December 1158, after Eleanor left the country until his rcturn 25 January 1162/3. He was present at the Council of Clarendon, 13-28 January 1163/4, and was the first to attest the "Constitutions," to which he procured the assent of Thomas à Becket. He took part with the Crown in its struggle with Becket, but sought to reconcile the King and the Archbishop at the Council of Northampton in October 1164. As Justiciar he pronounced sentence on the Archbishop, who cut short his address by denying the jurisdiction of the court. In 1165 he again acted as Viceroy on the King's departure. In the spring of 1166 he went to Normandy with the King, but was in England again in October, and retained the Justiciarship until his death two years later.

He married, after November 1120, Amice, daughter of Ralph, SEIGNEUR OF GAEL AND MONTFORT in Brittany, who was son of Ralph, EARL OF NORFOLK, by Emma, daughter of William FITZOSBERN, 1st Earl of Hereford. By this marriage he acquired a large part of the FitzOsbern inheritance in Normandy and England. He died 5 April 1168, and was probably buried in St. Mary de Pré. Amice survived him, and is said to have entered the convent of Nuneaton. [Complete Peerage VII:527-30, XIV:429, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

[a] It has become the established usage to apply the name of Beaumont to the Earls of Leicester of the first line. Though doubtless a convenient form of nomenclature, it lacks contemporary authority. Roger, Seigneur of Beaumont-le-Roger, the contemporary of the Conqueror, is called Roger de Beaumont with good reason. Orderic speaks of his younger brother Robert as Robert de Beaumont, but in doing so is clearly transferring to him the style borne later by Roger, for Robert always appears in charters as Robertus flius Humphredi. Robert, son of Roger, was also styled de Beaumont until he became Count of Meulan, but his son Robert, 2nd Earl of Leicester, is never so styled. In the next generation the question does not arise, for there were no younger sons. In the last generation of these Earls, William, the eldest brother (who d. vp), is in charters always William de Bréteuil, and Robert, before he succeeded as Earl, figures as Robert de Bréteuil in two charters, and is also so styled in the Chron. de Mailros. There was no reason why this branch of the family should take its style from a place in which it had no interest. Hugh (said to have become Earl of Bedford), younger brother of Robert and Waleran, witnesses a charter circa 1123-38 as Hugone de Mellent. With respect to the elder branch, those who were not themselves Counts were called de Mellento, and this though the caput of their Norman honour was Beaumont, and this endured as the name of two branches of the family after the loss of the comti of Meulan.

Robert married Amice De MONTFORT 1774,1775 after November 1120 in Brittany, France 1774.,1775 Amice was born about 1108 in Breal-Sous-Montfort, Ille-Et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France and died after 1168 in Convent Of Nuneaton, Warwickshire, England (As A Nun) 1775.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194419       i.  Margaret De BEAUMONT (born in 1125 in Leicestershire, England - died after 1185)

               ii.  Isabel De BEAUMONT was born about 1126 in Leicestershire, England and died after May 1188 1776.

              iii.  Hawise De BEAUMONT was born in 1129 in Leicestershire, England and died on 24 April 1197 1710 at age 68.

               iv.  Robert III De BEAUMONT 3rd Earl Of Leicester was born before 1135 in Leicester Castle, Leicestershire, England 1777 and died on 31 August 1190 in Durazzo, Greece (Went On Crusade 1179) 1777,1778,1779. Another name for Robert was 3rd Earl Of LEICESTER Robert De Beaumont.


8044388839. Amice De MONTFORT,415,1774,1775 daughter of Ralph Seigneur De Gael De MONTFORD and Emma (Avice) De VERMANDOIS, was born about 1108 in Breal-Sous-Montfort, Ille-Et-Vilaine, Bretagne, France and died after 1168 in Convent Of Nuneaton, Warwickshire, England (As A Nun) 1775.

General Notes: He [Robert Earl of Leicester] married, after November 1120, Amice, daughter of Ralph, SEIGNEUR OF GAEL AND MONTFORT in Brittany, who was son of Ralph, EARL OF NORFOLK, by Emma, daughter of William FITZOSBERN, 1st Earl of Hereford. By this marriage he acquired a large part of the FitzOsbern inheritance in Normandy and England. He died 5 April 1168, and was probably buried in St. Mary de Pré. Amice survived him, and is said to have entered the convent of Nuneaton. [Complete Peerage VII:527-30, XIV:429, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Amice married Robert II De BEAUMONT 2nd Earl Of Leicester 1376,1774,1775 after November 1120 in Brittany, France 1774.,1775 Robert was born in 1104 in Pont Audemer, Eure, Normandy, France,1774,1775 died on 5 April 1168 in Leicester Castle, Leicestershire, England 1774,1775 at age 64, and was buried in St Mary DE Pre Priory, St Albans, Hertfordshire, England. Another name for Robert was 2nd Earl Of LEICESTER Robert De Beaumont.

8044388848. Richard De CAMVILLE Of Charlton Camvill,415,801,1780 son of Gerard De CAMVILLE Of Charlton Camvill and Alice De VERE, was born about 1092 in Charlton Camvill, Somerset, England and died after 1170 802.

General Notes: I have added this Richard because Turton states that Richard Camville who m. Millicent was son of Richard, son of Gerald. Many reliable people, including Dave Utzinger (based on other sources), have the same pedigree. I did not originally have this Richard, but had the Richard who m. Millicent as son of Gerald, with his (now) brother Gerald being his son. The dates seemed to work out much better before, but I guess one must follow the sources.

The fact that Millicent had a son "b. bef. 1133" by her first marriage to Roger Marmion, pretty much locks her into a 1116/18 birth year, which implies an 1116/20 birth year for Richard her 2nd husband. Since Gerald is an elder brother of Richard, he has to be born by 1118 at the latest, and he didn't die until 1214 (now at the ripe old age of 96!), with most of his children being born late in his life. For example Gerald's daughter Nichole m. Oliver Deincourt, who was born about 1196 (marriage & date according to CP). This would mean that Nichole was born, say 1198, when her father was 80 years old. Not likely.

--------------------

The following post to SGM, 31 May 2000, by Christopher Nash, seems to support the way that I have the pedigree, with Gerald - husband of Nichola de la Haye, being son of Richard - husband of Millicent, rather than being an elder brother. Gerald - husband of Nichola de la Haye, was elder brother of another Richard living 1196/8, who was previously unkown:

From: Cristopher Nash (c@windsong.u-net.com)
Subject: Re: Which Richard de Camville married Millicent?
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
Date: 2000/05/31

dekester@mindspring.com wrote on 31 May --

Dexter, thanks a lot for your extremely gracious response to my last, which I feared you might take as 'lecturely' (which I've certainly no right to be)! I'd just like to weigh in on your side here against my own asperity (these are especially late nights for me). There's no question about it - even the same texts give conflicting information. I've had a quick look at the VCH (Berks) articles I suggested might help affecting this line - viz. vol IV, the articles on Benham and Avington, and they do appear to disagree. Here's what I mean - and what I think may be happening:

First of all, VCH (Oxon), VI, 244, has Gerard who m. Nicolaa de la Haye as the s. of Richard who d. 1176-77. Now VCH (Berks, Behnham article), IV, 104, seems to say the same - calling Gerard the elder bro of Richard who (d. 1191).

But in the VCH (Berks) _Avington_ article (IV, 158), the same Gerard (who m. Nicolaa de la Haye) is given as s. of Richard who d. 1191 at the seige of Acre (though this Richard is perhaps problematically described as the Richard holding Avington in 1166-7, when we might speculate that the Richard referred to here may be Richard who d. 1176-77).

What I think is telling are the phrasing and details of the _Benham_ article: Richard (d. 1191) is "succeeded by his son John....The lands [of Benham] still appear, however, in his [Richard's] name in 1196-7 and 1198, and no inquisition was held as to his death until the reign of Henry III. John died without issue, and the manor was seized by his uncle Gerard, Richard's elder brother."

This apparent anomaly, pointed up by VCH - that is, that the lands of 'Richard' 'still appear' in his name 5-7 years after his death (which does happen) - combined with the fact that the matter is not legally articulated until at least 25 years after his death (Hen. III begins 1216) - suggests to me the equal possibility that another Richard, perhaps s. of Richard (d. 1191) was actually in possession after 1191, and is the Richard referred to in the I.p.m., and is the younger bro of Gerard. This would make Gerard the s. and not the brother of Richard (d. 1191). As you can see, I'm playing devil's advocate here (giving the counter-argument a chance, as in It's a rotten job but s/body's gotta do it).

This would coincide with part (and conflict with none) of the account I mentioned in my last. It would suit Ivor West's sequence - though I'm less worried than he is about the suggestion that Richard II [d. 1191] at 70ish would still seem to be too old for the governorship of Cyprus. (John of Brienne when 'a penniless knight and younger son' (as Runciman says) was made King of Jerusalem at over 60, and regent of the Empire of Constantinople, though long-since ejected from Jerusalem and out of a job, at nearly 80.)

We need to notice, though, that one apparent candidate for this 'later Richard de Camville' -- viz. Richard who d. soon after February 1217 (according to JFW Hill, _Medieval Lincoln_ [1948], 89) and married Eustachia Basset (of whom more is known) -- is not a son of a Richard but of Gerard and Nicolaa de Camville. And there seems no way of treating their son Richard as the Richard of 1196-8 indicated above, since in this line his father Gerard would presumably be the individual taking possession of Benham (as he indeed did of Middleton Stoney and Godington) on the death of Richard who d. 1191.

Unfortunately it's very difficult to determine sequence/parentage here by means of chronology (i.e. via speculations as to undocumented birthdates, particularly where - as is most common - it's only when careers are established that individuals enter documentary history) and certainly without closer study than I've given it. Gerard is sheriff of Lincs by 1189 and thus could be son of either Richard de Camville who d. 1176-7 or Richard who d. 1191.

To me a key document needing examination, then, is the inquiry post mortem of Henry III. This is given in the Benham article (IV, 104) as: Chan. Inq. p. m. Incert. temp. Hen. III no. 57. Does it positively state that Richard who d. (at Acre) in 1191 is the Richard in whose name Benham still appears in 1196-8? Or does it simply say that Benham was held by an unspecified Richard de Camville during those years? (E.g. merely -- as is common (and unhelpful here) -- 'Richard de Camville was seised of Benham' etc.)? I'll try to get a squint at it the next time I'm in the Bodleian, though this'll have to be after the current univ. exam throes.

On balance - largely because of not only the general shift of weight among the various readings we've been looking at but because of the earliness of the heavy activity of e.g. Gerard and Nicolaa (an extraordinary figure) - I feel that the Richard (d. 1176-7)->Richard (d.1191) sequence I quoted in my last may prove most reliable, that Gerard's going to come out as s. of Richard (d. 1176-7), and you're going to be left with the post-1191 Richard issue to play with as you like.

I think, by the way, that Doug Richardson's suggestions are right, here, and helpful. As is his query about the date for Isabel.

I've the strong feeling that, not being in the swing of this problem, I'm leaving out considerations you've prowled through at some length, so forgive me for jumping in. But you've got uz really interested now - and I do feel that the need to look at the records draws nigh (!) Meantime, do give us a sense of what you feel in scanning these off-the-top thoughts! And thanks again for listening with such an open spirit. Are you _sure_ you're a <relative newcomer>?

Cheers,

Cris

Noted events in his life were:

• Alt. Death: Alt. Death, Between 1176 and 1177. 801

Richard married.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194424       i.  Richard De CAMVILLE Of Lilbourne & Stanton (born about 1116 in Lilbourne Castle, Creek, Northamptonshire, England - died in June 1191 at Siege Of Acre, Palestine)


8044388850. Gervase Comte De RETHEL Archdeacon Of Reims,415,1781,1782,1783 son of Hugh I Comte De RETHEL and Melisende De MONTLHERY, was born about 1090 in Rethel, Ardennes, Champagne-Ardenne, France and died in 1124 in Reims, Marne, Champagne, France 1781,1783 about age 34.

Gervase married Elizabeth De NAMUR 1781,1783 in 1st Husband.1783 Elizabeth was born about 1092 in Namur, Belgium and died after 1141 1784.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Elizabeth De RETHEL was born about 1110 in Rethel, Ardennes, Champagne, France.

4022194425      ii.  Millicent De Stanton De RETHEL (born about 1116 in Reims, Marne, Champagne, France - died after 1152 in Stanton (Harcourt), Oxfordshire, England)


8044388851. Elizabeth De NAMUR,415,670,1781,1783 daughter of Godfrey Comte De NAMUR and Sibylle De CHATEAU-PORCIEN, was born about 1092 in Namur, Belgium and died after 1141 1784.

Elizabeth married Gervase Comte De RETHEL Archdeacon Of Reims 1781,1782,1783 in 1st Husband.1783 Gervase was born about 1090 in Rethel, Ardennes, Champagne-Ardenne, France and died in 1124 in Reims, Marne, Champagne, France 1781,1783 about age 34.

Elizabeth next married Clarembald De ROSOY after 1124 in 2ND Husband. Clarembald was born about 1090 in Chateau-Porcien, Ardennes, Champagne-Ardenne, France and died in 1158 about age 68.


8044388852. Robert De LA HAYE Of Halnaker,415,1620,1785 son of Ralph De LA HAYE Of Halnaker and Oliva D' AUBIGNY, was born about 1080 in Halnaker, Sussex, England and died between 1134 and 1135 about age 54.

General Notes: Since the wife of Robert de la Haie was named Muriel and they were the parents of Cecily, Roger de St. John's wife. [Complete Peerage]

Robert married Muriel Of LINCOLN Heiress Of Brattleby 1620.,1786 Muriel was born about 1085 in Brattleby, Lincolnshire, England.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Cecily De LA HAYE Heiress Of Halnaker was born about 1102 in Halnaker, Sussex, England and died after 1162 1620.

4022194426      ii.  Richard De LA HAYE Of Brattleby (born about 1120 in Brattleby, Lincolnshire, England - died in 1186)


8044388853. Muriel Of LINCOLN Heiress Of Brattleby,415,1620,1786 daughter of Colswegen Of LINCOLN Of Brattleby and Muriel CHAPELLE, was born about 1085 in Brattleby, Lincolnshire, England.

General Notes: Since the wife of Robert de la Haie was named Muriel and they were the parents of Cecily, Roger de St. John's wife. [Complete Peerage]

Muriel married Robert De LA HAYE Of Halnaker 1620.,1785 Robert was born about 1080 in Halnaker, Sussex, England and died between 1134 and 1135 about age 54.

8044388854. William De VERNON Lord Of Shipbrook,415,1460,1787 son of Richard Seigneur De REVIERS and Adelise PEVEREL, was born about 1095 in Shipbrook, Northwich, Cheshire, England and died about 1174 about age 79.

General Notes: William de Vernon [2nd son of Richard]; great grandfather of [Richard de Vernon who married Avice in 1171]. [Burke's Peerage]

William married Lucy De TANKERVILLE. Lucy was born about 1090 in Tancarville, Le Havre, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France and died about 1165 about age 75. Another name for Lucy was Lucy De TANCARVILLE.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Hugh De VERNON Lord Of Shipbrook was born about 1113 in Shipbrook, Northwich, Cheshire, England.

4022194427      ii.  Maud De VERNON (born about 1125 in Shipbrook, Northwich, Cheshire, England - died after 1185)


8044388855. Lucy De TANKERVILLE,415 daughter of Guillaume Seigneur De TANCARVILLE and Maud D' ARQUES, was born about 1090 in Tancarville, Le Havre, Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France and died about 1165 about age 75. Another name for Lucy was Lucy De TANCARVILLE.

Lucy married William De VERNON Lord Of Shipbrook 1460.,1787 William was born about 1095 in Shipbrook, Northwich, Cheshire, England and died about 1174 about age 79.

8044388856. Gilbert BASSET Of Wallingford,415,773 son of Thomas BASSET Of Wallingford and Unknown, was born about 1103 in Wallingford, Berkshire, England and died in 1166 773 about age 63.

Gilbert married Edith D' OYLY 773 in 2ND Husband.773 Edith was born about 1105 in Hook Norton, Oxfordshire, England and died in 1165 about age 60. Another name for Edith was Edith D' OILLY.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Joan BASSET was born about 1122 in Wellingford, Oxfordshire, England.

4022194428      ii.  Thomas BASSET Of Headington (born before 1130 in Wellingford, Oxfordshire, England - died in 1182 in Headington, Oxfordshire, England)


8044388857. Edith D' OYLY,415,773 daughter of Robert II D' OYLY Lord Of Hooknorton and Edith FITZFORNE Baroness Of Greystoke, was born about 1105 in Hook Norton, Oxfordshire, England and died in 1165 about age 60. Another name for Edith was Edith D' OILLY.

Edith married Gilbert BASSET Of Wallingford 773 in 2ND Husband.773 Gilbert was born about 1103 in Wallingford, Berkshire, England and died in 1166 773 about age 63.

8044388858. Alan De DUNSTANVILLE Of Nyetimber & Colyton,415,1788 son of Reginald De DUNSTANVILLE Of Winterburn and Gundreda, was born about 1120 in Colyton, Axminster, Devonshire, England and died before 1157 in Nyetimber, Pagham, Sussex, England 1789.

General Notes: John Ravilious proposes the pedigree, which I am adopting, for Alan Dunstanville, which has Adeliza de Insula (de Lisle) as grandmother and Reginald & Gundreda as his parents. Others on SGM had discussed Adeliza de Lisle as being mother of Alan.

In discussions on SGM, it was proven that this line had nothing to do with Reynold de Dunstanville, Earl of Cornwall, but was descended from William de Warenne. I originally had Alan as son of the Earl of Cornwall by Adelina de Lisle.

Alan married Isabel. Isabel was born about 1120 in England.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194429       i.  Adeliza (Alice) De DUNSTANVILLE (born about 1137 in Shiplake, Oxfordshire, England - died after 1184)

               ii.  Cecilia De DUNSTANVILLE Heiress Of Tehidy was born about 1154 in Tehidy, Cornwall, England.

              iii.  William De DUNSTANVILLE Lord Of Tehidy was born about 1155 in Tehidy, Cornwall, England.


8044388859. Isabel 415 was born about 1120 in England.

Isabel married Alan De DUNSTANVILLE Of Nyetimber & Colyton.1788 Alan was born about 1120 in Colyton, Axminster, Devonshire, England and died before 1157 in Nyetimber, Pagham, Sussex, England 1789.

8044388860. Renaud I Sire De COURTENAY Of Sutton,415,670,1463,1790,1791 son of Miles (Milo) Sire De COURTENAY and Ermengarde De NEVERS, was born about 1100 in Courtenay, Loiret, Gatinais/Centre, France and died in 1161 in Sutton Courtenay, Berkshire, England 1790,1791 about age 61.

General Notes: Renaud de Courtenay, Lord of Courtenay; accompanied Louis VII of France on the Second Crusade but quarreled with him so that Louis seized his French possessions and bestowed them, with Renaud's daughter (Elizabeth) in marriage, on his (Louis') own younger brother Pierre; Renaud subsequently threw in his lot with the English kings and was granted the Lordship of Sutton (now Sutton Courtenay), on the Berks-Oxon borders by Henry II 1161; accompanied Henry II to Wexford in the Irish expedition of 1172; married 1st Hedwige (living 1148-58), sister of Guy du Donjon; married 2nd Maud, Dame du Sap (dsp 1224), daughter of Robert Fitz Roy (illegitimate son of Henry I of England) by his wife Maud d'Avranches. [Burke's Peerage]

Note: The chart in CP IV:317 agrees with BP above (with Renaud having Reginald, d. 1194, by the sister of Guy du Donjon). However I consider there to be two Renaud de Courtenay's: Renaud I married Hedwige du Donjon and his son, Renaud II married 1st Hawise Deincourt (by whom they had Reginald, d. 1194) and 2nd Maud du Sap (dsp 1224). I believe that chronologically it works much better, and solves many of the admitted problems with the line given by CP and BP. There is evidence of two different Renaud de Courtenays, one who died 1161, and one who 1190 (AR) or 1192 (BP).

---------------------------------------------------

of Sutton, Berkshire, England; Sire de Courtenay; exiled 1150. [Roderick W. Stuart, Royalty for Commoners, 3rd ed., Genealogical Publishing Company, Baltimore MD, 1998]

----------------------------------------------------

The story is told that the great possesions in France of Renaud de Courtenay (a man of high social rank and described in personal terms as in effect a glorified bandit) were seized abt 1150 by King Louis VII who granted them to his own youngest brother, Pierre (ancestor of the French Courtenays), with Renaud's daughter, Elizabeth, in marriage, and that Renaud then appeared in England as a minor functionary of the English Court with a small manor and another family. [Ancestral Roots, Frederick Weis, line 138]

Ancestral Roots also discounts Renaud II being the son of Milo (ie. Renaud I and Renaud II in my genalogy, which AR seems to consider the same person) because of dates and social standings, but does not seem to address the possibility of a Reginald [d. 1194 - line 138-25), son of Renaud II (d. 1190 - line 138-24), son of Renaud I (d. 1161 - line 107-24), son of Milo [d. 1127 - line 107-23).

Since according to Burke, Elizabeth's marriage was 1150, Renaud lost his French lands and went to England on or about 1150. His children were born in France, while he still had possession of his French estates.

Renaud married Hedwige Du DONJON 1463,1790,1791 before 1127. Hedwige was born about 1110 in Donjon Castle, Corbeil, Yerre-Sur-Oise, France and died after 1158 1463.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194430       i.  Renaud II Sire De COURTENAY Of Sutton (born about 1125 in Courtenay, Loiret, Gatinais/Centre, France - died before December 1190 in Sutton Courtenay, Berkshire, England)

               ii.  Elizabeth De COURTENAY was born about 1130 in Courtenay, Loiret, Gatinais/Centre, France and died on 14 September 1205 1463 about age 75.

              iii.  Gervase De COURTENAY Of Wollacombe was born about 1135 in Courtenay, Loiret, Gatinais/Centre, France and died in Wollacombe Manor, Bradninch, Devonshire, England.


8044388861. Hedwige Du DONJON,415,670,1463,1790,1791 daughter of Frederick Sire De DONJON and Unknown, was born about 1110 in Donjon Castle, Corbeil, Yerre-Sur-Oise, France and died after 1158 1463.

Hedwige married Renaud I Sire De COURTENAY Of Sutton 1463,1790,1791 before 1127. Renaud was born about 1100 in Courtenay, Loiret, Gatinais/Centre, France and died in 1161 in Sutton Courtenay, Berkshire, England 1790,1791 about age 61.

8044388862. William DEINCOURT,415 son of Ralph DEINCOURT 2nd Lord D'eyncourt and Basilie, was born about 1105 in Blankney, Lincolnshire, England and died in 1162 in Devonshire, England about age 57.

William married.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194431       i.  Hawise DEINCOURT (born about 1135 in Blankney, Lincolnshire, England - died in Ford Abbey, Devonshire, England)


8044389376. Mauger II Le VAVASOUR Of Barnby, Sir,415,425,1792 son of Sir Mauger I le VAVASOUR of Barnby and Unknown, was born in 1084 in Barnby-upon-Don, Doncaster, West Riding, Yorkshire, England and died in 1135 in Edlington, Doncaster, West Riding, Yorkshire, England 1793 at age 51.

General Notes: Mauger (I?), tenant in Yorks 1086 of among others William de Percy; either this Mauger (I?) or another person of the same name (Mauger (II?)), possibly Mauger I?)'s son, witnessed a charter of Alan de Percy temp. Henry I; had [a son or daughter], with a younger son [Robert]. [Burke's Peerage]

Mauger married.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194688       i.  Mauger III Le VAVASOUR Of Hazlewood, Sir (born about 1106 in Edlington, Doncaster, West Riding, Yorkshire, England - died in 1166 in Hazlewood And Storiths, Skipton, Yorkshire, England)


8044389384. Lambert De MULTON 415,505,1794 was born before 1121 in Revesby, Horncastle, Lincolnshire, England,1794 died after 1166 in Moulton, Spalding, Lincolnshire, England 1794, and was buried in Spalding Priory, Lincolnshire, England.

General Notes: MULTON OF EGREMONT or EGREMOND

This family derived its name from Moulton, near Spalding, in Lincolnshire,

LAMBERT DE MULTON, its earliest recorded ancestor, descended at least on one side from English thegns. In 1142 or 1143 he held 2 carucates of land in Revesby of William (de Roumare), Earl of Lincoln, by the service of 1/4 knight's fee, as grandson (and heir) of Brictive, and an oxgang of land under Robert, his wife's father. For these lands the Earl gave him an exchange in Miningsby, near Bolingbroke, and in or before 1155 granted to Spalding Priory Lambert's service for the land in Miningsby. Lambert held land in Moulton from the prior's manor of Spalding, 1/2 knight's fee of the new feoffment in Bourne of the Earl of Lincoln, a lordship in Frankton, land in Weston, and land in Skirbeck and Kirkton from Conan, Earl of Richmond, whose charter to Kirkstead Abbey he witnessed at "Wasingburg." Between 1154 and 1156 he witnessed a charter of Gilbert (de Gand), Earl of Lincoln, to the Dean and Chapter of Lincoln. In 1165 he rendered account in Lincs of an amercement of 100 marks, and in the following year Thomas, his son, accounted for him.

He married a daughter of Robert (----), presumably of Norman blood, possibly Robert BRIWER. He was living in 1166, but the date of his death is not known. He was buried in Spalding Priory. [Complete Peerage IX:396-8, XIV:493, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger}]

Lambert married Miss De BRIWERE.1795 Miss was born about 1140 in England.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194692       i.  Thomas I De MULTON (born about 1158 in Moulton, Spalding, Lincolnshire, England - died before 1201)

               ii.  Hawise (Alice) De MULTON was born about 1166 in Moulton, Spalding, Lincolnshire, England. Another name for Hawise was Alice (Hawise) De MULETON.


8044389385. Miss De BRIWERE 415,505,1795 was born about 1140 in England.

Miss married Lambert De MULTON.1794 Lambert was born before 1121 in Revesby, Horncastle, Lincolnshire, England,1794 died after 1166 in Moulton, Spalding, Lincolnshire, England 1794, and was buried in Spalding Priory, Lincolnshire, England.

8044389388. Josce De FLETE 415,505,1138 was born about 1125 in Fleet, Holbeach, Lincolnshire, England.

Josce married.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194694       i.  Richard De FLETE (born about 1150 in Fleet, Holbeach, Lincolnshire, England)


8044389408. Henry Le WALEYS Of Skellow & Burghwallis 415,1796 was born before 1133 in Skellow, Doncaster, West Riding Yorkshire, England 1796 and died before 1179 in Burgh Wallis, Doncaster, West Riding Yorkshire, England 1796. Another name for Henry was Henry WALLENSIS Of Skellow & Burghwallis.

General Notes: HENRY WALLENSIS (le Waleys), who in 1154-58 witnessed a charter of Henry de Lacy, is the earliest member of this family of whom there is definite evidence. In 1166 he held 3 knights' fees of the Honor of Pontefract of Henry de Lacy and ½ knight's fee of Guy de la Val, who was a tenant of the same Honor (b).

He married Agnes and died possibly before 1179 and certainly before 1185. His widow married Hervey DE LEDSTONE, whom she survived, and was living cirea 1220. [Complete Peerage XII/2:317, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

(b) 3 knights fees were held by Henry le Waleys in 1242, and the land can be identified as those in Burghwallis, Skellow, and Sutton in Campsall, Yorks, held by Sir John Depeden in 1401-2. In 1170 Henry is called 'Henry Waleis of Burg', indicating his connection with Burghwallis at this date. The Waleys interest in these lands may have come from the marriage of Henry or his father with a daughter and coheir of one of the Poitevin family, whose ancestor, William, held Burghwallis of the Lacys at the time of Domesday Book. That Burghwallis descended to coheirs is deduced from the fact that Richard le Waleys presented to this living in 1252 with the assent of others, his co-patrons. It has been said that Denis, daughter and coheir of Robert the Poitevin, was mother of Richard le Waleys (d. 1256-72), but this is incorrect; others allege that Denise m. Robert le Waleys (d. circa 1218), but this does not explain the Waleys interest in Burghwallis in the middle of the 12th century.

Note: I have Denis m. to Robert le Waleys, d. c1218.

Henry married Agnes 1796 in 1st Husband.1796 Agnes was born about 1135 in England and died after 1220 1796.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Miss WALLENSIS was born about 1153 in Burgh Wallis, Doncaster, West Riding Yorkshire, England and was buried in Speculative Link To Parents.

4022194704      ii.  Robert Le WALEYS Of Skellow & Burghwallis (born before 1158 in Skellow, Doncaster, West Riding Yorkshire, England - died about 1218 in Burgh Wallis, Doncaster, West Riding Yorkshire, England)


8044389409. Agnes 415,1796 was born about 1135 in England and died after 1220 1796.

General Notes: He [Henry Wallensis/le Waleys] married Agnes and died possibly before 1179 and certainly before 1185. His widow married Hervey DE LEDSTONE, whom she survived, and was living cirea 1220. [Complete Peerage XII/2:317, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Agnes married Henry Le WALEYS Of Skellow & Burghwallis 1796 in 1st Husband.1796 Henry was born before 1133 in Skellow, Doncaster, West Riding Yorkshire, England 1796 and died before 1179 in Burgh Wallis, Doncaster, West Riding Yorkshire, England 1796. Another name for Henry was Henry WALLENSIS Of Skellow & Burghwallis.

Agnes next married Hervey De LEDSTONE 1796 after 1179 in 2ND Husband.1796 Hervey was born about 1140 in Ledstone, Tadcaster, West Riding Yorkshire, England and died before 1220 1796.


8044389410. Robert The POITEVIN Of Burghwallis 415,1470 was born about 1143 in Poitou, France and died in Burgh Wallis, Doncaster, West Riding Yorkshire, England. Another name for Robert was Robert POYNTTEE.

Robert married.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194705       i.  Dionisia POITEVIN (born in 1162 in Burgh Wallis, Doncaster, West Riding Yorkshire, England)

               ii.  Miss POYNTTEE was born about 1183 in Burgh Wallis, Doncaster, West Riding Yorkshire, England. Another name for Miss was Miss POITEVIN.


8044389416. William FITZGODRIC Of Sprotborough, Sir 505,1797 was born about 1140 in Hopton, Emley, Yorkshire, England 1797 and died before 1194 in Sprotbrough, Doncaster, Yorkshire, England 1797. Another name for William was William FITZWILLIAM.

General Notes: William son of Godric was probably born about 1140; he occurs in the Pipe Rolls from 1169-70 to 1179-80, and was dead in 1194. He married, probably about 1169-70, as her third husband, Aubrey, daughter and heir of Robert de Lisours (son of Fulk de Lisours, the Domesday tenant of Sprotborough and other West Riding manors under Roger de Busli), who married, about 1129-30, Aubrey, daughter of Robert de Lacy, lord of Pontefract, and in her issue heir of the great Lacy estates on the death of Robert de Lacy II, 1193-4. Aubrey de Lisours was therefore a great heiress through both parents. She married (1) Robert FitzEustace, c 1150, by whom she had issue John the Constable of Chester (died 1190, from whom the 2nd house of Lacy descended); (2) William de Clairfait, c 1167; and (3) William FitzGodric, c 1169-70. [Complete Peerage V:518 Note]

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Sir William Fitz-William, lord of Elmley and Sprotborough, m. Albreda, dau. and heir of Robert de Lizures, widow of Richard Fitz-Eustace, constable of Chester, and sister of the half blood to Robert de Laci, Baron of Pontefract, and had issue, a dau. Donatia, to whom her other gave lands in Crowle, with a son, Sir William Fitz-William, his successor. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 215, Fitz-William, Baron Fitz-William]

William married Albreda "Aubrye" De LISOURES 1797,1799 about 1169 in 3rd Husband.1798 Albreda was born about 1130 in Sprotbrough, Doncaster, Yorkshire, England and died after 21 April 1194 in Halton Castle, Runcorn, Cheshire, England 1800.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Miss FITZWILLIAM was born about 1170 in Sprotbrough, Doncaster, Yorkshire, England.

4022194708      ii.  William FITZWILLIAM Of Sprotborough, Sir Knight (born about 1173 in Sprotbrough, Doncaster, Yorkshire, England - died after 9 February 1218-1219)


8044389417. Albreda "Aubrye" De LISOURES 415,505,1797,1799 was born about 1130 in Sprotbrough, Doncaster, Yorkshire, England and died after 21 April 1194 in Halton Castle, Runcorn, Cheshire, England 1800.

General Notes: He [William FitzGodric] married, probably about 1169-70, as her third husband, Aubrey, daughter and heir of Robert de Lisours (son of Fulk de Lisours, the Domesday tenant of Sprotborough and other West Riding manors under Roger de Busli), who married, about 1129-30, Aubrey, daughter of Robert de Lacy, lord of Pontefract, and in her issue heir of the great Lacy estates on the death of Robert de Lacy II, 1193-4. Aubrey de Lisours was therefore a great heiress through both parents. She married (1) Robert FitzEustace, c 1150, by whom she had issue John the Constable of Chester (died 1190, from whom the 2nd house of Lacy descended); (2) William de Clairfait, c 1167; and (3) William FitzGodric, c 1169-70. [Complete Peerage V:518 Note]

Albreda married Richard Fitzeustace Lord Of CLAVERING & Halton,1801,1802 son of Eustace FITZJOHN Of Alnwick, Constable Cheshire and Agnes FITZNEEL, about 1150.1798 Richard was born about 1116 in Halton Castle, Runcorn, Cheshire, England and died before 1163 in Halton Castle, Runcorn, Cheshire, England 1803. Another name for Richard was Richard FITZEUSTACE Lord Of Clavering & Halton.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  John Fitzrichard De LACY Constable Of Chester was born about 1150 in Halton Castle, Runcorn, Cheshire, England and died on 11 October 1190 in Tyre, Palestine 1798 about age 40.

               ii.  Sara (Mary) FITZEUSTACE was born about 1150 in Halton Castle, Runcorn, Cheshire, England and died in 1185 in Aldford, Chester, Cheshire, England about age 35.

              iii.  Aubrey (Albreda) FITZEUSTACE was born about 1158 in Halton Castle, Runcorn, Cheshire, England and died before 1199. Another name for Aubrey was Aubrey FITZRICHARD.

Albreda next married William De CLAIRFAIT 1798 about 1167 in 2ND Husband.1798 William was born about 1130 in England and died before 1169 1798.

Albreda next married William FITZGODRIC Of Sprotborough, Sir 1797 about 1169 in 3rd Husband.1798 William was born about 1140 in Hopton, Emley, Yorkshire, England 1797 and died before 1194 in Sprotbrough, Doncaster, Yorkshire, England 1797. Another name for William was William FITZWILLIAM.


8044389418. Hamelin PLANTAGENET 5th Earl Of Surrey,415,505,642,670,968,1442,1804 son of Geoffrey V "Le Bon"The Fair PLANTAGENET Count Of Anjou And Maine and Adelaide Of ANGERS, was born about 1130 in Normandy, France,389,390,1440 died on 7 May 1202 in Lewes, Sussex, England 389,390,1011,1441,1442 about age 72, and was buried on 7 May 1202 in Chapter House, Lewes, Sussex, England.389,390 Other names for Hamelin were 05th Earl Of SURREY Hamel Plantagenet, and Hamelin De WARENNE 5th Earl Of Surrey.1443

General Notes:
Hamelin (bastard son of Geoffrey Plantagenet). [Magna Charta Sureties]

---------------------------------------------------------------

EARLDOM OF SURREY (V) 1164

HAMELIN illegitimate son of GEOFFREY V, styled "PLANTAGENET," COUNT OF ANJOU, TOURAINE and MAINE, sometime DUKE OF NORMANDY, by an unknown woman, held lands in Touraine, presumably the gift of his half-brother Henry II, and appears to have been styled vicomte of Touraine. He became EARL OF SURREY in consequence of his marriage to the Countess Isabel in 1164; in which year he attended the Council of Northampton. In 1166 he returned his carta, as holding 60 knights' fees. He supported the King against his rebellious sons in 1173; and in 1176 he was one of the nobles who escorted Henry's daughter Joan for her marriage to the King of Sicily. He was present at the 1st Coronation of Richard I, 3 September 1189. In the King's absence he supported the Chancellor against John; in 1193 he was one of the Treasurers for the King's ransom; and in 1194 he was at the Council of Nottingham. At Richard's 2nd Coronation, 17 April 1194, he bore one of the 3 swords; and he was present at the Coronation of King John, 27 May 1199. He was a benefactor, or confirmed previous gifts, to the abbeys of St. Mary's (York), St. Victor-en-Caux, West Dereham and Foucarmont, the priories of Lewes, Nostell, St. Katherine (Lincoln), Southwark, Thetford and Castle Acre, the Hospitallers, and the chapel of St. Philip and St. James in Conisborough Castle. He married, in 1164 (probably in April), Isabel, widow of William (OF BLOIS) 4th EARL OF SURREY, and only daughter and heir of William (DE WARENNE), 3rd EARL OF SURREY, all above-named. He died 7 May 1202 and was buried in the Chapter House at Lewes. Isabel survived him and made gifts for the soul of her late husband to the priory of St. Katherine, Lincoln, and to Lewes Priory. She was living in April 1203 but died probably soon afterwards, possibly 12 July 1203, and was buried in the Chapter House at Lewes (g). [Complete Peerage XII/1:499-500, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

(g) By her 2nd husband she had issue, a son William, 6th Earl, and 3 daughters: (1) Ela, who m. 1stly Robert de Newburn, of whom nothing is known, and 2ndly, William FitzWilliam of Sprotborough; (2) Isabel, who m. 1stly Robert de Lascy, and 2ndly Gilbert de Laigle, lord of Pevensey; (3) Maud, who m. 1stly Henry, Count of Eu and lord of Hastings, and 2ndly Henry d'Estouteville or de Stuteville, of Eckington, co. Derby, and Dedham, Essex, lord of Valmont and Rames in Normandy.

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Hameline Plantagenet, natural brother to King Henry II, likewise obtained, jure uxoris, the Earldom of Surrey, and assumed the surname and arms of de Warren. This nobleman bore one of the three swords at the second coronation of Richard I, and in the 6th of the same reign [1195], he was with that king in his army in Normandy. He d. 7 May, 1202, four years after the countess, having had issue, William, Adela, Maud, another dau. who m. Gilbert de Aquila, Isabel, and Margaret. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited, and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 569, Warren, Earls of Surrey]

Noted events in his life were:

• Title: Earl of Surrey, , , Surrey, England. 390,417,642,1804

Hamelin married Isabel De WARENNE 4th Countess Of Surrey 968,1441,1806 in April 1164 in 2ND Husband 389,390,1017,1441,1804.,1805 Isabel was born about 1137 in Lewes, Sussex, England,389,390,971 died on 12 July 1203 in Lewes, Sussex, England 389,390,1017 about age 66, and was buried in Chapter House, Lewes, Sussex, England.389,390 Another name for Isabel was 04th Countess Of SURREY Isabel De Warenne.

Marriage Notes: Isabel's marriage to Hammelin was her 2nd Marriage.
CHAN20 Mar 2001

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  William De WARENNE 6th Earl Of Surrey was born after 1165 in Lewes, Sussex, England,967 died on 27 May 1240 in London, Middlesex, England 966,968, and was buried in Lewes Priory, Sussex, England. Another name for William was 06th Earl Of SURREY William De Warenne.

4022194709      ii.  Ela Adela De WARENNE (born after 1164 in Surrey, England - died about 1220)

8044364143     iii.  Maud (Mahaut) Plantagenet De WARENNE (born about 1166 in Lewes, Sussex, England - died about 1212)

               iv.  Suzanne Plantagenet De WARENNE was born about 1168 in Surrey, England.662,1200,1206,1207


8044389419. Isabel De WARENNE 4th Countess Of Surrey,415,505,642,968,1441,1805,1806 daughter of William De WARENNE 3rd Earl Of Surrey and Ela De TALVAISE Countess Of Montreuil, was born about 1137 in Lewes, Sussex, England,389,390,971 died on 12 July 1203 in Lewes, Sussex, England 389,390,1017 about age 66, and was buried in Chapter House, Lewes, Sussex, England.389,390 Another name for Isabel was 04th Countess Of SURREY Isabel De Warenne.

General Notes:
He [William de Blois] married Isabel, only daughter and heir of William (DE WARENNE), 3rd EARL OF SURREY, by Ela. He died s.p. as above in October I 159 and was buried in the hospital of Montmorillon in Poitou. Isabel survived him and was sought in marriage by Henry Il's brother William, but Archbishop Beket opposed the match on the ground of consanguinity, and she married, 2ndly, the King's illegitimate half-brother, Hamelin. [Complete Peerage XII/1:497-9, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

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He [Hamelin Plantagenet] married, in 1164 (probably in April), Isabel, widow of William (OF BLOIS) 4th EARL OF SURREY, and only daughter and heir of William (DE WARENNE), 3rd EARL OF SURREY, all above-named. He died 7 May 1202 and was buried in the Chapter House at Lewes. Isabel survived him and made gifts for the soul of her late husband to the priory of St. Katherine, Lincoln, and to Lewes Priory. She was living in April 1203 but died probably soon afterwards, possibly 12 July 1203, and was buried in the Chapter House at Lewes (g). [Complete Peerage XII/1:499-500, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

(g) By her 2nd husband she had issue, a son William, 6th Earl, and 3 daughters: (1) Ela, who m. 1stly Robert de Newburn, of whom nothing is known, and 2ndly, William FitzWilliam of Sprotborough; (2) Isabel, who m. 1stly Robert de Lascy, and 2ndly Gilbert de Laigle, lord of Pevensey; (3) Maud, who m. 1stly Henry, Count of Eu and lord of Hastings, and 2ndly Henry d'Estouteville or de Stuteville, of Eckington, co. Derby, and Dedham, Essex, lord of Valmont and Rames in Normandy.

Noted events in her life were:

• Alt. Death: Alt. Death Lewes, Sussex, England, 13 July 1199. 971,1011

Isabel married in 1153 in 1st Husband 389,390,642,1805.,1807

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  Johannes HORNE was born about 1470.

Isabel married Hamelin PLANTAGENET 5th Earl Of Surrey 968,1442 in April 1164 in 2ND Husband 389,390,1017,1441,1804.,1805 Hamelin was born about 1130 in Normandy, France,389,390,1440 died on 7 May 1202 in Lewes, Sussex, England 389,390,1011,1441,1442 about age 72, and was buried on 7 May 1202 in Chapter House, Lewes, Sussex, England.389,390 Other names for Hamelin were 05th Earl Of SURREY Hamel Plantagenet, and Hamelin De WARENNE 5th Earl Of Surrey.1443

Isabel next married William De BLOIS 4th Earl Of Surrey,1808 son of Stephen I De Blois King Of ENGLAND and Matilda Countess Of BOULOGNE, in 1st Husband.1807 William was born between 1132 and 1137 in Blois, Loir-Et-Cher, Orleanais/Centre, France 1807 and died in October 1159 in Hospital Of Montmorillon, Poitou, France 1807 about age 26. Another name for William was 04th Earl Of SURREY William De Blois.


8044389421. Alice De UMFREVILLE Heir Of Great Babington,399,415,1809 daughter of Odinel II De UMFREVILLE Lord Of Prudhoe and Alice De LUCY, was born about 1161 in Prudhoe, Hexham, Northumberland, England 662,820 and died after 20 August 1253.

General Notes:
Dau. of Odinel II de Umphraville and Alice de Lucy; m. William II Bertram; mother of Roger II Bertram. [GRS 3.03, Automated Archives, CD#100]

b.c. 1161; dau. of Odinel Umfreville and Alice Lucy; m. William Bertram; m. Roger Fitzwalter. [WFT European Origins Ped 235]

Alice married about 1185 in Castle Mitford, Northumberland, England.820

The child from this marriage was:

4022194710       i.  Sir Roger II BERTRAM Baron Of Mitford (born in 1179 of Mitford, Northumberland, England - died before 24 May 1242)


8044389440. Roger De MOWBRAY Of Masham, Sir,415,1482,1810 son of Unknown and Unknown, was born in 1119 in Masham, Bedale, North Riding Yorkshire, England and died about 1188 in Palestine 1810 about age 69.

General Notes: Roger de Mowbray; helped defeat invading Scots at Battle of the Standard 1138; supported King Stephen in period of the Anarchy, fighting on his behalf at the Battle of Lincoln Feb 1140/1; joined Second Crusade 1147; rebelled against Henry II 1173 and allegedly escaped to Scotland following rebel's defeat, but submitted 1174; again went on Crusade 1186, captured by Saracens 1187 at the Battle of Hittin but ransomed; married Alice, daughter of Walter de Gant and widow of Ilbert de Lacy, and died 1188 in the Holy Land when on the point of returning to England. [Burke's Peerage]

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Roger de Mowbray, although not yet of age, was one of the chief commanders at the memorable battle fought, anno 1138, with the Scots, near Northallerton, known in history as the Battle of the Standard. Adhering to King Stephen in his contest with the empress, he was taken prisoner with that monarch at the battle of Lincoln. In 1148, he accompanied Lewis, King of France, to the Holy Land, and there acquired great renown by vanquishing a stout and hardy pagan in single combat. He was afterwards involved in the rebellion of Prince Henry against King Henry II and lost some of his castles. His grants to the church were munificent in the extreme, and his piety was so fervent that he again assumed the cross and made a second journey to the Holy Land where he was made prisoner but redeemed by the knight's Templars. He d., however, soon after in the East and was buried at Sures. Some authorities say that he returned to England and, living fifteen years longer, was buried in the abbey of Riland. He m. Alice de Gant, and was s. by his elder son, Nigil de Mowbray. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited, and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 386, Mowbray, Earls of Nottingham, Dukes of Norfolk, Earls-Marshal, Earls of Warren and Surrey]

Roger married Alice De GAND 1482,1810 after 1141 in 2ND Husband.1482 Alice was born about 1119 in Yorkshire, England and died after 1176. Another name for Alice was Alice De GAUNT.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194720       i.  Nele De MOWBRAY Of Thirsk, Sir (born in 1146 in Thirsk, North Riding Yorkshire, England - died in 1191 in Acre, Palestine)


8044389441. Alice De GAND 415,1482,1810 was born about 1119 in Yorkshire, England and died after 1176. Another name for Alice was Alice De GAUNT.

General Notes: Alice, daughter of Walter de Gant and widow of Ilbert de Lacy. [Burke's Peerage]

Alice married Ilbert De LACY,1482 son of Unknown and Unknown, in 1st Husband.1482 Ilbert was born about 1106 in Pontefract, West Riding Yorkshire, England and died in 1141 in (Dsp) about age 35.

Alice next married Roger De MOWBRAY Of Masham, Sir 1482,1810 after 1141 in 2ND Husband.1482 Roger was born in 1119 in Masham, Bedale, North Riding Yorkshire, England and died about 1188 in Palestine 1810 about age 69.

8044389442. William FITZPATRICK Of Banstead 415 was born in 1122 in Banstead, Surrey, England.

William married Eleanor De MANIERS. Eleanor was born in 1126.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194721       i.  Mabel FITZPATRICK (born in 1148 in Banstead, Surrey, England - died about 1203)


8044389443. Eleanor De MANIERS 415 was born in 1126.

Eleanor married William FITZPATRICK Of Banstead. William was born in 1122 in Banstead, Surrey, England.

8044389504. Akaris FITZBARDOLF Of Ravensworth 415,1811,1812 was born about 1080 in Ravensworth, Richmond, North Riding Yorkshire, England 1486 and died in 1161 about age 81. Another name for Akaris was Akaris Fitzbardolf Of RAVENSWORTH.

General Notes: Akaris Fitz-Bardolph, in the 5th of Stephen [1140], founded the Abbey of Fors, co. York, then called the Abbey of Charity and dying in 1161, was s. by his elder son, Hervey Fitz-Akaris. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, England, 1883, p. 207, FitzHugh, Barons FitzHugh]

Akaris married.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194752       i.  Hervey FITZAKARIS Of Ravensworth, Sir Knight (born about 1120 in Ravensworth, Richmond, North Riding Yorkshire, England - died in 1182)

               ii.  William BARDOLF Lord Of Bradewel was born about 1121 in Ravensworth, Richmond, North Riding Yorkshire, England and died after 1174 in Bradewel, Norfolk, England.

              iii.  Hugo (Hugh) BARDOLF Of Great Carlton was born about 1122 in Ravensworth, Richmond, North Riding Yorkshire, England and died after 1174 in Great Carlton, Louth, Lincolnshire, England.

               iv.  Bondo FITZAKARIS Of Dalton Travers was born about 1124 in Dalton Travers, Kirkby Hill, North Riding Yorkshire, England. Another name for Bondo was Bondo Fil AKARIS Of Dalton Travers.


8044389508. Walter Fitzivo Lord Of GREYSTOKE 415 was born about 1108 in Greystoke, Cumberland, England and died in 1162 in Grimsthorpe, Lincolnshire, England about age 54.

General Notes: Ivo was father of Walter; his son, Ranulf d. 12th King John, and was s. by his son William. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd, London, 1883, p. 254, Greystock, Barons Greystock]

Walter married Beatrice De FOLKETON. Beatrice was born about 1110 in Grimsthorpe, Lincolnshire, England.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Ralph De GREYSTOKE was born about 1132 in Greystoke, Cumberland, England and died before 1211. Another name for Ralph was Ranulph De GREYSTOKE.

4022194754      ii.  Randolf Fitzwalter Lord Of GREYSTOKE (born about 1145 in Greystoke, Cumberland, England - died about 1190)


8044389509. Beatrice De FOLKETON 415 was born about 1110 in Grimsthorpe, Lincolnshire, England.

Beatrice married Walter Fitzivo Lord Of GREYSTOKE. Walter was born about 1108 in Greystoke, Cumberland, England and died in 1162 in Grimsthorpe, Lincolnshire, England about age 54.

8044389512. Swain FITZDOLFIN 415 was born about 1105 in Yorkshire, England and died after 1140.

Swain married.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194756       i.  Thomas FITZSWAIN (born about 1135 in Staveley, Yorkshire, England - died before 1200)




8044389516. Robert De PERCY Lord Of Kildale 415,1490 was born about 1118 in Kildale, North Riding Yorkshire, England and died before 1170 in Ormesby, Guisborough, North Riding Yorkshire, England 1490.

General Notes: From: Gee Gee Hughes (G.G.Hughes@worldnet.att.net)
Subject: Percy
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
Date: 1999/03/16

Robert de PERCY d. bef. 1169/70 - custody of his heirs to Adam de BRUS (Pipe R. 16 Hen. II)

Robert married Agnes.1491 Agnes was born about 1120 in Yorkshire, England and died after 1160.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194758       i.  William De PERCY Lord Of Kildale (born about 1140 in Kildale, North Riding Yorkshire, England - died before 29 September 1204 in Ormesby, Guisborough, North Riding Yorkshire, England)


8044389517. Agnes 415,1491 was born about 1120 in Yorkshire, England and died after 1160.

Agnes married Robert De PERCY Lord Of Kildale.1490 Robert was born about 1118 in Kildale, North Riding Yorkshire, England and died before 1170 in Ormesby, Guisborough, North Riding Yorkshire, England 1490.

8044389518. Roger De FLAMVILLE 415,1813 was born about 1115 in Dalby, Yorkshire, England and died in 1169 in Thorpe Arche, Yorkshire, England 1813 about age 54.

Roger married Juetta De ARCHES 1814 in 1st Husband.1813 Juetta was born about 1137 in Scagglethorpe, Yorkshire, England and died in 1206 1814 about age 69.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194759       i.  Agnes De FLAMVILLE (born about 1153 in Dalby, Yorkshire, England - died after 1227)

               ii.  Maud De FLAMVILLE was born about 1155 in Thorpe Arche, Yorkshire, England and died after 1219 1815.


8044389519. Juetta De ARCHES,415,1814 daughter of William De ARCHES Lord Of Thorp Arches and Ivetta, was born about 1137 in Scagglethorpe, Yorkshire, England and died in 1206 1814 about age 69.

General Notes: Ancestral Roots has Juetta de Arches m. Adam I de Brus, but that has changed.

The following two posts to soc.genealogy.medieval indicate that the "accepted" order of wives for Adam I & II de Brus should actually be reversed:

From: Rosie Bevan (rbevan@paradise.net.nz)
Subject: Re: Domesday Descendants corrections: Harcourt & Brus
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
Date: 2002-06-05 18:38:09 PST

Hi Cris

As you have commented, K. Keats-Rohan in Domesday Descendants [p.354, 355] has listed Adam I de Brus of Skelton(d.1142) as married to Agnes of Aumale, and Adam II Brus (d.1196) as married to Juetta de Arches. This is in variance with Farrer's observations in vol. 3 of Early Yorkshire Charters in which the opposite placement is upheld. The situation is not helped by CP which claims [VII : 670] that Agnes of Aumale married William de Roumare and secondly Piers de Brus.

A study of the chronology tends to support K-R's findings.

-snip-

Juetta de Arches married Roger de Flamville (d.1169) who held the 7 Arches knights' fees in her right in 1166. [Charles Clay (ed.) 'Early Yorkshire Families', p.2]. She had children by de Flamville but the fees eventually descended to Peter de Brus II indicating that her Brus children were her eventual heirs, not the Flamville ones. Her children by Roger Flamville were in the custody of Adam II during their minority. Adam II is known to have had two children - Piers and Isabel who married Henry de Percy. In 1193 Juetta gave land in Askham to her daughter Isabel de Brus. The charter clearly says "Noveritis me concessisse et presenti carta confirmasse Isabelle de Brus filie mee et heredibus suis totam terram de Ascham..." Farrer uncharacteristically makes the error of assuming that Isabella was her granddaughter [EYC I ; no. 548, 549].

As Juetta died in 1206, she would have had to have been nearly 90 had she been mother of Adam II de Brus (b 1134). A not impossible achievement, but highly unlikely for the time and place.

Cheers

Rosie

----------------------------------------

From: Cristopher Nash (c@windsong.u-net.com)
Subject: Re: Domesday Descendants corrections: Harcourt & Brus
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
Date: 2002-06-08 04:13:25 PST

Now I can quickly summarize the argument of Ruth Blakely, 'The Bruses of Skelton and William of Aumale' in _Yorks Archeol Jnl_ (2001) 73:19-28, which appears to be the clincher leading Keats-Rohan in DD to reverse the traditional order of two early Brus marriages, giving (1) the wife of Adam I de Brus as Agnes d'Aumale and (2) the wife of Adam II de Brus as Juetta de Arches. Blaklely's article is devoted specifically to this double question.

On Juetta de Arches: The conventional account, Blakely says, derives from Dugdale in _Baronage of England_, in which he cites as evidence a papal mandate cited in _Mon. Ang._, where in fact Blakely finds that "It is not apparant from this record which of the two Adams is signified. Nor are they named in any of the other sources which Dugdale cites....His reasons for naming Adam I rather than Adam II as Juetta's husband are therefore obscure. Despite this ambiguity, the identification was accepted by William Farrer and subsequent writers, such as Wormald, Greenway and Clay, although some of them, like Dalton, have noted inconsistencies arising from it" [18-20].

Blakely's argument takes as its starting point an alternative account by William Brown, who -- giving Juetta as wife of Adam II -- in 1895 had cited records in the chartulary of Healaugh Park Priory. Here 2 grants appear, made by Adam II's son Peter de Brus I to the canons of the priory in the Arches fee. In one, Peter refers to his mother as 'Juetta', and in the other specifically as 'Juetta de Arches'. Blakely cites further evidence e.g. that Adam II's daughter, Isabella, is granted land from the Arches fee ca. 1192 by Juetta who calls her 'my daughter' [22-3]. Blakely then offers an ample and concerted explanation as to why, nevertheless, William, count of Aumale (eventually Earl of York per K. Stephen), and bro of Agnes d'Aumale, acquired custody of Adam II in the latter's minority (22-25). (Essentially he, as Adam II's maternal uncle, had immediate strong political reasons for seeking some control over the large Brus domain.) Blakely's conclusion is that Juetta de Arches, da. and ultimately sole heir of William de Arches and widow of Roger de Flamville and still living 1209, is certainly the wife of Adam II de Brus.

-snip-

An important aspect of Blakely's argument is that this reconstruction of the 4 marriages of Juetta and Agnes resolves a number of problems that have long dogged the Brus genealogy. A useful part of its development is a thoughtful assessment of the historical (inter-family political/economic) background to these events. Rosie, I think when your interloan copy gets to you you'll find that the article parallels a good part of your smart chronological case, and yours may in fact lend it further support.

Hope this quick sketch helps.

Cris

Juetta married Adam II De BRUS Lord Of Skelton,1816 son of Adam I De BRUS Lord Of Skelton and Agnes De AUMALE, after 1169 in 2ND Husband 2ND Wife.1813 Adam was born about 1134 in Skelton Castle, Yorkshire, England and died on 11 May 1196 in Skelton Castle, Yorkshire, England 1814 about age 62. Another name for Adam was Adam De BRUCE Lord Of Skelton.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Peter I De BRUS Baron Of Skelton was born about 1170 in Skelton Castle, Yorkshire, England and died from 12 February 1221 to 1222 in Danby In Cleveland, Yorkshire, England 1817 about age 51. Another name for Peter was Peter De BRUCE Baron Of Skelton.

               ii.  Isabel Le BRUS was born in 1172 in Skelton Castle, Yorkshire, England and died after 1230 1818.

Juetta next married Roger De FLAMVILLE 1813 in 1st Husband.1813 Roger was born about 1115 in Dalby, Yorkshire, England and died in 1169 in Thorpe Arche, Yorkshire, England 1813 about age 54.

8044389568. Ansketil De BULMER 415,1819 was born about 1092 in Bulmer, North Riding Yorkshire, England and died in 1129 about age 37.

Ansketil married Miss Du HUMEZ. Miss was born about 1092 in Lincolnshire, England.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Sibil BULMER was born about 1112 in Brancepeth, Durham, England.

4022194784      ii.  Stephen De BULMER Sheriff Of Northumberland (born about 1120 in Bulmer, North Riding Yorkshire, England - died about 1172 in Appletreewick, West Riding Yorkshire, England)


8044389569. Miss Du HUMEZ 415 was born about 1092 in Lincolnshire, England.

Miss married Ansketil De BULMER.1819 Ansketil was born about 1092 in Bulmer, North Riding Yorkshire, England and died in 1129 about age 37.

8044389570. Robert De MUSCHAMP 1st Of Wooler,415 son of Unknown and Unknown, was born about 1097 in Ilkeston, Derbyshire, England and died in Wooler, Northumberland, England.

Robert married.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194785       i.  Cecily De MUSCHAMP (born about 1128 in Wooler, Northumberland, England - died in 1180 in Bulmer, Yorkshire, England)

               ii.  Robert De MUSCHAMP 2nd Of Wooler was born about 1130 in Wooler, Northumberland, England.


8044389576. Ralph FITZWILLIAM 415,1820 was born about 1108 in Grimsby, Lincolnshire, England and died after 1145.

Ralph married.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194788       i.  William FITZRALPH (born about 1128 in Grimsby, Lincolnshire, England - died before 26 August 1218)

               ii.  Ralph FITZRALPH Lord Of Grimthorpe was born about 1145 in Grimthorpe, Pocklington, East Riding Yorkshire, England and died after 1 December 1189 1820.


8044389600. Hugh I Fitzeudes De MORWICK 415 was born about 1095 in West Chevington, Northumberland, England and died before 1135.

Hugh married.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194800       i.  Ernulf De MORWICK Sir (born about 1125 in West Chevington, Northumberland, England - died about 1177)


8044389604. William I BERTRAM Of Mitford, Sir 415,1809 was born about 1080 in Mitford Castle, Morpeth, Northumberland, England and died in 1150 about age 70.

General Notes: William Bertram, son of Richard Bertram by Sybella Mitford, his wife, founded, with the approbation of his wife and sons, the Augustinian Priory of Brinkburne, in Northumberland, m. Hawyse, dau. of Sir William Merley, of Morpeth, and left issue, Roger, Guy, William and Richard. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited, and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, 1883, p. 52, Bertram, Barons Bertram, of Mitford]

William married Hawise De MERLAY before 1134 in 2ND Wife?. Hawise was born about 1105 in Morpeth, Northumberland, England.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194802       i.  Richard I BERTRAM Of Bothal (born about 1135 in Mitford, Northumberland, England - died before 1177 in Bothal Demesne, Morpeth, Northumberland, England)

William next married Hawise De BALIOL Heiress Of Stainton.1809 Hawise was born about 1108 in Bywell, Hexham, Northumberland, England.

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  Roger I BERTRAM Of Mitford, Sir Knight was born about 1130 in Mitford Castle, Morpeth, Northumberland, England and died before 1177.


8044389605. Hawise De MERLAY,415 daughter of William De MERLAY Of Morpeth, Sir Knight and Unknown, was born about 1105 in Morpeth, Northumberland, England.

Hawise married William I BERTRAM Of Mitford, Sir 1809 before 1134 in 2ND Wife?. William was born about 1080 in Mitford Castle, Morpeth, Northumberland, England and died in 1150 about age 70.

8044389606. Simon GISULPH Of Bothal 415 was born about 1112 in Bothal Demesne, Morpeth, Northumberland, England.

Simon married.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194803       i.  Menebell GISULPH Heiress Of Bothal (born about 1130 in Bothal Demesne, Morpeth, Northumberland, England)


8044389608. Odinel I De UMFREVILLE Baron Of Prudhoe,415,1158 son of Robert II De UMFREVILLE Of Redesdale, Sir and Unknown, was born in 1094 in Forest & Vale, Redsedale, Northumberland, England and died in 1162 in Prudhoe, Hexham, Northumberland, England at age 68.

Odinel married.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194804       i.  Odinel II De UMFREVILLE Lord Of Prudhoe (born about 1125 in Prudhoe, Hexham, Northumberland, England - died in 1182 in Castle Prudhoe, Northumberland, England)


8044389610. Richard "The Loyal" De LUCY Justiciar-England,415,1054,1055 son of Adrian De LUCY and Aveline GOTH, was born about 1098 in Diss, Norfolk, England and died on 14 July 1179 in Chipping Ongar, Essex, England 1054 about age 81.

General Notes: Lieutenant of England - ruled in Henry II's absence.

--------------------

(b) The family appears to have taken its name from Luce, a commune in the department of Orne, about 6 kil. SE of Domfront, and in the bailiwick of Passeis. In the return of the Norman fees of 1172 there occurs the following: "De Passeis . . . Ricards de Lucceio j militem et sibi xvij milites" (H.F., vol xxiii, p. 697 e; so also in Red Book, Rolls Ser., vol ii, pl 639, but beginning "De Baillia de Basseis"). Luce lies geographically in Maine, and its real connection with Normandy dates from the occupation in 1092 of Domfront, the castle of Robert de Belleme, by Henry Beauclerc, the Count of the Cotentin. It seems probable that this particular connection between Henry I and the southern border of Normandy may have first brought the family to the King's notice, a view which is supported by the fact that in a charter for Seez Cathedral dated Feb 1131, Henry mentions a fief which he had bought from Richard de Lucy, and his mother Aveline. [Complete Peerage VIII:257 note (b)]

--------------------

The first mention of this family is in a render made by King Henry I of the lordship of Dice, in Norfolk (whether in requital of services, or as an inheritance, the record saith not) to Richard de Lucie, who was governor of Falais, in Normandy, temp. King Stephen, and defended that place with great valour when besieged by Geoffrey, Earl of Anjou, for which heroic conduct he had a grant of lands in the county of Essex with the services of divers persons, to hold by ten knights' fees. In the subsequent contest between Stephen and the Empress Maud, he remained steady in his allegiance to the former and obtained a victory of some importance near Wallingford Castle. Upon the adjustment of the dispute, the Tower of London and the castle of Winchester were, by the advice of the whole clergy, placed in the hands of this feudal lord, he binding himself by solemn oath and the hostage of his son to deliver them up on the death of King Stephen to King Henry, which, being eventually fulfilled, Richard de Lucy was constituted sheriff of Essex and Hertfordshire in the 2nd of Henry II, A.D. 1156, and in three years afterwards, being with the king in Normandy, he was despatched to England to procure the election of Thomas à Becket, then lord chancellor, to the archiepiscopal see of Canterbury, vacant by the death of Theobald, Abbot of Becco. Soon after that he was appointed to the high office of Justice of England. In the 12th of this reign [1166], upon the aid then assessed for marrying the king's dau., he certified his knights' fees (lying in the cos. of Kent, Suffolk, and Norfolk) de veteri feoffamento, to be in number seven, and that his ancestors performed the service of Castle Guard at Dover, for the same, as also that he held on knight's fee more, de nova feoffamento, in the co. Devon.

About this time Becket, having fled into Normandy from the power of King Henry, came to Wiceliac to celebrate the feast of the ascension, and observing several persons of distinction present, amongst whom was this Richard de Lucie, he ascended the pulpit and there, with lighted candles, pronounced the sentence of excommunication against them all as public incendiaries betwixt the king and himself, but being neither convicted nor called to answer, they appealed and entered the church. Soon after this (13th Henry II) during a temporary absence of the king beyond sea, de Lucie was constituted Lieutenant of England, and again in 1173, when the Earl of Leicester and others having reared the standard of rebellion in behalf of Prince Henry, he besieged, in conjunction with Reginald, Earl of Cornwall, the town of Leicester and, having reduced it, demolished its walls and laid it in ashes.

In 1178, he founded the priory of Westwode in the diocese of Rochester in honour of St. Thomas, of Canterbury, the martyr, and began, about the same time, the foundation of the priory of Lesnes, in Kent, which he munificently endowed. In this priory he subsequently assumed the habit of a canon regular and departing this life soon after (about 22nd Henry II) [1176], and was buried in the chapter-house there.

He m. Rohais ---, and had issue, Geffrey, who d. in his father's lifetime, leaving Richard, his son and heir, who departing this life, s. p., before 1196, the inheritance devolved upon his aunt, Rohais; Hubert, who had the lordship of Stanford, in Essex, and hundred of Angre, for his livelihood, but d. s. p.; Maude, m. 1st to Walter Fitz-Robert, to whom she brought the lordship or Dice, and 2ndly, to Richard de Ripariis, and d. 27th Henry III, 1243, leaving issue; Rohais, m. 1st, to Fulbert de Dover, Lord of Chilham, in Kent, and 2ndly, Richard de Chilham. This Rohais, upon the decease of her nephew, succeeded to the estates of her elder brother and, upon the death of her younger brother, Hubert, she had livery of the whole barony on paying a fine to the crown in the 9th King John [1208]. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage Ltd, London, England, 1883), pp. 335-6, Lucy, Barons Lucy]

Richard married Rohese Fitzrichard De CLARE.1054 Rohese was born in 1090 in Ely, Cambridgeshire, England and died in 1179 in Holy Trinity Church, London, England at age 89.

8044389611. Rohese Fitzrichard De CLARE,415,1054 daughter of Richard Fitzrichard De CLARE Abbot Of Ely and Unknown, was born in 1090 in Ely, Cambridgeshire, England and died in 1179 in Holy Trinity Church, London, England at age 89.

Rohese married Richard "The Loyal" De LUCY Justiciar-England 1054.,1055 Richard was born about 1098 in Diss, Norfolk, England and died on 14 July 1179 in Chipping Ongar, Essex, England 1054 about age 81.

8044389612. William II Baron De TORRINGTON Sir,415 son of William I Baron De TORRINGTON Sir and Unknown, was born about 1134 in Great Torrington, Devonshire, England and died after 1170.

William married.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194806       i.  Sir William III De TORRINGTON Baron De Torrington (born about 1152 in Great Torrington, Devonshire, England)

               ii.  Mabel De TORRINGTON was born about 1154 in Great Torrington, Devonshire, England.

              iii.  Matthew De TORRINGTON was born about 1155 in Great Torrington, Devonshire, England.


8044389696. Robert I Count Of DREUX,415,670,1246,1750,1821,1822 son of Louis VI "The Fat" King Of FRANCE and Adelaide Of SAVOY, was born about 1123 in Dreux, Eure-Et-Loire, Beauce/Centre, France,1821 died on 11 October 1188 in Braine, Aisne, Picardy, France 1821 about age 65, and was buried in St Ives, Braine, Aisne, Picardy, France.

Robert married Agnes De BAUDEMONT Dame De Braine 1823 in 1152 in 2ND Wife 1822.,1823 Agnes was born in 1130 in Braine, Aisne, Picardy, France and died on 24 July 1204 1821,1823 at age 74. Other names for Agnes were Agnes De Baudemont Dame De BRAINE, Agnes De VAUDEMONT Dame De Braine 1821., and1822

Children from this marriage were:

4022194848       i.  Robert II Count De Braine & DREUX (born about 1154 in Braine, Aisne, Picardy, France - died on 28 December 1218 in Dreux, Eure-Et-Loire, Beauce/Centre, France)

               ii.  Alix De DREUX was born about 1156 in Braine, Aisne, Picardy, France 1822 and died after 1217 1822.

Robert next married Hawise De EVREUX,1246,1750 daughter of Walter D'evereux SALISBURY Sheriff Of Wiltshire and Sibyl De CHAWORTH Countess Of Salisbury, in 1144 in 2ND Husband 2ND Wife 389,390,1246.,1750 Hawise was born in 1123 in Salisbury, Wiltshire, England 389,390 and died in 1152 in Braine, Aisne, Picardy, France 389,390 at age 29. Another name for Hawise was Harvoise D'evreux.

Noted events in her life were:

• Unknown: Countess of Dreux, , Dreux, Eure-Et-Loir, France. 390

• Unknown: Countess of Évreux, Évreux, Rouen, Seine-Et-Maritime, France. 390

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Adele De DREUX was born about 1144 in Braine, Aisne, Picardy, France 1824 and died in 1210 1824 about age 66.

               ii.  Alice (Adelheid) De DREUX was born in 1144 in Braine, Aisne, Picardy, France 668 and died in 1210 668 at age 66.


8044389697. Agnes De BAUDEMONT Dame De Braine,415,670,1823 daughter of Gui Seigneur De BAUDEMONT and Alix, was born in 1130 in Braine, Aisne, Picardy, France and died on 24 July 1204 1821,1823 at age 74. Other names for Agnes were Agnes De Baudemont Dame De BRAINE, Agnes De VAUDEMONT Dame De Braine 1821., and1822

Agnes married Robert I Count Of DREUX 1246,1750,1821,1822 in 1152 in 2ND Wife 1822.,1823 Robert was born about 1123 in Dreux, Eure-Et-Loire, Beauce/Centre, France,1821 died on 11 October 1188 in Braine, Aisne, Picardy, France 1821 about age 65, and was buried in St Ives, Braine, Aisne, Picardy, France.

8044389698. Raoul I Sire De Marle & De COUCY,415,670,1506,1822 son of Enguerrand II Sire De COUCY & Marle and Agnes De BEAUGENCY, was born in 1134 in Marle, Aisne, Picardy, France 1822 and died on 1 November 1191 in Seige Of Acre, Palestine 1506,1822 at age 57.

Raoul married Agnes Of HAINAULT 1506 before 1164 in 1st Wife. Agnes was born in 1141 in Mons, Hainault, Belgium and died in 1174 1506 at age 33.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Isabeau (Melisende) De COUCY was born about 1166 in Boves, Somme, Picardy, France and died after 1198.

4022194849      ii.  Yolande De COUCY (born about 1170 in Coucy, Aisne, Picardy, France - died on 18 March 1221-1222 in Braine, Aisne, Picardy, France)

Raoul next married Alix De DREUX,1822 daughter of Robert I Count Of DREUX and Agnes De BAUDEMONT Dame De Braine, after 1173 in 2ND Wife. Alix was born about 1156 in Braine, Aisne, Picardy, France 1822 and died after 1217 1822.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Enguerrand III Sire De Perche & De COUCY was born about 1175 in Marle, Aisne, Picardy, France and died in 1243 in Coucy, Aisne, Picardy, France 1822 about age 68.

               ii.  Thomas II De COUCY Seigneur De Vervins was born about 1185 in Coucy, Aisne, Picardy, France and died on 24 August 1253 in Vervins, Aisne, Picardy, France 1825 about age 68.


8044389699. Agnes Of HAINAULT,415,670,1506 daughter of Baudouin IV "Le Batisseur" Count Of HAINAULT and Alix (Adelaide\Ermensinde) De NAMUR, was born in 1141 in Mons, Hainault, Belgium and died in 1174 1506 at age 33.

Agnes married Raoul I Sire De Marle & De COUCY 1506,1822 before 1164 in 1st Wife. Raoul was born in 1134 in Marle, Aisne, Picardy, France 1822 and died on 1 November 1191 in Seige Of Acre, Palestine 1506,1822 at age 57.

8044389700. William Vicomte de THOUARS, son of Aimery VI Vicomte de THOUARS and Mathilde (Agnes) De POITOU, was born about 1125 in Thouars, Deux-Sevres, Anjou/Poitou-Charentes, France.

William married Aenor De LUSIGNAN 1511 about 1149. Aenor was born about 1125 in Lusignan, Vienne, Poitou, France.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194850       i.  Gui de THOUARS Count of Brittany (born about 1155 in Thouars, Deux-Sevres, Anjou/Poitou-Charentes, France - died in 1218 in Villeneuve, France)


8044389701. Aenor De LUSIGNAN,1511 daughter of Hugh VII "Le Brun" De LUSIGNAN and Sarazine (Saracena) Of ARMENIA, was born about 1125 in Lusignan, Vienne, Poitou, France.

Aenor married William Vicomte de THOUARS about 1149. William was born about 1125 in Thouars, Deux-Sevres, Anjou/Poitou-Charentes, France.

8044389702. Conan IV Duke Of BRITTANY Earl Of Richmond,415,505,1027,1639,1640 son of Alan "the Black" Duke of BRITTANY 1st Earl Of Richmond and Bertha Heiress of BRITTANY, was born about 1140 in Nantes, Bretagne, France and died from 20 February 1170 to 1171 in Richmond, North Riding Yorkshire, England 1639,1640 about age 30.

General Notes: Richmond, previous creations: Alan III, a Count of Brittany, whose uncle, another Alan, was probably a companion in arms of William I (The Conqueror) at Hastings and was granted vast land holdings in Yorkshire almost immediately after the Conquest, seems to have been recognized as Earl of Richmond by 1136. There is no record of his formal investiture with the dignity, however.

His title derived from Richmond Castle in North Yorkshire, which his uncle Alan had built not long before dying in 1089 and which remained the caput or administrative centre of the honor (agglomeration of knight's fees in a single unit under the feudal system). Richmond Castle was granted to the 1st Duke of Richmond of the present creation in August 1675, the same month he was first ennobled, but the medieval hono comprised lands throughout eastern England, not just in Yorkshire. Earl Alan sided with Stephen against the Empress Maud at the time of the Anarchyl. His son Conan IV held the Dukedom of Brittany (right to which he enjoyed through his mother, Alan's wife) as well as the Earldom of Richmond. [Burke's Peerage, p. 2402]

-----------------------------------

EARLDOM OF RICHMOND (II)

CONAN IV, DUKE OF BRITTANY and EARL OF RICHMOND, son and heir, succeeded his father in the Earldom of Richniond, being at that time under age. In 1156 he was in receipt of the third penny of the borough of Ipswich and two hundreds. In September 1156 he crossed to Brittany, besieged and took Rennes and put his stepfather Eudon to flight; shortly afterwards Eudon was taken prisoner by Ralf de Fougès and Conan was recognised as Duke of BrIttany. Between the latter part of 1156 and April 1158 he was in England, executing charters at Boston and Washingborough in Lincs, York and Richmond, and at Cheshunt in Herts, but on 22 April 1158 he was at Rennes, where he executed with the consent of his mother a charter for the abbey of St. Melaine. In July 1158 died Geoffrey, brother of King Henry II, who had the comté of Nantes, which Conan thereupon seized. The King ordered the honor of Richmond to be seized and crossed to France; Conan hastened to meet him at Avranches, where on 29 September he surrendered Nantes and made his peace. At some unascertained date after obtaining possession of the Duchy he disselsed his uncle Count Henry of Tréguier and Guingamp, which he retained till his death. He must have visited England in 1160, the year of his marriage to Margaret of Scotland. Thereafter he was probably for the most part in Brittany, executing a charter at Guingamp for Savigny on 12 March 1162 or 1163, and one at Quimper for the abbey of Ste. Croix of QuimperIé on 15 August 1162, and another for Savigny at Rennes on 2 February 1163. He was present at the Council of Clarendon in January 1164, about which time he executed at Wilton a charter for Le Mont St. Michel; this seems to be his last visit to England of which record exists. In the latter part of 1166, when Conan's only daughter and heir, Constance, was betrothed to Geoffrey, son of Henry II, he surrendered the Duchy of Brittany to the King, retaining only Guingamp and its dependencies. In the same year he executed at Rennes a charter for Savigny, and on 31 July he with the King was present at the translation of the body of the Breton saint Brieuc in the abbey church of SS. Sergius and Bacchus at Angers. He was again with the King at Angers on 24 March 1168, when he witnessed a royal charter. By a charter, of which the limits of date are 1167-1171, he gave land for the foundation of the abbey of St. Maurice de Carnoët.

He married, in 1160, Margaret of Scotland, sister of MALCOLM IV, King of Scofland, and daughter of Henry, EARL OF HUNTINGDON, by Ada or Adeline, daughter of William (DE WARENNE), EARL OF SURREY. He died 20 February 1171. His widow married, 2ndly, before Easter 1175, Humphrey DE BoHUN, Constable of England; she died in 1201, and was buried at Sawtrey Abbey, Hunts. [Complete Peerage X:791-3, XIV:545, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

Conan married Margaret De HUNTINGDON 531,1027,1332,1638,1639 in 1160 in 1st Husband 1638.,1639 Margaret was born in 1144 in Huntingdon, Huntingdonshire, England, died in 1201 in Richmond, North Riding Yorkshire, England 1638 at age 57, and was buried in Sawtrey Abbey, Huntingdonshire, England. Another name for Margaret was Margaret Of SCOTLAND.

8044389703. Margaret De HUNTINGDON,415,505,531,670,1027,1332,1638,1639 daughter of Henry Earl Of HUNTINGDON Prince Of Scotland and Ada De WARENNE, was born in 1144 in Huntingdon, Huntingdonshire, England, died in 1201 in Richmond, North Riding Yorkshire, England 1638 at age 57, and was buried in Sawtrey Abbey, Huntingdonshire, England. Another name for Margaret was Margaret Of SCOTLAND.

General Notes: He [Conan Duke of Brittany] married, in 1160, Margaret of Scotland, sister of MALCOLM IV, King of Scofland, and daughter of Henry, EARL OF HUNTINGDON, by Ada or Adeline, daughter of William (DE WARENNE), EARL OF SURREY. He died 20 February 1171. His widow married, 2ndly, before Easter 1175, Humphrey DE BOHUN, Constable of England; she died in 1201, and was buried at Sawtrey Abbey, Hunts. [Complete Peerage X:791-3, XIV:545, (transcribed by Dave Utzinger)]

--------------------------------

Margaret of Scotland, dau. of Henry, Earl of Huntingdon, sister of William, King of Scots, and widow of Conan le Petit, Earl of Brittany and Richmond. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, London, 1883, p. 57, Bohun, Earls of Hereford, Earls of Essex, Earls of Northampton, and High Constables of England]

Margaret married Conan IV Duke Of BRITTANY Earl Of Richmond 1027,1639,1640 in 1160 in 1st Husband 1638.,1639 Conan was born about 1140 in Nantes, Bretagne, France and died from 20 February 1170 to 1171 in Richmond, North Riding Yorkshire, England 1639,1640 about age 30.

Margaret next married Humphrey IV "The Young" De BOHUN 531,1332,1637,1638 before April 1175 in 2ND Husband.1638 Humphrey was born in 1143 in Trowbridge, Melksham, Wiltshire, England and died in 1182 1637 at age 39.

8044389714. William VIII Count Of POITOU X Duke D'aquitaine,415,670,1826,1827 son of William VII Count Of POITOU Ix Duke D'aquitaine and Philippa (Maud\Matilda) De TOULOUSE, was born in 1099 in Toulouse, Haute-Garonne, Midi-Pyrenees, France 1826 and died on 9 April 1137 in Santiago DE Compostela, Spain 1826 at age 38. Another name for William was William VIII Of Poitou X Duke Of AQUITAINE.

William married Eleanor De CHATELLERAULT 1827,1828 in 1121 in France.1827 Eleanor was born about 1105 in Chatellerault, Vienne, Poitou, France and died from after March 1130 to 1131 1827.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194857       i.  Eleanor Of AQUITAINE Duchess Of Aquitaine (born in 1121-1122 in Belin Castle, , Guinne, Bordeaux, Aquitaine, France - died on 31 March 1204 in Mirabell Castle, Fontevrault L'AB, Maine-Et-Loire, France)

               ii.  Petronella (Alix) De POITOU was born about 1125 in Poitiers, Vienne, Poitou, France 1829 and died after 24 October 1153 1829.

              iii.  Adelaide (Adele) D' AQUITAINE was born about 1133 in Chateau DE Belin-Beliet, Gironde, Aquitaine, France.


8044389715. Eleanor De CHATELLERAULT,415,670,1827,1828 daughter of Aimery (Almeric) I Vicomte De CHATELLERAULT and Dangereuse De L'isle BOUCHARD, was born about 1105 in Chatellerault, Vienne, Poitou, France and died from after March 1130 to 1131 1827.

Eleanor married William VIII Count Of POITOU X Duke D'aquitaine 1826,1827 in 1121 in France.1827 William was born in 1099 in Toulouse, Haute-Garonne, Midi-Pyrenees, France 1826 and died on 9 April 1137 in Santiago DE Compostela, Spain 1826 at age 38. Another name for William was William VIII Of Poitou X Duke Of AQUITAINE.

8044389716. Guillaume IV Taillefer Comte De ANGOULEME,415,670,1529,1830,1831 son of Wulgrim II Taillefer Comte De ANGOULEME and Ponce De MONTGOMERY, was born about 1120 in Angouleme, Charente, Poitou-Charentes, France and died on 7 August 1178 in Messina, Sicily, Italy 1529,1830 about age 58. Another name for Guillaume was William IV TAILLEFER Count Of Angouleme.

Guillaume married Emma De LIMOGES,1831 daughter of Adhemar (Aymar) III Vicomte De LIMOGES and Graule Taillefer De ANGOULEME, in 1st Wife.1831 Emma was born in 1124 in Limoges, Haute Vienne, Limousin, France.

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  Wulgrim III Taillefer Comte De ANGOULEME was born about 1152 in Angouleme, Charente, Poitou-Charentes, France 1832 and died before 29 June 1181 1832. Another name for Wulgrim was Vulgrin III TAILLEFER Count Of Angouleme.

Guillaume next married Marguerite De TURENNE 1529,1830 after 1150 in 3rd Husband 2ND Wife 1529.,1833 Marguerite was born about 1120 in Turenne, Correze, Limousin, France and died after 1201.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194858       i.  Aymer (Adhemar) Taillefer De ANGOULEME Count Angouleme (born about 1160 in Angouleme, Aquitaine, France - died in 1218 in Limoges, Haute-Vienne, Limousin, France)


8044389717. Marguerite De TURENNE,415,670,1529,1830 daughter of Raymond I Vicomte De TURENNE and Mathilde (Maud) Du PERCHE, was born about 1120 in Turenne, Correze, Limousin, France and died after 1201.

Marguerite married Adhemar (Aymar) IV Vicomte De LIMOGES 1833 in 1st Husband.1833 Adhemar was born about 1110 in Limoges, Haute Vienne, Limousin, France and died in 1148 1833 about age 38.

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  Adhemir (Aymar) V Vicomte De LIMOGES was born about 1135 in Limoges, Haute Vienne, Limousin, France and died before 1188.

Marguerite next married Ebles III Vicomte De VENTADOUR 1833 after 1148 in 2ND Husband - Divorced 1150.1833 Ebles was born about 1115 in Moustier Ventadour, Correze, Limousin, France and died in 1170 about age 55.

Marguerite next married Guillaume IV Taillefer Comte De ANGOULEME 1529,1830,1831 after 1150 in 3rd Husband 2ND Wife 1529.,1833 Guillaume was born about 1120 in Angouleme, Charente, Poitou-Charentes, France and died on 7 August 1178 in Messina, Sicily, Italy 1529,1830 about age 58. Another name for Guillaume was William IV TAILLEFER Count Of Angouleme.

8044389718. Peter I Comte De COURTENAY Prince Of France,415,670,1463,1834 son of Louis VI "The Fat" King Of FRANCE and Adelaide Of SAVOY, was born about 1125 in Paris, Seine, Ile-DE-France, France 1835 and died in 1183 in Palestine 1463 about age 58. Another name for Peter was Pierre I Count Of COURTENAY.

General Notes: Count of Montargis & Courtenay.

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Peter/Pierre de Courtenay (took his wife's name and the arms of Courtenay, viz. or three roundlets gules (to which his descendants sometimes added an escutcheon of France), and died 1183), 7th son of Louis VI of France. [Burke's Peerage]

Peter married Elizabeth De COURTENAY 1463,1834 in 1150.1463 Elizabeth was born about 1130 in Courtenay, Loiret, Gatinais/Centre, France and died on 14 September 1205 1463 about age 75.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Peter II Comte De COURTENAY Byzantine Emperor was born about 1155 in Courtenay, Gatinais, Isle-DE-France, France 1836 and died from before January 1217 to 1218 in Epirus, Byzantine Empire, Greece 1836. Another name for Peter was Pierre De Courtenay Emperor Of Byzantine EMPIRE.

               ii.  Eustachie De COURTENAY Dame Pacy-Sur-Armacon was born about 1162 in Pacy-Sur-Armacon, Yonne, Bourgogne, France 1837 and died after 1248 1837.

              iii.  Robert I De COURTENAY Sgr. De Champignelles was born about 1168 in Courtenay, Gatinais, Ile-DE-France, France 1838 and died in 1239 in Holy Lands 1838 about age 71.

4022194859      iv.  Alice De COURTENAY Countess Of Angouleme (born about 1170 in Courtenay, Gatinais, Isle-DE-France, France - died on 14 September 1205 in France)


8044389719. Elizabeth De COURTENAY,415,670,1463,1834 daughter of Renaud I Sire De COURTENAY Of Sutton and Hedwige Du DONJON, was born about 1130 in Courtenay, Loiret, Gatinais/Centre, France and died on 14 September 1205 1463 about age 75.

Elizabeth married Peter I Comte De COURTENAY Prince Of France 1463,1834 in 1150.1463 Peter was born about 1125 in Paris, Seine, Ile-DE-France, France 1835 and died in 1183 in Palestine 1463 about age 58. Another name for Peter was Pierre I Count Of COURTENAY.

8044389720. Alfonso II King Of ARAGON,415,670,1541,1839,1840 son of Ramon Berenguer IV Marquis Of BARCELONA and Petronila I Heiress Of ARAGON, was born on 4 April 1152 in Villa Mayor Del Valle, Barcelona, Spain 1839,1841 and died on 25 April 1196 in Perpignan, Roussillon, France 1839 at age 44.

General Notes:
Alfonso II (b. 1152, Barcelona--d. 1196, Perpignan, Roussillon), count of Barcelona from 1162 and king of Aragon from 1164.

The son of Ramón Berenguer IV, Alfonso succeeded his father as count of Barcelona and his mother as ruler of Aragon, thus associating the two countries under the house of Barcelona--a union that was destined to be permanent. Aragonese involvement in France became steadily greater during Alfonso's reign. Nevertheless, the conquest of Teruel (1171) opened the way for the conquest of Valencia; and, in 1179, the pact of Cazorla with his ally, Alfonso VIII of Castile, fixed the future zones of reconquest for the two countries. In his will Alfonso followed the Spanish custom of dividing his kingdom; Provence was thus lost to the Aragonese crown. [Encyclopaedia Britannica CD '97]

Noted events in his life were:

• Ruled: 1163-1196.

Alfonso married Sancha Of CASTILE 1541,1842 from 19 January 1174 to 1175 in Zaragoza, Spain.1841 Sancha was born on 21 September 1154 in Toledo, Castile, Spain and died on 9 November 1208 in Monasterio DE Jaen, Jaen, Spain 1841 at age 54.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Constance Princess Of ARAGON was born from 18 January 1174 to 1175 in Pamplona, Aragon, Spain and died on 23 June 1222 1843 at age 48.

               ii.  Pedro II King Of ARAGON was born in 1176 in Barcelona, Spain 1842 and died on 13 September 1213 in Slain At Battle Of Muret, Spain (Against Simon DE Montfort) 1842 at age 37.

4022194860     iii.  Alfonso Alfonsez Prince Aragon Count Of PROVENCE (born in 1177 in Barcelona, Spain - died in February 1208-1209 in Palermo, Sicily, Italy)


8044389721. Sancha Of CASTILE,415,670,1541,1842 daughter of Alfonso VII "The Emperor" King Of Leon & CASTILE and Richilde Of POLAND, was born on 21 September 1154 in Toledo, Castile, Spain and died on 9 November 1208 in Monasterio DE Jaen, Jaen, Spain 1841 at age 54.

Sancha married Alfonso II King Of ARAGON 1541,1839,1840 from 19 January 1174 to 1175 in Zaragoza, Spain.1841 Alfonso was born on 4 April 1152 in Villa Mayor Del Valle, Barcelona, Spain 1839,1841 and died on 25 April 1196 in Perpignan, Roussillon, France 1839 at age 44.

8044389722. Rainou De SABRAN Count Of Provence,415,670,1541 son of Rostaign IV Comte De SABRAN and Rose Du CAILAR, was born in 1155 in Sabran, Gard, Languedoc France 1844 and died in 1224 1844 at age 69.

Rainou married Gersende De FORCALQUIER 1541 in 1178 in 1st Wife.1541 Gersende was born about 1160 in Forcalquier, Alpes-DE-Haute-Provence, Provence, France 1844 and died about 1194 1844 about age 34.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194861       i.  Gersenda De SABRAN Countess Forcalquier (born about 1180 in Forcalquier, Alpes-DE-Haute-Provence, Provence, France - died in 1223 in (As A Nun))

               ii.  Beatrix De SABRAN was born about 1188 in Sabran, Gard, Languedoc France and died in 1215 about age 27.

              iii.  Guillaume III De SABRAN was born about 1190 in Sabran, Gard, Languedoc, France.


8044389723. Gersende De FORCALQUIER,415,670,1541 daughter of Guillaume VI Comte De FORCALQUIER and Adelaide TRENCAVEL, was born about 1160 in Forcalquier, Alpes-DE-Haute-Provence, Provence, France 1844 and died about 1194 1844 about age 34.

Gersende married Rainou De SABRAN Count Of Provence 1541 in 1178 in 1st Wife.1541 Rainou was born in 1155 in Sabran, Gard, Languedoc France 1844 and died in 1224 1844 at age 69.

8044389724. Humbert III "Le Saint" Comte De SAVOY,415,670,1845 son of Amadeo III Comte De SAVOY and Mathilda D' ALBON, was born on 1 August 1136 in Maurienne, Savoie, Rhone-Alpes, France 1845 and died from 4 March 1188 to 1189 in France 1845 at age 51.

Humbert married Faydiva 1845 on 3 January 1150-1151 in 1st Wife.1845 Faydiva was born about 1136 in France and died before 1155.

Humbert next married Gertrude Of FLANDERS,1845 daughter of Thierry III Of LORRAINE Count Of Flanders and Sibilla De ANJOU Duchess Of Normandy, in 1155 in 2ND Wife - Divorced Bef. 1162.1845 Gertrude was born about 1140 in Alsace & Lorraine, France.

Humbert next married Klementia Von ZAHRINGEN,1845 daughter of Unknown and Clemence De NAMUR, in 1164 in 3rd Wife.1845 Klementia was born about 1140 in Zahringen, Germany and died before 1175.

The child from this marriage was:

                i.  Sofie De SAVOY was born about 1165 in Savoy, France and died on 3 December 1202 1846 about age 37.

Humbert next married Beatrice De MACON 1847 in 1175 in 4th Wife.1845 Beatrice was born about 1161 in Macon, Saone-Et-Loire, Bourgogne, France and died before 8 April 1230 1847. Another name for Beatrice was Beatrix D'ivrea De VIENNE.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194862       i.  Thomas (Tomaso) I Count Of SAVOY (born on 20 March 1176-1177 in Carbonierres, Savoy, France - died on 1 March 1232-1233 in Aoste, Isere, France)


8044389725. Beatrice De MACON,415,670,1847 daughter of Gerard I D' IVREA Comte De Macon & Vienne and Guyonne (Guigonne\Maurette) De SALINS, was born about 1161 in Macon, Saone-Et-Loire, Bourgogne, France and died before 8 April 1230 1847. Another name for Beatrice was Beatrix D'ivrea De VIENNE.

Noted events in her life were:

• Alt. Death: Alt. Death, 1184.

Beatrice married Humbert III "Le Saint" Comte De SAVOY 1845 in 1175 in 4th Wife.1845 Humbert was born on 1 August 1136 in Maurienne, Savoie, Rhone-Alpes, France 1845 and died from 4 March 1188 to 1189 in France 1845 at age 51.

8044389726. William I Count Of GENEVA,415,670,1848,1849,1850,1851 son of Amadeus I (Amadeo) Count Of GENEVA and Matilda De CUISEAUX, was born in 1130 in Genf, Geneva, Helvetiz, Switzerland 1848,1850,1851 and died on 25 July 1195 1848,1850,1851 at age 65.

General Notes: William I of Geneva, b. 1130, d. 27 Jul 1195, Count of Geneva, 1178-1195; m. ca. 1165, perhaps (but doubtful) Beatrix de Faucigny, daughter of Aimon I of Faucigny and of Clementia. [Ancestral Roots, line 133-25]

Noted events in his life were:

• Alt. Death: Alt. Death, 1226. 1849

William married Beatrix (Marguerite) De FAUCIGNY 1848,1850,1852 about 1165 1848.,1851 Beatrix was born about 1150 in Faucigny, Haute-Savoie, Rhone-Alpes, France and died about 1180 about age 30.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194863       i.  Beatrix Marguerite Nicole GENEVA (born in 1180 in Genf, Geneva, Helvetiz, Switzerland - died on 8 April 1257 in Pierre-Chatel, Isere, France)


8044389727. Beatrix (Marguerite) De FAUCIGNY,415,670,1848,1850,1852 daughter of Aimon I Comte De FAUCIGNY and Clementia (Clemence) De BERANCON, was born about 1150 in Faucigny, Haute-Savoie, Rhone-Alpes, France and died about 1180 about age 30.

General Notes: Turton names Beatrix "de Valperge" and has her daughter of Guy de Valperge & Beatrice de Visconti, quite a different ancestry. Ancestral Roots has questions about its identification of Beatrix de Faucigny. I see most people on soc.genealogy.medieval having Beatrix de Faucigny, but a few have Beatrix de Valperge. Nobody knows for sure. I am following AR on this one.

Noted events in her life were:

• Alt. Death: Alt. Death, Abt 1179. 1852

Beatrix married William I Count Of GENEVA 1848,1849,1850,1851 about 1165 1848.,1851 William was born in 1130 in Genf, Geneva, Helvetiz, Switzerland 1848,1850,1851 and died on 25 July 1195 1848,1850,1851 at age 65.

8044389888. Robert III De STUTEVILLE Of Cottingham, Sir,412,415,505,583,1586,1853 son of Robert II De STUTEVILLE Of Normandy and Erneberga FITZBALDRIC, was born about 1105 in Cottingham, East Riding Yorkshire, England and died in 1183 in Cowsby, Thirsk, North Riding Yorkshire, England 412,583 about age 78.

General Notes: The following is excerpted from a post to SGM, 7 Sep 2002, by Rosie Bevan:

From: "Rosie Bevan" (rbevan@paradise.net.nz)
Subject: Stuteville of Cottingham
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
Date: 2002-09-07 03:43:36 PST

3. ROBERT III de Stuteville of Cottingham, Kettleby Thorpe, Yorks. and Bigby, Lincs. In 1138 he fought at the Battle of the Standard. Instigated claims to recover property confiscated from his grandfather in 1147 and was granted 10 knights' fees by Nigel de Mowbray which included the manor of Kirkby Moorside and land in Warwickshire shortly after 1154. Supervisor of the works of Bamburgh castle in 1166 and sheriff of Yorkshire from Easter 1170 to Michaelmas 1175. Benefactor to the abbeys of St Mary's York, Byland, Rievaulx and Meaux and the priory of Durham. A charter of confirmation to Rievaulx abbey c.1160-1183 for the health of his soul and the souls of Robert de Stuteville his grandfather, Robert his father, Erneburga his mother and Helewise his wife, and with the consent of his son William, presents the Stuteville family over four generations. ["Robertus de Stutevilla.sciatis me dedissee et confirmasse Deo et Ecclesiae S. Mariae Rievallis, pro salute animae meae, et Roberti de Stutevilla, avi mei, et Roberti, patris m mei, et Erneburge, matris meae, et Helewisae uxoris meae, . in perpetuam elemosinam, concessu Willelmi filii mei, et aliorum filiorum meorum, totam terram de Houetona." J.C.Atkinson (ed.), 'Rievaulx Cartulary', p.80]. He married, before 1145, Helewise whose parentage is not known and they founded Keldholm priory, a Benedictine nunnery. As 'domina Helewis uxor Roberti de Stuteuilla' with Osmund 'filius ejus' she witnessed a charter of William de Vescy to the brethren of Farne Island in about 1183. Robert had an interest in Cowesby as shown by a charter of notification dated around 1164-74, by Roger archbishop of York of the settlement of the controversy between Hugh bishop of Durham and Robert de Stuteville relating to the chapel of Cowesby. The dispute continued, however, after his death under the aegis of his son Osmund. Robert died in 1183.

Issue:
- William son and heir, the king's justice. Married Berta possibly granddaughter (as she appears younger than the 4 daughters and outlived them) of Ranulf de Glanville. [The Durham Liber Vitae lists "Rannulfus de Glanvile et uxor ejus Berta, Matillis, Amabilis, Helewisa, Mabilia filae eorum, et Berct"]. On the death of her son Berta's property fell to Ranulf son of Robert of Middleham, Thomas de Arderne and Hugh de Auberville who each had a third of her lands in Bramham and Leyburn. All three were sons and representatives of the daughters of Ranulph de Glanville. Hugh d.1203, leaving son and heir Robert IV who died s.p.under age in 1205. William also had an illegitimate daughter.
- Nicholas of Liddel, Cumberland. Succeeded his nephew, Robert IV in 1205. See below.
- Osmund of Cowesby, Yorks. and Gressenhall, Norfolk.
- Eustace of Brinklow, Warwickshire d.1218. His son and heir was Robert who was brought up overseas.
- Robert of Great Ayton and Hemlington, Yorks.
- Burga. Married to William de Vescy and had Langton as her maritagium, living as a widow in 1185.
- Helewise. Married (1) William II de Lancaster, lord of Kendal d.1184 by whom she had Helewise (2) Hugh de Moreville of Burgh, Cumberland d. 1202 by whom she had Ada and Joan (3) William son of Ranulf, lord of Greystoke d.1209 by whom she had Thomas. In 1209 Robert de Vipont owed 500 marks for and 5 palfreys for the custody of the land and heirs of William and the marriage of his widow. Helewise died after 1228.
[Sources: Keats-Rohan, 'Domesday Descendants'. p.724 ; Clay, 'Early Yorkshire Charters' v.8, p.5-15, 90, 95 ; Sanders, 'English Baronies: a study of their origin and descent 1086-1327', p.37]

----------------------------

From Robert were descended the territorial lords of Cottingham, whose male line terminated in the 17th of Henry III [1233]. [John Burke & John Bernard Burke, Extinct and Dormant Baronetcies of England, Ireland, and Scotland, Second Edition, Scott, Webster, & Geary, London, 1841, p. 486, Skipwith, of Newbold Hall]

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The family of Skipwith, originally written Schypwyc, denominated from a town and lordship so called in the East Riding of York, descends from Robert de Estoteville, Baron of Cottingham, in the time of the Conqueror, of whom and his descendants, the feudal lords of Cottingham, Dugdale treats at great length in the Baronage. [John Burke & John Bernard Burke, Extinct and Dormant Baronetcies of England, Ireland, and Scotland, Second Edition, Scott, Webster, & Geary, London, 1841, p. 486, Skipwith, of Newbold Hall]

Note: The above source has Patrick de Skipwith descending from Robert's father (also Robert). Burke's Peerage indicates that Patrick was a younger son of this Robert.

Robert married Hawise (Helewise) MURDAC 583,1586,1853 before 1145.583 Hawise was born about 1122 in Lazenby, Cumberland, England and died after 1183 583.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  William De STUTEVILLE Lord Of Cottingham was born about 1140 in Cottingham, East Riding Yorkshire, England and died in 1203 1854 about age 63.

               ii.  Nicholas De STUTEVILLE Lord Of Liddel was born about 1142 in Cottingham, East Riding Yorkshire, England 583 and died before 30 March 1218 in Liddel Castle, Newcastleton, Liddesdale, Scotland 583.

4022194944     iii.  Patrick De STUTEVILLE Lord Of Skipwith (born about 1100 of Estuteville-Ecales, Normandy, France - died after 1166 of Skipwich, Lincolnshire, England)

               iv.  Osmund De STUTEVILLE Of Cowesby was born before 1145 in Weston, Colville, Suffolk, England 1854 and died in August 1192 in Joppa, Palestine (On Crusade) 1854.

                v.  Burga De STUTEVILLE was born about 1146 in Cottingham, East Riding Yorkshire, England, died after 1185 in Knaresborough Castle, Yorkshire, England 1853, and was buried in Alnwick Abbey, Northumberland, England.

               vi.  Helwise (Helewise\Heloise) De STUTEVILLE was born about 1156 in Lazenby, Cumberland, England and died after 1228 583. Another name for Helwise was Hawise De STUTEVILLE.1142


8044389889. Hawise (Helewise) MURDAC,415,505,583,1586,1853 daughter of Brother Of Geoffrey MURDAC Of Lazenby and Unknown, was born about 1122 in Lazenby, Cumberland, England and died after 1183 583.

Hawise married Robert III De STUTEVILLE Of Cottingham, Sir 412,583,1586,1853 before 1145.583 Robert was born about 1105 in Cottingham, East Riding Yorkshire, England and died in 1183 in Cowsby, Thirsk, North Riding Yorkshire, England 412,583 about age 78.


8044389890. Sir Pagan De LANGTON Sir Knight 412,415,1855 was born about 1112 in Langton, Malton, East Riding Yorkshire, England.

Pagan married.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194945       i.  Beatrix De LANGTON (born about 1104 in Lincolnshire, England)


8044389940. Miles De Venoix Le MARSHAL,415,1557,1856 son of Ibert De Venoix Le MARSHAL and Unknown, was born about 1020 in Venoix Near Caen, Calvados, Normandy, France and died before 1070 1557,1856. Another name for Miles was Miles "The Marshal" De VENOIX.

General Notes: Miles the Marshal, and his wife Lesceline, in or after 1059, sold to the Countess Maud (the Conqueror's wife) for her foundation of the Abbey of the Holy Trinity at Caen, whatever they held in the vill of Vaucelles -- now a suburb of Caen -- and in the church and the mill there, for four score pounds. Miles and Leseline gave land at Caen, Vaucelles and Venoix in marriage with their daughter Beatrice to a certain Arfast. Miles sold to Lanfranc, abbot of St. Stephen's, Caen (1066-1070), the land occupied by the channel of the Odon, from the point at which it left the old channel, with both banks, but he died before Lanfranc left Caen for Canterbury in 1070. [Complete Peerage XI:Appendix E:122-3]

Miles married Lesceline.1856 Lesceline was born about 1022 in France.

Children from this marriage were:

                i.  Ralf Seigneur De VENOIX was born about 1040 in Venoix Near Caen, Calvados, Normandy, France.

4022194970      ii.  Geoffry Gosfried Le Mareschal De VENUZ Baron (born about 1054 in Venoix, Near Caen, Calvados, Normandy - died in 1086 in Caen, Normandy, France)


8044389941. Lesceline 415,1856 was born about 1022 in France.

Lesceline married Miles De Venoix Le MARSHAL 1557.,1856 Miles was born about 1020 in Venoix Near Caen, Calvados, Normandy, France and died before 1070 1557,1856. Another name for Miles was Miles "The Marshal" De VENOIX.

8044389944. Walter Le EWRUS Of Rosmar (Roumare),415,1857,1858 son of William Comte D' EVREUX and Unknown, was born in 1033 in Rosmar (Roumare), Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France 1858 and died in Salsibury, Wiltshire, England. Other names for Walter were Walter Comte D' EVREUX, and Walter De SALISBURY.1859

General Notes: Walter, according to CP, is a ficticious person, said to be Count of Evreux, based on a misinterpretation of "l'heureux" meaning "the lucky", also said to be "Earl of Rosmare" which is a misspelling of Roumare in Normandy. First of all the Normans had Counts, not Earls, and also the fiefdom of Roumare had no Count. I include this line only because it is included in some old genealogy lines.

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Todd Farmerie, in his only comment on the Brian Walls pedigree for the Devereux family, stated that Edward Salisbury's father was Walter de Salisbury (not Walter le Ewrus, Earl of Rosmar), and that some well meaning genealogist decided Walter was of Evreux (ie. d'Evreux). This is probably true. However some of the later descendants of this pedigree (at least by the time of John 1st Baron Devereux of Lyonshall, d. 22 Feb 1392/3), according to reliable sources such as CP, BP, AR, etc., were known as "Devereux" (an obvious derivitive name of "d'Evreux"). Of course they may not be descendants of Walter of Salisbury (maybe of some other Walter who was associated with Evreux) or the "well meaning genealogist" was not a modern person, but someone of the 13th or 14th century, when the people known as "Devereux" existed.

I maybe should separate Walter de Salisbury from Walter le Ewrus, Earl of Rosmar, as Walter de Salisbury is a "proven" father of Edward, while the existence of Walter le Ewrus is in doubt. Although CP, in its description, above, of Walter who was not from "Evreux", but from Roumare, gives him some substance.

The name Walter de Salisbury (father of Edward of Salisbury) sounds Norman, but there were Normans in England before the conquest.

Walter married Philippa. Philippa was born about 1038 in France.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194972       i.  Edward D'EVEREUX Sheriff Of Wiltshire (born about 1060 in Salisbury, Wiltshire, England - died in 1119-1130 in England)

               ii.  Robert De EBROICIS Of Hereford was born after 1066 in Hereford, Herefordshire, England.1858 Another name for Robert was Robert DEVEREUX Of Hereford.

              iii.  Miss D' EVREUX was born about 1068 in Rosmar, Normandy, France.


8044389945. Philippa 415 was born about 1038 in France.

Philippa married Walter Le EWRUS Of Rosmar (Roumare) 1857.,1858 Walter was born in 1033 in Rosmar (Roumare), Seine-Inferieure, Normandy, France 1858 and died in Salsibury, Wiltshire, England. Other names for Walter were Walter Comte D' EVREUX, and Walter De SALISBURY.1859

8044389946. Ralph FITZHUBERT Of Crick,415 son of Hubert De CORCUN and Unknown, was born about 1045 in Crick, Monmouthshire, Wales.

Ralph married.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194973       i.  Matilda FITZHUBERT (born in 1070 in Salisbury, Wiltshire, England - died of Salisbury, Wiltshire, England)


8044389948. Hugh CHAWORTH,415 son of Ernald De CHAWORTH and Unknown, was born in 1025 in St Symphoro, Le Mans, Maine, France.

Hugh married in 1051.

The child from this marriage was:

4022194974       i.  Patrick II De CHAWORTH Sr. (born about 1052 in Chaworth, Nottinghamshire, England - died in 1120-1128 of Toddington, Bedfordshire, England)


8044389950. Ernulf (Arnulf) Seigneur De HESDIN,415,1247,1255 son of Gerard Seigneur De HESDIN and Unknown, was born about 1038 in Hesdin, Artois/Pas-DE-Calais, France and died after 1091 in Toddingham, Bedfordshire, England. Another name for Ernulf was Ernulf (Arnulf) Seigneur De HESDING.

General Notes: Arnulf or Ernulf, Seigneur of Hesdin, Picardy, a large land-holder in England 1086. [Burke's Peerage]

Ernulf married Emmelina De NORMANDY about 1060. Emmelina was born about 1040 in Normandy, France.

Children from this marriage were:

4022194975       i.  Maud (Matilda) De HESDIN (born about 1065 in Toddingham, Bedfordshire, England - died after 1133)

               ii.  Aveline De HESDIN was born about 1076 in Hesdin, Artois/Pas-DE-Calais, France and died in 1126 about age 50. Another name for Aveline was Aveline De HESDING.


8044389951. Emmelina De NORMANDY 415 was born about 1040 in Normandy, France.

Emmelina married Ernulf (Arnulf) Seigneur De HESDIN 1247,1255 about 1060. Ernulf was born about 1038 in Hesdin, Artois/Pas-DE-Calais, France and died after 1091 in Toddingham, Bedfordshire, England. Another name for Ernulf was Ernulf (Arnulf) Seigneur De HESDING. picture


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